cliffs notes for 2+2 books

[crockpot]

i think it could be a profitable venture for someone to condense 2+2's books into cliffs notes form, keeping only the most important concepts without the examples, and sell them for a discounted price, maybe $8 apiece.

the difference between these and the crappy poker books available for $5 would be that this is proven winning information without the 10% of incorrect advice that can be dangerous for your game.

i figure 2+2 doesn't want to undertake this venture themselves, so as not to jeopardize their reputation as the leading authority in poker literature by releasing inferior versions of their own classics. but could anyone see this happening at some point?

(if you haven't noticed from my posts, i'm a guy who doesn't want to spend his life sitting in an office, so i think up one get-rich quick scheme after another. i should change my handle to Cosmo Kramer if it's still available.)

[John Feeney]

With regard to 2+2, it's hard to predict what such "Cliff's Notes" would do to the company's overall sales. I do think the notes themselves would sell.

It would be important to ensure that no significant areas of content were left out. For instance, someone might be crazy enough to think that in my book the discussion of "A Poker Player in Therapy" could be skipped. This of course would be a big mistake. (And I'm serious.) I'm sure you agree. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Zele]

I don't mean to "blow sunshine up your a**", John; but that essay alone makes ITPM worth the price.

[crockpot]

try not to take anything i say too personally. i know it's important to stay in emotional control during the game, and i think your book is very useful. who knows, maybe once my friend returns it to me i'll reread it and upgrade the rating as i incorporate more of your ideas into my game.

maybe the solution is to add a section of reviews on my site that dog all the terrible poker books i've read, so the 2+2 staff will feel better by comparison. unfortunately i don't have the money to buy the complete works of ken warren or andy nelson right now, and i doubt their publishers would give me free copies just so i can trash them.

[Terry]

I'd rather pay more for a book with even more examples. Why skimp on something that more than pays for itself every time ya play.

[crockpot]

i know, i realize serious poker players would never resort to cliffs notes books.

this was mainly brought on by my get-rich-quick nature, but also because many of my friends that i'm trying to get into poker find 2+2 inaccessible and prefer reading *loud groan* the likes of phil hellmuth.

perhaps 2+2 just needs to write some of their beginner-oriented books in a more anecdotal nature, like some of the sections in ITPM and Poker Essays. or just sign on some tournament 'expert' who can't write worth a damn and roll in the cash they collect.

[John Feeney]

Heh, fair enough. Actually, you're not the first reviewer to, uhm, question the value of that essay. But I've heard from others with Zele's reaction to it too. One of these days I will find a way to please everyone. There's got to be a way! /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[John Feeney]

[John Cole]

Cosmo Kramer would have an office for the express purpose of sitting around thinking up get rich quick ideas.

John

[Mason Malmuth]

HI CS:

Actually we already do this for some of the books. It appears in the form of "Questions and Answers" in the last section.

Best wishes,
Mason

[crockpot]

[ QUOTE ]
Cosmo Kramer would have an office for the express purpose of sitting around thinking up get rich quick ideas.


[/ QUOTE ]

where do you think i'm sitting right now?

hmm, an office for get rich quick ideas...that could be worth something!

[crockpot]

yes, and they are useful, but the buyer still has to shell out $25-30 for the book that contains them.

i suppose many cliffs notes are as expensive as the books they summarize. oh well.

[Mason Malmuth]

Hi CS:

The books that we put out are certainly worth far more than the $25 to $30 that is their retail list provided that you study them diligently. If you're having trouble with the price, you may also be having problems with committing your chips to the pot.

Best wishes,
Mason

[Byrn]

The books that we put out are certainly worth far more than the $25 to $30 that is their retail list provided that you study them diligently.

This statement is so true. Any educational/improvement material can be viewed that way, but with 2+2 books the theoretical value added from study can be viewed in concrete terms ("I have made $xxxx playing holdem since reading HFAP", and so on).

I don't necessarily agree with your price v. putting chips in the pot argument though. It is more a matter of perspective, most "regular job" working people look at a $30 book like it is X hours of work, or the price of a nice dinner, etc. Instead, the proper way to look at it would be "I am investing $30 into educating myself. If I apply myself to the material, I am turning this $30 into thousands."

When I look at it that way, even a marginally helpful poker book worth the price. To me, the 2+2 library is worth many multiples of what I have paid for it. Of course, if HFAP had been priced at $300, I probably would never have bought it. Even though it has provided a return greater than that to me, the initial outlay may have stopped me.

I have friends (more recent WPT fans/new players) who will pay $55 to play a tournament once or twice a month, but won't take my advice to take half of that and buy HFAP. To them it costs too much! All I can do is shake my head and be glad I have Christmas presents figured out this year!

[crockpot]

hey Mason,

trust me, your books (and Sklansky's and Zee's and Dr. Feeney's) are the reason i'm a consistent winning player today. after reading a bit of each in the bookstore i had no trouble laying out the money to buy them.

you just have to understand, i can't ever stomach the thought of office work, and playing only poker for a living is too monotonous for me, so i just try to think of ideas that can potentially make me a million dollars whenever i can.