davidross
07-28-2003, 05:33 PM
Well the winning streak has reached 20 days. That’s 20 consecutive days playing 3 3/6 tables at Party without a losing day. I have had some losing sessions, but by the end of the day I have been up every time. Did I mention this has lasted 20 days? Did I mention I love these games?
I started with a great day on Sunday. For the first time since I discovered how to find my stats, I won 10% of my hands for an entire session and it showed in my biggest 1 day win at 3/6, $628. Monday however was a different story. 7% wins only, in both the afternoon and evening sessions. I lost $100 in the afternoon but managed to win $138 in th evening for a $38 win. And yesterday I had my first truly horrible session, down $400 at one point and pretty sure the streak was over. I had a lot of tables fold and at one point I had played on 7 different tables and lost on all of them. Then I went on a rush and finished the afternoon down only $180. In the first 35 hands of the evening session I won 9 of them, 5 in a row on one table and suddenly I was up for the day again. A very solid evening left me up $331 for the day.
So that’s close to $1,000 for the first 3 days of the week. I’m beating these games for a phenomenal amount right now in BB’s per hour. Beyond all expectations. I thought these games would give me a more stable earning with less risk of big losses. Obviously it’s too soon to tell what the long term expectation will be, but it raises some interesting questions. How much is it worth to play against weaker players? I guess If I played long enough to get win rates per hour at both 3/6 and 5/10 I could solve it mathematically, but there are intangibles too. With my bankroll a little bit low right now and a vacation coming up it’s worth a lot to me not to fear a huge short term loss. The 3rd table is what makes the 3/6 games a better proposition for me right now, and I don’t feel comfortable playing 3 5/10 games yet. The 3/6 games are much less complicated than the 5/10 games. The Multi-way pots make it much less likely that I’m being played at and decision making is easier. Someone suggested 2 3/6 tables and one 5/10 table, but for right now I don’t want to change anything.
An interesting development in the job hunt. My Brother in law e-mailed me a job he found on Monster.com (A big job search website) for a customer service rep, for a company selling on-line gaming software. I suspect the position is junior to my experience, but they are looking for exactly the skills I have so I sent off an application. Maybe I could get the software developers to put in some extra coding that gives any user with the name davidross an extra few AA hands.
The biggest challenge in these 3/6 games, as far as I’m concerned is determining when to value bet the river. I guess I should re-phrase that, since it’s probably the most important part of any game, but the decisions are certainly different in 3/6. There is no such thing as a brick on the river. I 3 bet pre-flop with KK last night, and got cold called on my left. I bet every street and the final board was Q J 8 5 3. I got raised on the river and called. He showed me J 3. Suited he pointed out when someone (not me) questioned his starting standards. Add to that the fact that I have been bluff raised more on the river in the last 3 weeks than in the previous year at Paradise and you can’t fold if raised on the river. So they love to bluff, they love to slowplay, they play any 2 cards and some of them play very passively. I’ve seen AA call every street (pre-flop too) and just showdown. It is a challenge deciding what to do on the river, and there is certainly no formula you can follow. Mostly I just bet and pray.
I mentioned in a post last week that I am still paying off too often when it’s clear I am beat. I see bad players do this all the time and I think it’s the last major gap I need to fill in my game. I need to acquire the discipline to fold top pair or even an overpair when it becomes clear you are beat. It’s so easy to see when you’re not in the hand, but for some reason when it’s me that it’s happening to, I take it personally and seem to say, “I used to have the best hand, and I don’t deserve to lose this hand, and I’m not folding”. Sounds pretty stupid when I phrase it like that. Maybe thinking about it that way will help. Of course it’s much easier to do when you’re winning.
You’re going to love this one. I was at a table that broke suddenly. That seems to happen a lot at Party. A great reluctance to play shorthanded. 2 seats will open up, and within 2 hands everyone else sits out or leaves. Anyway, I was playing my hands on the other tables when my table popped up with just 2 of us playing. I was the BB/Button and had K4. He was the SB and had called the bet. I typed a message to him saying “last hand, let’s just check it down” and I called. He didn’t answer and the flop came K T 7. He checked so I figured he agreed and I checked too. Turn was a 4 and now he bet!! The stinker, wanted my 3 bucks that bad. So of course I raised. River was a Q and he bet again. I raised again and he called. HH showed him with Q9. I felt pretty good after that one.
One last comment. Similar to what I found at Paradise, the afternoon games seem tighter and tougher than the evening games. I want to play more in the daytime, but I’m making all my money at night. Oh well, we go where the money is.
