too aggressive?

PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, CO calls, Button calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero checks.

Flop: (3.40 SB) J/images/graemlins/club.gif, 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, CO folds, Button calls.

Turn: (2.70 BB) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, Button calls.

River: (6.70 BB) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, Button checks.

Final Pot: 6.70 BB

[sean c]

Hi LLL. I can't think of one single good reason to check/raise the turn.

[Eeegah]

The turn c/r makes no sense whatsoever. Why did you think he'd bet? Why did you offer him a free card on the odd chance that he has a draw? Why c/r a card that crippled your hand?

So I should of bet folded the turn?

Or should i have checked the flo?

Or what should I have done preflop, flop and turn?

[Eeegah]

Certainly bet the flop. Bet/Folding the turn isn't bad either. If he has trips (or 44) now he'll let you know, and he's not raising with anything less--oh and the pot's small.

[Black Peter]

I can't see why you would check-raise here.

You should have bet or checked the turn. If he bet-raises, then figure you're beat. He's either got the J or a better kicker than you. After all, he called you on the flop, which means he likely has the J or a better A.

You might have raised pre-flop just to see where you stood since they limped in. Then when the A hit, you bet. If you get a call, you're probably beat by a better A. If not, the hand is over and you're not stressing like this.

[kiemo]

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You might have raised pre-flop just to see where you stood since they limped in.

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Wait, what?

[Black Peter]

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You might have raised pre-flop just to see where you stood since they limped in.

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Wait, what?

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He's in the BB with an A and two late calls. Depending on the table, i might have raised here to see if they were limping in with rags or not. If they are calling stations, i would be even more likely to... and bet the flop when the A hit.

[ QUOTE ]

You should have bet or checked the turn. If he bet-raises, then figure you're beat. He's either got the J or a better kicker than you. After all, he called you on the flop, which means he likely has the J or a better A.


[/ QUOTE ]

Heres a thought. What if He doesn't have the jack?

He has as much chance of having an ace.

Now, The 2nd jack hits. If I Check , he is going to bet ANYTHING. He'd be wrong not to bet and ace, jack, 4 or flush draw. As far as the kicker question is concerned, the J causes me to have 2 pair (Just like villain possibly). The benefit is that any card higher than more 4 on the river fixes my kicker question. Now if the villain has an ace, I am looking at a chop pot, if he stays in. The Jack is a good scare card for him as well and may cause a fold. I can fold to a 3bet. I also can get to showdown for the 2 BB's generally (The C/R) If I check/ call on both the turn and the river, I put 2 BB's in anyway. check/folding is too weak in my opinion.

I am not saying I did this right, but there has to be a better way than folding top 2 pair to a bet on the turn.

LLL

[Black Peter]

You're assuming that you can outplay him when you're beat pre-flop and on the flop.


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Now, The 2nd jack hits. If I Check , he is going to bet ANYTHING. He'd be wrong not to bet and ace, jack, 4 or flush draw.

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That's why i said to bet your A on the flop to find out where you are.

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As far as the kicker question is concerned, the J causes me to have 2 pair (Just like villain possibly). The benefit is that any card higher than more 4 on the river fixes my kicker question.

[/ QUOTE ]
It does? What if the river is an 8 and he has A9-K?

[Yerma]

[ QUOTE ]

Heres a thought. What if He doesn't have the jack?

He has as much chance of having an ace.

Now, The 2nd jack hits. If I Check , he is going to bet ANYTHING. He'd be wrong not to bet and ace, jack, 4 or flush draw.


[/ QUOTE ]

If you know he is the sort to try to take the pot away from you heads-up on the turn if you check to him, then you should check-call, and follow up by betting the river yourself. Your check-raise is too risky since your kicker doesn't play. So there is not much upside to your raise.

Your misconception is that you think that players are necessarily going to bet "anything" on the turn if you check to them. The weaker players will not and the better players will not. You are describing mediocre players here. In particular, a strong player is not likely to bet that turn with a flush draw. There are a few other made hands that a strong player would not bet there as well.

[Eeegah]

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He has as much chance of having an ace.

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Which now likely beats you, or at least makes a split pot. He's also not likely folding to your bluff checkraise.

And why would he bet a flush draw?