Standard, Stupid, or player dependent?

[Huh]

Eight handed aggressive home pink game (7.50/15.00 with two/three chip blinds).

I open raise in middle position with AQ. The button calls. The blinds fold. 16 magical pink dollars in the pot. (40USD)

The flop is three cards. I think one had paint, yeah, must’ve been a Jack. No draws. I bet, and am called. 22 magical pink dollars in the pot. (55USD)

The turn pairs one of the smaller cards, and probably puts up a flush draw. Dont really remember. I throw six chips at the problem and get called. 34 magical pink dollars in the pot. (85USD)

River is another blank. I check, and my opponent tosses in six chips. So the pot now has 40 magical pink dollars. (100USD)

I call, and my opponent turbo-mucks. I try to drag the pot without showing my cards, but get IWTSTH’ed, by a player not in the hand. I’m a little bitter, but it’s offset by the 46 magical pink dollars (115USD) I am stacking.

I know it’s gimmicky, but I’m always amazed at how much action these one-denomination chip games incur. I’ve never seen a bad pink game, and the $6-$12 (played with $2 chips), and $9-$18 (played with $3 chips), at Lucky Chances were phenomenal (translation, I lost a bunch of money /images/graemlins/grin.gif).

Anyhow, comments on all streets greatly appreciated. I figured pre-flop and flop are very standard. I can’t see shutting down on the turn. So I guess my real question is about river-play. Anyone lead into the river here? I can’t imagine worse hands calling or better hands folding.

-Huh

[Vehn]

[ QUOTE ]
I know it’s gimmicky, but I’m always amazed at how much action these one-denomination chip games incur. I’ve never seen a bad pink game, and the $6-$12 (played with $2 chips), and $9-$18 (played with $3 chips), at Lucky Chances were phenomenal (translation, I lost a bunch of money ).

[/ QUOTE ]

How many pink games have you seen? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

I'm no expert by any means but as far as I know the only non one-denomination chip games are the 6/12 at the Mirage and the 8/16 at the Bellagio. Up here our 6/12 and 8/16 games are played with $2 chips. If you meant non-actual-dollar bill-amount games I don't think there's any correlation.

As far as the hand, my answer is "meh".

[Huh]

I guess my point about the chip denoms was more about games loosening about when the chip denominations make it a 3 chip, 6 chip game (as the $2.50 chip is to the pink, the $2 is to the $6-$12, and the $3.00 is to the $9-$18.)

So...what does "meh" mean?

-Huh

[Yeknom58]

I guess you "KNEW" he was on a bluff because you called down with Ace high. I really don't think this is a standard play. I think you got pretty lucky to take this hand down. I think a more likly outcome would be your opponent showing down something like 10Js. It seems like value bets on the river need to be made in this home game because people will call down with Ace high.

I say bet the river, you raised Pre-flop, lead the betting, mattering on your opponents he might laydown top pair/soso kicker.

[Vehn]

"Meh" means this is a situation what has come up for you in your poker career a zillion times before, will come up a zillion times after, and you need to Play Good Poker(tm) and decide whether or not your opponent is bluffing enough of the time to make your river call profitable. As for the turn play, the only time I will not bet the turn is if I am against a strong player, as I would expect to be raised 100% of the time as strong players don't call on the flop and fold or call on the turn in situations like this. But then again strong players don't coldcall preflop.

Hence you understand the dilemma.

Betting the river is Dumb unless your image is so good (bad?) that people will call you with worse ace highs.

Meh.

[Yeknom58]

Mattering on what the final board isn't this a good time to bluff on the river?

[Huh]

Of course I didn't "KNOW" that he was on a bluff, or I would have value check-raised on the off-chance the he might bluff three-bet /images/graemlins/tongue.gif. I also think you have to call this a lot...In fact, much more than half the time. It really sucks too, becuase as much as 5/6 times you will question your call, be shown some pathetic piece of the board, or some tiny pocket pair and think "How could I make this call, what could I beat". But that 1/6 of the time, you get to go "Hell yeah! I knew I was good.". Okay, maybe that's a bit dramatic, but I don't think there are a lot of players who are capable of value betting under pairs/crap piece of the board, and at the same time aren't capable of taking a shot at this one in six or seven times.

-Huh

[elysium]

hi huh
this is an interesting situation. what has happened is that on the river, the board + action = you have the lead but must bet to fold AK and AQ. it's an intuitive thingie huh. there's no real info out there about exactly this without tripping over the word bluff in one way or the other, or the word value bet one way or the other. but that's not quite right. the problem is that in the case of a bluff or value bet mentality on the river, you must factor in opponent knowledge and image. but doggonit huh, that's not right. why is it wrong to consider opponent knowledge or your image or even the table image in this spot? i don't know why huh. all i know is that the river is a MUST bet. under every circumstance under the sun, YOU MUST BET the river here, every time. YOU MUST BET. and no, you're not bluffing.

[anatta]

This is pretty standard for me with AK and AQ when out of position. I bet the flop and the turn. On the river, I check my unimproved hand, and I call with my big ace if my opponent bets. There are exceptions, obviously if your opponent never bluffs a missed draw then you should fold to the river bet. If there are no logical draws on the board, you should probably fold on the end. Vehn makes a great point, beware when good players just call your flop bet.

I disagree with Ely here. Although certainly possible, it is not so likely your opponent has AK or AQ when you have these hands, especially given no 3 bet pre-flop. His most likely hand is one pair, and he is calling you down hoping you have AK. He called the turn and will call on the end, but may not bet if you check, giving you a free showdown. Even though you are probably beat, generally the pot size makes it worth calling if a draw didn't get there. By checking and calling on the end, you gain an extra bet by inducing the bluff.