I was in the middle of my $400 loss yesterday afternoon when I got this hand. 2 limpers to me in MP and I raise with KK. 2 cold callers and the BB too. 6 of us see the flop.
Flop 6s 8s 9h.
Not exactly what I wanted to see. 2 checks and a bet on my right. That’s what I wanted. Now I raise to clear them all out. Ha. One of them folded. 5 to the turn. I’ll put the bettor on a 9, someone on Spades and someone with a 7. Not very many good cards for me.
Turn [6s 8s 9h] Th
That can’t be good. Checked to me. I checked. I was tired of doing all the betting and just getting raised. It gets checked around.
River [6s 8s 9h Th] 8h
Checked around again and I’m good. T3, A9 (the flop bettor), Qs 5s, Ks 2s were the other hands. This is an example of how hard it is to read hands in these games, and as much as I wish I had bet (I probably missed 6 BB’s on this hand, that’s ½ an hour of work for me…lol just kidding) I think if I played that hand against 4 players 100 times, I would lose more than I won.
Friday
I’m making a midweek entry here because we’re going away for the weekend to my Aunt’s cottage. I will have access to play in the evenings, but no access to my notes so I thought I’d make a short entry now. I knew this day was coming but it hurts just the same. The streak has ended after 21 days. And in a brutal fashion. Wednesday saw a big afternoon win of $400 and an evening loss of $160 leaving me $240 to the good, and Thursday had a nice $240 win in the afternoon. But Thursday evening might have been the most unusual night I’ve ever had. Ultimately I dropped $430 for the evening leaving me $190 down for the day. I got as good a run of starting hands as I can ever remember. 900 hands I got AA 6 times, KK 6 times and big Aces over and over again. I seemed to hit every flop, and I lost, and I lost and I lost. This hand was from early in th evening and I think it was a harbinger of things to come.
I got AA in MP and there was 1 limper in front of me. I raised, got 1 cold caller in the cut off, both blinds called and the limper called. Flop is A J J. Now the only question was how to make the most out of this one. SB bet, and the EP called. I smooth called, certain I would be bet into on the turn. Just 3 of us to the turn. Turn brought the 3rd J. SB checked, EP bet, and now I think he’s got an A or a J. If he’s got the J I’m screwed, and if he’s got the A I’d like to keep the SB in for another bet. So I just call. SB raises. Anyone got the balls to lay down AA here? I didn’t. SO we both called. River was a 2 and we both called again. He had it of course, KJ, and the SB had A3.
So I’m up $1,070 for the 5 days, slightly ahead of the $200/day goal, but facing a limited number of hours for Saturday. I need a good day today.
I played some 5/10 last night after yet another couple of big hands got cracked by crazy chases. IN my first 2 orbits I got AA, KK, JJ and AK 3 times. And I ended up even. That’s when I went to bed. The 5/10 game in the early morning seemed pretty good. I got lots of action on those big hands. I’ll have to look into playing there some more.
I’m playing JJ and TT differently than I used to. If I’m first in I’ll raise them, but otherwise I’m playing them like middle pairs. There are so many 4 way pots that I hate getting into with those hands, so I’m limping behind limpers and playing for a set. Even if I’m an overpair to the flop, naked K’s and A’s play to the river making it improbable that they hold up.
The other thing I’ve noticed is how often the blinds raise in these games. Sometimes they’re legit, but usually thet’re not. They are just hurting themselves, but they are hurting some of the hands I like to limp in LP with too. I’m thinking of dropping the K9o and Q9o that I would normally play from the button for 1 bet once I notice one of these guys in my BB. I’m wondering what hands I could add though, if any?
In this hand I have KQ in late MP. 1 limper in front of me and I limp too. Button calls and SB raises (another blind raise) . BB folds and 4 see the flop for 2 bets.
Flop Qh 9h Ad
Yikes. SB bets out and EP limper calls. EP would raise with an A here so now I have to decide if BB has me beat. I raise. Button cold calls, and the other two call. I’m actually most worried about the button now. He would play a weak A like this. Or a flush draw.
Turn [Qh 9h Ad] Ac
BB bets out. EP folds and it’s on me. The 2nd A makes it less likely he has one, but if he does I’m now drawing dead, and the button is still to act behind me. The brave play I guess is to raise and fold to a re-raise, but I chickened out and folded. That turn bet is nearly always a strong hand. Heads up I call him down I think. Button just called. Now I’m not so sure he’s got a weak A.
