Killer Internet Poker?

[Nottom]

Noticed this book at B.A.M. the other day and hadn't heard anything about it. Anyone have anything to say about it?

[asdf1234]

Just ordered it, I think it was only like ten bucks. I'll let you know after I read it.

[crockpot]

i haven't read this yet, but i read Vorhaus's other killer poker book, and i can basically summarize it for you like this: the bad poker player who calls a bet always loses to a made hand, and the killer poker player who raises always convinces a better hand to fold and a worse hand to call.

assuming you've read the better known poker works, there is no useful information about playing the game in that book.

in other words, Vorhaus tends to include a small cache of actual poker advice and focus more on instilling aggression and confidence in the reader. if you really need to work on those, his writing may help you. otherwise, avoid him.

[Nottom]

I have the orginal book, so I'm aware of the fact that its not really full of great poker playing advice. I just thought it was interesting since his original book is basically all about table image and not tilting and other more psychological things that he would have an internet book since one can argue that internet poker is much more about playing with good fundamentals.

[Jim Easton]

It is nothing spectacular. I liked Killer Poker (I responded to Mason's review).

Killer Poker Online has some interesting thoughts on "keeping book" on your opponents, but many of those ideas are handled MUCH more easily with PokerTracker or PokerStat.

He says you should NOT play more than one table at a time.

If you really like to read (I do - I have at least 40 poker books - including virtually every 2+2 offering) then it is worthwhile.

[Graham]

[ QUOTE ]
He says you should NOT play more than one table at a time.

[/ QUOTE ]


..And he's trying to pass himself off as an internet poker player who's qualified to write a book about it .. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif?.. What a joke!

Ask any at least semi-serious player whether their earn is better with one table or multiple.

[crockpot]

did you happen upon my review of the book when you were digging this up? it's clearly written for a rank amateur to the online game. for someone who has never played online the book is not terrible as it teaches them some good discipline, but it is of little or no use to experienced players.

[tboneman]

I bought the book from Amazon.com to put me over the amount needed for free shipping, not thinking much about the possible value of the read. Ive never read his other material so I had nothing to base an opinion of him with.
I can only say this. If you have the chance, GET this book and READ it. It doesnt tell you anything at all about how to play "this certain hand" against "that certain hand". It rather deals with the possible distractions and bad habits one can fall into with internet play, and how to avoid them. Also, how to adjust your "head" for internet play from B&M play, and some of the pluses and minuses of each.
When he talks about "keeping book" on apponents, he goes into detail about what he keeps track of, and even mentions something about someone observing a game and not playing, just so they can jot down tells about future apponents. In other words, he elaberates on what he is telling the reader and why it is to his/her benefit. All of this with a very pleasent sense of humor, I might add.
As far as his advice to play only one table, I can only give my own personel experience. I play small stakes no limit hold em. Before reading his book Id play two tables at a time, sometimes with good results, sometimes not so good. Right after I read the part about one table at a time, I thought Id give it a chance, knowing how important it is to have a good read on your apponents in this kind of game. Just so happened there was a very arrogant player trying to run the table against two other passive players, and me, at a short handed table. I watched this guy use a few aggressive tactics over, and over again, accumulating over 100 bucks on a 25 dollar buy in table. He is constantly chiding the other two players for their week play and poor decisions as if he is some sort of gift to the poker world, and all I want to do is bury this guy.Im managing to hold my own and bide my time, knowing that this guy is showing a pattern of over aggresivness that I can take advantage of in the right situation, should that situation come along. Sure enough, after about 45 minutes I get a hand that Im able to go all in with against him, by milking him into it, and double up. This DOES NOT sit well with him, and the very next hand Im dealt ace queen, and the flop comes queen X X, I had raised pre flop, he had called, so now I bet the pot on the flop and he raises. I call. Turn is a rag, I bet about 5, he raises to 10 and says "take that, you chicken", I called, river is another rag, he goes all in, for about the 50th time that session, so i figure against this guy I might just have this hand, and call. His hand turns over to reveal queen king. The money slides to my pile, and the now broke apponent leaves the table without uttering another word. Profit on those two hands: 125.00. Cost of book:12.95. Amount of credit given to info from that book: 100%. Every day since then, Ive stayed on one table concentrating mostly on the bigger stacks at the table and just about every day Ive been able to crack one of those stacks with info I pick up about how they are playing NOW. Not just what they might have played like in the past, or what poker tracker or something says they are like. Poker tracker cant tell if/when they go on tilt because of a bad beat, and neither can I, IF Im at another table during the showdown of that hand. Heck, sometimes I dont even get to see my OWN showdown because the screen shifts back to the other table when the next hand is dealt. I know some have screen splitters and all that neat techno stuff, but Id still have trouble focusing on the other table if Ive got a "hot and heavy" hand going on the first one. If most of my earnings are going to come from my opponents mistakes, Id like to see when they are most apt to MAKE those mistakes /images/graemlins/grin.gif Anyway, my earnings have both gone up by 2 and 1/2 times, and stabelized dramatically because of this. There vwery well could be much more talented players who can handle more than one table, but I found out th Im not one of them, and I dont mind admitting it.
Bottom line here is get the book and get your own benefits from it if you do a lot of online playing.

