nature of man- siegfried rambles

[siegfriedandroy]

why does man seek first his own good, at the expense of the good of others? is such selfishness conditioned or innate? cann it be changed/rewired?

is it in man's best interest to seek max happiness/pleasure at any cost? why should i not seek the max good of sklansky? would this be wrong, illogical, nonsensical?

does anything make sense? is anything true? is anything good? or all these questions completely meaningless? if yes, is this affirmative answer a completely meaningless resolution to my above questions?

what is a genius? what is the general correlation between genius and arrogance, etc? are most 'true' geniuses generally humble or arrogant? is sklansky a true 'genius'? is it good that his ultimate end is financial increase? or perhaps that is not his main end? if he were even more of a genius, could he then teach himself immediately to play a mean electric guitar? if he could, and had the musical acumen of mozart, would he then be better qualified to speak on whether God exists?

if God does not exist, is it better for me to disbelieve in Him. Should I then curse and despise those who falsely believe? If not, then why not. If so, then why. Which answer is 'better'. What does 'better' mean? Do any of the words on this website make real sense? Why argue ferociously over whose arguments are better? Why is pride, etc so quick to rule and predominate over most every post one reads in this section? if not, then what purpose to people have in their arguments here? perhaps all these arguments were preordained by blind chance, and not one occurrence of the infinite # of occurrences that occur occur by chance, but are instead predetermined. i am only writing this now because it could be no other way. hitler only killed because it could be no other way. if this were true, which it cannot be, then...well it doesnt matter, most of the arguments i read here are vain, empty, and without any helpful 'meaning' or redemptive quality. all vanity. you are all very smart, many geniuses who enjoy being complimented and being right, who enjoy 'truth' and proclaiming it for the benefit of others

[siegfriedandroy]

well good discussions all. i will be back for more perhaps next month. i usually hang out on the philos form for a couple minutes each month. hope to see you all soon. have fun solving all of life's mysteries. most of you are doing very well...

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why does man seek first his own good, at the expense of the good of others?

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You're generalising something that isn't always true

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is such selfishness conditioned or innate?

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Both

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cann it be changed/rewired?

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Of course, it's called altruism, heroism, philanthropy, being a good person,...

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is it in man's best interest to seek max happiness/pleasure at any cost?

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That depends what their goals are.

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why should i not seek the max good of sklansky? would this be wrong, illogical, nonsensical?

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Don't know what you mean.

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does anything make sense?

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Yes.

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is anything true?

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Yes, some things are true

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is anything good?

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Yes, some things are good

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or all these questions completely meaningless?

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Depends on why you're asking them.

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if yes, is this affirmative answer a completely meaningless resolution to my above questions?

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lol

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what is genius?

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The ability to perceive and model reality with unusally high accuracy and in a highly functional manner.

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what is the general correlation between genius and arrogance, etc?

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I have found none.

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are most 'true' geniuses generally humble or arrogant?

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Both

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is sklansky a true 'genius'?

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No.

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is it good that his ultimate end is financial increase?

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If that was the case, it wouldn't be good.

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or perhaps that is not his main end?

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Perhaps

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if he were even more of a genius, could he then teach himself immediately to play a mean electric guitar?

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Good question.

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if he could, and had the musical acumen of mozart, would he then be better qualified to speak on whether God exists?

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It's human nature to give the views of the highly capable more credit.

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if God does not exist, is it better for me to disbelieve in Him.

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That depends on how much you value honesty vs your needs.

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Should I then curse and despise those who falsely believe?

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Not a good way to make friends

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If not, then why not. If so, then why.

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See above

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Which answer is 'better'.

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My answer

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What does 'better' mean?

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More adequate, more suitable, more correct, more useful, more capable of imparting insight.

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Do any of the words on this website make real sense?

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Depends on how they are used

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Why argue ferociously over whose arguments are better?

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Because it's human nature.

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Why is pride, etc so quick to rule and predominate over most every post one reads in this section?

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Because neither side gives a quarter to the obviously correct points of the other.

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if not, then what purpose to people have in their arguments here?

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Not as much as they could have.

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perhaps all these arguments were preordained by blind chance, and not one occurrence of the infinite # of occurrences that occur occur by chance, but are instead predetermined.

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That is a possibility, but not one I ascribe to.

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i am only writing this now because it could be no other way.

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lol

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hitler only killed because it could be no other way. if this were true, which it cannot be, then...well it doesnt matter, most of the arguments i read here are vain, empty, and without any helpful 'meaning' or redemptive quality. all vanity. you are all very smart, many geniuses who enjoy being complimented and being right, who enjoy 'truth' and proclaiming it for the benefit of others

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/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Quick, someone give this guy the blue pill!