River [Qh 9h Ad Ac] 3d. SB bets out and the button raises. Phew I think. SB calls. SB had 77, and wins when Button shows KT. Aaack.
Again this is the offshoot of my not taking to many chances in these games. But it still hurts to get outplayed like that.
Just back from the cottage and it’s Monday afternoon. Quick Poker update. Friday was another tough day. After the $400 loss of Thursday night, I picked right up where I left off and dropped another $200 in a short session Friday afternoon. My daughter was working at a camp and needed a ride home. Normally I would have sent my wife to get her, but I was running so bad I decided to take a break. I think I need to do more of that when I’m running bad rather than pushing to get even. As much as I think I’m still playing my best, I’m probably not. I made the same suggestion to SoBeDude last night when he was running awful. I couldn’t get back to even though on Friday night. In fact I started out dropping another $250, making a $850 slide since Wednesday at dinner time. I did make a comeback and got back to be down only $189 for Friday before I was through. Saturday we headed up to the cottage and I played a 4 hour session after everyone had gone to bed. Got back on track with a $180 win. That means a win of $1,020 for the week. Seems terrible after the 2 prior weeks, but not the end of the world.
Obviously Tells aren’t as reliable online as they are live, but there are tells in online poker. The long pause before betting on the river almost always is a big made hand. He wants you to think he’s thinking, but it’s almost always followed by a bet. The guy that raises pre-flop then checks the flop heads up, almost always has flopped a set. The masochist in me paid off on Saturday on one of these even though I was 90% positive what had happened. I raised first in from LP with AKo. I was 3 bet from the SB and we saw the flop heads up. Flop was K J x. He checked. The alarm bells started ringing in my head. I was almost positive he had JJ. I checked too. I probably should have bet and checked the turn. He bet the turn and river and I called both . He had JJ. The other tell is the change in cadence. Quite often heads up you feel a rhythm to the betting. Flop bet, turn bet, river..pause. That usually means he’s not comfortable with his hand. Some of these I have found extremely reliable.
I have found the games a little tougher this week. A lot more 2+2’ers at the table. I don’t jump around like I used to at Paradise because there is no indicator to tell me which tables are loosest. I do have a few preferred opponents that make the games good all by themselves, so I can look for them. One of the problems is it can be a lot of fun playing at a table with a lot of 2+2’ers. Good conversation and challenging play. I have to remind myself I’m trying to make a living. I certainly have my big days when I’m surrounded by bad players, not 2+2’ers. More on that next week.
I started with a great day on Sunday. For the first time since I discovered how to find my stats, I won 10% of my hands for an entire session and it showed in my biggest 1 day win at 3/6, $628. Monday however was a different story. 7% wins only, in both the afternoon and evening sessions. I lost $100 in the afternoon but managed to win $138 in th evening for a $38 win. And yesterday I had my first truly horrible session, down $400 at one point and pretty sure the streak was over. I had a lot of tables fold and at one point I had played on 7 different tables and lost on all of them. Then I went on a rush and finished the afternoon down only $180. In the first 35 hands of the evening session I won 9 of them, 5 in a row on one table and suddenly I was up for the day again. A very solid evening left me up $331 for the day.
So that’s close to $1,000 for the first 3 days of the week. I’m beating these games for a phenomenal amount right now in BB’s per hour. Beyond all expectations. I thought these games would give me a more stable earning with less risk of big losses. Obviously it’s too soon to tell what the long term expectation will be, but it raises some interesting questions. How much is it worth to play against weaker players? I guess If I played long enough to get win rates per hour at both 3/6 and 5/10 I could solve it mathematically, but there are intangibles too. With my bankroll a little bit low right now and a vacation coming up it’s worth a lot to me not to fear a huge short term loss. The 3rd table is what makes the 3/6 games a better proposition for me right now, and I don’t feel comfortable playing 3 5/10 games yet. The 3/6 games are much less complicated than the 5/10 games. The Multi-way pots make it much less likely that I’m being played at and decision making is easier. Someone suggested 2 3/6 tables and one 5/10 table, but for right now I don’t want to change anything.
An interesting development in the job hunt. My Brother in law e-mailed me a job he found on Monster.com (A big job search website) for a customer service rep, for a company selling on-line gaming software. I suspect the position is junior to my experience, but they are looking for exactly the skills I have so I sent off an application. Maybe I could get the software developers to put in some extra coding that gives any user with the name davidross an extra few AA hands.
