Where does most of your winnings come from?

Is there a certain situation in SSNL that brings in a large majority of your winnings? Like...

Set Mining
Raising and flop CB'ing
Turn CB'ing
Pure Bluffing
Semi-Bluffing Draws
Getting good odds to draw

Basically just wondering if there is a certain part of the game where a large portion of the winnings comes from, I would like to know what it is so I can focus on bettering it. I know all count..but some must count more than others yes? Maybe you could list estimated percentages for the things listed above? For some reason I know I'm gonna get pounded for this.

Sets probably make up a big percent of winnings in SSNL just because they are extremely powerful and more frequent than straights and flushes. Semi-bluffing draws is probably second because it wins a small pot very often, and the times it fails, it often brings home a large pot.

Cbetting is important for metagame as well as profit. Cbets typically bring in small pots, but if you don't cbet even a donk can read you.

Pure bluffing in SSNL without a solid read is chip spewing. Turn cbetting, semi-bluffs excluded, is also chip spewing.

[DJ Sensei]

1) Nearly all of my profit comes from pocket pairs, whether they be overpairs winning big against TPTK, or hitting sets against overpairs or TPTK. I suspect most posters agree in this respect.

2) In SSNL, I think pure bluffing is -EV. Against certain opponents, in certain situations, you can pull it off. But generally, you don't need to bluff to win, and trying to bluff is probably just going to lose you money.

3) A PFR combined with a flop C-bet is profitable when used wisely, of course, as is drawing with odds. On the whole though, these probably don't account for much of the profit, as much as canceling out the times you draw and don't get there, or you c-bet and get called or raised out.

4) Turn c-betting is a bit more complex, and chances are at this level, if your opponent called the flop they will call the turn too. If you're OOP, a turn c-bet generally leads to a big pot on the river in which you rarely know where you stand in the hand. Not good. Use turn c-betting with caution, and generally only with a good read (such as villain loves to chase flush draws, and there is one out on a 2 /images/graemlins/spade.gif4 /images/graemlins/spade.gif7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif9 /images/graemlins/club.gif board).

5) In summary, and hopefully a helpful answer to your question: pocket pairs are the most important hands in NLHE, because your equity advantage is often very large when you have them (as a set or overpair) in comparison to a drawing hand or a weak made hand. Additionally, opponents rarely will be able to get away from TPGK on a drawless board, and the strongest weapon against TPGK is a set or overpair.

I welcome any additions or comments...

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pocket pairs are the most important hands in NLHE, because your equity advantage is often very large when you have them (as a set or overpair) in comparison to a drawing hand or a weak made hand. Additionally, opponents rarely will be able to get away from TPGK on a drawless board, and the strongest weapon against TPGK is a set or overpair.

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I feel it is worth mentioning that you yourself must not get unnecessarily caught up in a large pot with TPTK, overpairs (and TPGK which shouldn't be a problem to let go of). This was an enormous leak in my game and I believe that this leak is common.

Thanks for the real answers to such an amateurish question, it helped a lot.

So should I make it a duty to keep TPTK pots very controlled against reasonable players and basically look for reasons to fold?

I find myself getting in trouble in these spots as well and am continually trying to be more careful.

I think I'd rank them in this order as far as profit for me goes:

1: raising and c-betting (basically abusing position)
2 and 3 tied: set mining and semi bluffing draws
4: getting good odds to draw
5: turn c-betting
6: pure bluffing

The reason for the order is largely drawn upon how often they come up. I raise and abuse position relentlessly, and it really lets me get paid off on my set-mining hands, but I can't flop a set everytime. Turn c-betting is important to have in your arsenal, but certainly doesn't come up a lot. Pure bluffing is a reserve method at SSNL, imo.

I win my most money on overpairs where I'll have KK and the flop will read Q 3 2 or Q 2 2, with my opponent holding AQ suited. Sets would follow next.

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I win my most money on overpairs where I'll have KK and the flop will read Q 3 2 or Q 2 2, with my opponent holding AQ suited. Sets would follow next.

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Danger, will robinson. Be careful not to get stacked by sets here!

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I win my most money on overpairs where I'll have KK and the flop will read Q 3 2 or Q 2 2, with my opponent holding AQ suited. Sets would follow next.

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Danger, will robinson. Be careful not to get stacked by sets here!

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If I'm raising between 3 and 5x the BB I would hope my opponents lay down A3 A2 or 33,22.

[scrapperdog]

I think betting whenever it is checked to you in position with a reasonable amount of people in the pot does make me money. This is pure bluff, I will do it with no pair and no draw. I dont do it all the time but will do it probably half the time and find it does take down the pot enough to make it +ev. <-- Not my main moneymaker but do think it deserves to be mentioned.

[Fallen Hero]

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I think I'd rank them in this order as far as profit for me goes:

1: raising and c-betting (basically abusing position)
2 and 3 tied: set mining and semi bluffing draws
4: getting good odds to draw
5: turn c-betting
6: pure bluffing


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gotta love a good set on a nonflush nonstraight board /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ptmusic]

Two Questions about this thread:

1. If pocket pairs are so vital, do you limp in with them OOP? If so, how often?

2. Terminology Question: Harrington refers to making a "continuation bet" on the turn, but he is talking about a situation where you checked the flop instead of making the continuation bet then. But is this forum's generally accepted use of "turn continuation bet" one where you made a continuation bet on the flop and then another one on the turn? If so, what would you call the move Harrington is talking about?

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I win my most money on overpairs where I'll have KK and the flop will read Q 3 2 or Q 2 2, with my opponent holding AQ suited. Sets would follow next.

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Danger, will robinson. Be careful not to get stacked by sets here!

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If I'm raising between 3 and 5x the BB I would hope my opponents lay down A3 A2 or 33,22.

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This is within the 5/10 rule. It is correct to call a 5x BB raise with any PP from any position with normal stacks.

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1. If pocket pairs are so vital, do you limp in with them OOP? If so, how often?

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In 6max, every position, sometimes for up to 10% of my stack. Edit: I believe this is in the faq.

[leehrat]

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Two Questions about this thread:

1. If pocket pairs are so vital, do you limp in with them OOP? If so, how often?

2. Terminology Question: Harrington refers to making a "continuation bet" on the turn, but he is talking about a situation where you checked the flop instead of making the continuation bet then. But is this forum's generally accepted use of "turn continuation bet" one where you made a continuation bet on the flop and then another one on the turn? If so, what would you call the move Harrington is talking about?

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1. Yes, and every goddamn time.

2. Yes, that is the forum's generally accepted usage of "turn continuation bet". I would call the move Harrington describes poor play, at least in ring games.

[kamjah]

yeah, overplaying your big hands can be a big money loser. people notice this trend, and try to crack your big hands every time. i myself am trying to correct this about my game. but im out of money, so i can't play.... booo

I think the turn continuation bet, in the spot where nobody has bet the flop and you are in middle position, is a strong move and has a high success rate in stealing pots. Clearly, I think it has to be made with the right circumstances, with only two or three people in the pot, the board texture has to be right, and they have to respect your bet. If you're in MP, the bet is more likely to be uncalled since opponents won't put you on a steal, where if your'e in LP then they might consider calling with ace high or something because they feel you're trying to pick the pot up. Note that the preflop action is important too... if it's an unraised pot, then it's probably going to work more, depending on the table.