[squiffy]

Tbone,
This was a very important point you raised. Let's say, you can make money at $1-2 poker playing an A level game, a B level game, and a C level game. And let's say the better your game, the more money you make per hour, say $10 per hour for A, $5 per hour for B, and $1 per hour for C.

If you play multiple tables, you may very well win more money. But the quality of your play may deteriorate. You may not notice this because you are still making money. But your per hour earnings may drop.

For example. If the A player plays two tables he may make $6 per hour times two or $16 per hour. So he can make more per hour, even if the quality of his play goes down.

More important, if he is not paying close attention to his opponents' hands, then he may not be learning as much and he may not be improving his poker as much. So it may be harder for him to move up to $5-$10, than the one-table player.

This assumes two players of equal intelligence, ability, and time spent playing poker.

Let's say this. There are a lot of variables. So playing 2 tables at once may actually improve your play, because you will gain more experience faster, and you will rarely make mistakes or play badly, due to the second table, because you will rarely have to play two hands simultaneously.

How many tables you can handle also depends on how quickly your mind works, how good your computer is, and how effectively you can handle your mouse.

But in general, the more tables you play, the less judgment you can exercise and the less you will be paying attention to your opponents' play. Take this to an extreme. One table may be too slow and boring and 100 tables would probably be too much.

So IN THEORY. I think the author is correct. A beginner with poor computer skills and weak poker skills should start with 1 table. And someone playing very high limit hold em for $500-$1000 per hand, should probably play no more than one table, to maximize the quality of his play. Also at a super high limit against super talented opposition, he might lose money with mechanical play.

But an experienced poker player who has memorized his basic starting requirements from each position and who can mechanically play certain hands, can certainly profitably handle say 2-3 tables. He may not be maximizing his income per table, but he may be maximizing his income per hour.

And he may be playing a bit more mechanically and learning a bit less about each opponent. But if his goal is to maximize short term profit, possibly at the expense of pure long-term poker learning, then that is a perfectly reasonable choice.

I think the author could have given more sophisticated advice on this point. Though I would agree that in theory, if you want to do the best possible job at any activity, and maximize your learning or understanding of that activity, you should focus exclusively on that one activity, and not play multiple games, watch tv, etc.

Again, the reduction in quality of play may be barely noticeable. Once out of 3000 hands, I clicked on the wrong button while playing 3 tables. I clicked on bet because I held a good hand, but the screen immediately changed to a second table, where I held 2,3 offsuit and the computer bet that hand, which I would certainly have folded.

So out of 3000 hands, I am consciously aware of one $1 mistake at a 1-2 table. There are probably other problems I encountered, but don't even know about, when I was rushing to play multiple hands at the same time.

Again, not everyone can play 3 tables and make a profit. And someone who cannot even play one table and make a profit, may need to slow down, think about every hand, and consult books before and after playing.

[crockpot]

http://www.cardplayer.com/?sec=afeature&art_id=13522