The biggest challenge in these 3/6 games, as far as I’m concerned is determining when to value bet the river. I guess I should re-phrase that, since it’s probably the most important part of any game, but the decisions are certainly different in 3/6. There is no such thing as a brick on the river. I 3 bet pre-flop with KK last night, and got cold called on my left. I bet every street and the final board was Q J 8 5 3. I got raised on the river and called. He showed me J 3. Suited he pointed out when someone (not me) questioned his starting standards. Add to that the fact that I have been bluff raised more on the river in the last 3 weeks than in the previous year at Paradise and you can’t fold if raised on the river. So they love to bluff, they love to slowplay, they play any 2 cards and some of them play very passively. I’ve seen AA call every street (pre-flop too) and just showdown. It is a challenge deciding what to do on the river, and there is certainly no formula you can follow. Mostly I just bet and pray.
I mentioned in a post last week that I am still paying off too often when it’s clear I am beat. I see bad players do this all the time and I think it’s the last major gap I need to fill in my game. I need to acquire the discipline to fold top pair or even an overpair when it becomes clear you are beat. It’s so easy to see when you’re not in the hand, but for some reason when it’s me that it’s happening to, I take it personally and seem to say, “I used to have the best hand, and I don’t deserve to lose this hand, and I’m not folding”. Sounds pretty stupid when I phrase it like that. Maybe thinking about it that way will help. Of course it’s much easier to do when you’re winning.
You’re going to love this one. I was at a table that broke suddenly. That seems to happen a lot at Party. A great reluctance to play shorthanded. 2 seats will open up, and within 2 hands everyone else sits out or leaves. Anyway, I was playing my hands on the other tables when my table popped up with just 2 of us playing. I was the BB/Button and had K4. He was the SB and had called the bet. I typed a message to him saying “last hand, let’s just check it down” and I called. He didn’t answer and the flop came K T 7. He checked so I figured he agreed and I checked too. Turn was a 4 and now he bet!! The stinker, wanted my 3 bucks that bad. So of course I raised. River was a Q and he bet again. I raised again and he called. HH showed him with Q9. I felt pretty good after that one.
One last comment. Similar to what I found at Paradise, the afternoon games seem tighter and tougher than the evening games. I want to play more in the daytime, but I’m making all my money at night. Oh well, we go where the money is.
I was in the middle of my $400 loss yesterday afternoon when I got this hand. 2 limpers to me in MP and I raise with KK. 2 cold callers and the BB too. 6 of us see the flop.
Flop 6s 8s 9h.
Not exactly what I wanted to see. 2 checks and a bet on my right. That’s what I wanted. Now I raise to clear them all out. Ha. One of them folded. 5 to the turn. I’ll put the bettor on a 9, someone on Spades and someone with a 7. Not very many good cards for me.
Turn [6s 8s 9h] Th
That can’t be good. Checked to me. I checked. I was tired of doing all the betting and just getting raised. It gets checked around.
River [6s 8s 9h Th] 8h
Checked around again and I’m good. T3, A9 (the flop bettor), Qs 5s, Ks 2s were the other hands. This is an example of how hard it is to read hands in these games, and as much as I wish I had bet (I probably missed 6 BB’s on this hand, that’s ½ an hour of work for me…lol just kidding) I think if I played that hand against 4 players 100 times, I would lose more than I won.
Friday
I’m making a midweek entry here because we’re going away for the weekend to my Aunt’s cottage. I will have access to play in the evenings, but no access to my notes so I thought I’d make a short entry now. I knew this day was coming but it hurts just the same. The streak has ended after 21 days. And in a brutal fashion. Wednesday saw a big afternoon win of $400 and an evening loss of $160 leaving me $240 to the good, and Thursday had a nice $240 win in the afternoon. But Thursday evening might have been the most unusual night I’ve ever had. Ultimately I dropped $430 for the evening leaving me $190 down for the day. I got as good a run of starting hands as I can ever remember. 900 hands I got AA 6 times, KK 6 times and big Aces over and over again. I seemed to hit every flop, and I lost, and I lost and I lost. This hand was from early in th evening and I think it was a harbinger of things to come.
I got AA in MP and there was 1 limper in front of me. I raised, got 1 cold caller in the cut off, both blinds called and the limper called. Flop is A J J. Now the only question was how to make the most out of this one. SB bet, and the EP called. I smooth called, certain I would be bet into on the turn. Just 3 of us to the turn. Turn brought the 3rd J. SB checked, EP bet, and now I think he’s got an A or a J. If he’s got the J I’m screwed, and if he’s got the A I’d like to keep the SB in for another bet. So I just call. SB raises. Anyone got the balls to lay down AA here? I didn’t. SO we both called. River was a 2 and we both called again. He had it of course, KJ, and the SB had A3.
So I’m up $1,070 for the 5 days, slightly ahead of the $200/day goal, but facing a limited number of hours for Saturday. I need a good day today.
I played some 5/10 last night after yet another couple of big hands got cracked by crazy chases. IN my first 2 orbits I got AA, KK, JJ and AK 3 times. And I ended up even. That’s when I went to bed. The 5/10 game in the early morning seemed pretty good. I got lots of action on those big hands. I’ll have to look into playing there some more.
I’m playing JJ and TT differently than I used to. If I’m first in I’ll raise them, but otherwise I’m playing them like middle pairs. There are so many 4 way pots that I hate getting into with those hands, so I’m limping behind limpers and playing for a set. Even if I’m an overpair to the flop, naked K’s and A’s play to the river making it improbable that they hold up.
The other thing I’ve noticed is how often the blinds raise in these games. Sometimes they’re legit, but usually thet’re not. They are just hurting themselves, but they are hurting some of the hands I like to limp in LP with too. I’m thinking of dropping the K9o and Q9o that I would normally play from the button for 1 bet once I notice one of these guys in my BB. I’m wondering what hands I could add though, if any?
In this hand I have KQ in late MP. 1 limper in front of me and I limp too. Button calls and SB raises (another blind raise) . BB folds and 4 see the flop for 2 bets.
Flop Qh 9h Ad
Yikes. SB bets out and EP limper calls. EP would raise with an A here so now I have to decide if BB has me beat. I raise. Button cold calls, and the other two call. I’m actually most worried about the button now. He would play a weak A like this. Or a flush draw.
Turn [Qh 9h Ad] Ac
BB bets out. EP folds and it’s on me. The 2nd A makes it less likely he has one, but if he does I’m now drawing dead, and the button is still to act behind me. The brave play I guess is to raise and fold to a re-raise, but I chickened out and folded. That turn bet is nearly always a strong hand. Heads up I call him down I think. Button just called. Now I’m not so sure he’s got a weak A.
River [Qh 9h Ad Ac] 3d. SB bets out and the button raises. Phew I think. SB calls. SB had 77, and wins when Button shows KT. Aaack.
Again this is the offshoot of my not taking to many chances in these games. But it still hurts to get outplayed like that.
Just back from the cottage and it’s Monday afternoon. Quick Poker update. Friday was another tough day. After the $400 loss of Thursday night, I picked right up where I left off and dropped another $200 in a short session Friday afternoon. My daughter was working at a camp and needed a ride home. Normally I would have sent my wife to get her, but I was running so bad I decided to take a break. I think I need to do more of that when I’m running bad rather than pushing to get even. As much as I think I’m still playing my best, I’m probably not. I made the same suggestion to SoBeDude last night when he was running awful. I couldn’t get back to even though on Friday night. In fact I started out dropping another $250, making a $850 slide since Wednesday at dinner time. I did make a comeback and got back to be down only $189 for Friday before I was through. Saturday we headed up to the cottage and I played a 4 hour session after everyone had gone to bed. Got back on track with a $180 win. That means a win of $1,020 for the week. Seems terrible after the 2 prior weeks, but not the end of the world.
Obviously Tells aren’t as reliable online as they are live, but there are tells in online poker. The long pause before betting on the river almost always is a big made hand. He wants you to think he’s thinking, but it’s almost always followed by a bet. The guy that raises pre-flop then checks the flop heads up, almost always has flopped a set. The masochist in me paid off on Saturday on one of these even though I was 90% positive what had happened. I raised first in from LP with AKo. I was 3 bet from the SB and we saw the flop heads up. Flop was K J x. He checked. The alarm bells started ringing in my head. I was almost positive he had JJ. I checked too. I probably should have bet and checked the turn. He bet the turn and river and I called both . He had JJ. The other tell is the change in cadence. Quite often heads up you feel a rhythm to the betting. Flop bet, turn bet, river..pause. That usually means he’s not comfortable with his hand. Some of these I have found extremely reliable.
I have found the games a little tougher this week. A lot more 2+2’ers at the table. I don’t jump around like I used to at Paradise because there is no indicator to tell me which tables are loosest. I do have a few preferred opponents that make the games good all by themselves, so I can look for them. One of the problems is it can be a lot of fun playing at a table with a lot of 2+2’ers. Good conversation and challenging play. I have to remind myself I’m trying to make a living. I certainly have my big days when I’m surrounded by bad players, not 2+2’ers. More on that next week.