[hashi92]

man seeks first his own good because of natures built in survival instinct. survival of the species. man will do whatever is in his best interest to survive. sometimes this will mean doing good.

i dont believe that atheist should codemn believers. if the believer wants to come on this forum and debate issues fine. its always good to ask why. but we shouldnt crush their faith because they are not yet ready to live a life of non belief.

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i dont believe that atheist should codemn believers. if the believer wants to come on this forum and debate issues fine. its always good to ask why. but we shouldnt crush their faith because they are not yet ready to live a life of non belief.

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You confuse me:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...e=1#Post4225747 (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=4225747&an=0&page=1#Post 4225747)
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...e=1#Post4227214 (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=4227214&an=0&page=1#Post 4227214)

[J. Stew]

I think you're confused. The questions you are asking can't be answered in a few minutes, they can only be answered instantaneously by yourself, after you know yourself, which you clearly do not. Shine the light inward, so they say. Until then do us a favor and keep your psychotic dreams to yourself.

[hashi92]

i dont believe in God or religon but i do see the value of it. some people need guidance and asnwers to the unknown. some peoples lives would be in shambles if they didnt have their faith. religon serves its purpose.

[hashi92]

some times i just like to debate things. sometimes its fun to play the devils advocate.

[imported_luckyme]

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i dont believe in God or religon but i do see the value of it. some people need guidance and asnwers to the unknown. some peoples lives would be in shambles if they didnt have their faith. religon serves its purpose.

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That seems a very culture-bound claim. Why are there so few people like that in other western countries? Sure, religion acts as a crutch but other cultures seem to have citizens that avoid shambling even with a realistic worldview. "If you only tool is a hammer, all problems look like a nail." captures what happens in american culture where religion is the 'recommended' personal assistant.

Am I overreading what you're stating?

luckyme

[hashi92]

well im from america so probally that why if feel that way. i thinkn this is the case in any pro catholic or christian country. i think there are some fanatical religous believers in other countries the phillipines being an example.

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i dont believe in God or religon but i do see the value of it. some people need guidance and asnwers to the unknown. some peoples lives would be in shambles if they didnt have their faith. religon serves its purpose.

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Do you have MPD? You also wrote:

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i only live by what i know.
i said it before
were born
we procreate
we become fertilizer

why waste time on worshiping and sacraficing
live everyday knowing it could be your last

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So, it has value, but it's a waste of time. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[imported_luckyme]

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well im from america so probally that why if feel that way. i thinkn this is the case in any pro catholic or christian country.

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Sure, and it doesn't have to be xtrian. I was just pointing to the fact that religion serving as a crutch does not imply that it is the only psychological support that can be used by those people needing it for that purpose. There are reality-based coping approaches that obviously work in other cultures.

[hashi92]

Quote:
i dont believe in God or religon but i do see the value of it. some people need guidance and asnwers to the unknown. some peoples lives would be in shambles if they didnt have their faith. religon serves its purpose.



Do you have MPD? You also wrote:

Quote:
i only live by what i know.
i said it before
were born
we procreate
we become fertilizer

why waste time on worshiping and sacraficing
live everyday knowing it could be your last



So, it has value, but it's a waste of time.


for me to believe in religon is a waste of time but i understand why some people need it. so basically yes it has value but it is a waste of time. just because something isnt right for me doesnt mean it doesnt work for someone else.

[hashi92]

whats MPD

[hashi92]

yes i agree. but many people choose religon as there crutch. these same people see no purpose in these other crutches. no matter how logical are arguments are the religous people always stick to their faith. some people refuse to see the light. you can lead a horse to water but will it drink.

[hashi92]

MPD i get it multiple personality disorder.

i actually have 10

hee hee

[hashi92]

http://www.adherents.com/images/rel_pie.gif

according to this chart only 16% of the world population doesnt use some form of religon.

[siegfriedandroy]

good resonse, phil. i like most of it /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[siegfriedandroy]

i have MPD. my other personality is david sklansky. i considered being mason but decided against it.

[siegfriedandroy]

most of your arguments (at least most of the guys on this forum) are not very logical at all. some of them make me think a bit, but most of them are in reality quite illogical and not compelling. the narrow thinking and inability to even question basic philosophical issues is appalling. it is foolish to be arrogant, condescending, to patronize, etc when you know very little. most of you are merely products of your times, culture, etc, which conditions you entirely- yet you still love to fantasize how you are original, free and independent thinkers.

(not directed at you, in particular, hashi! just my general impressions of this forum. and of course, there are some who are fairly intelligent and reasonably decent at thinking well. on the whole, though, i am quite disappointed.)

[Darryl_P]

My theory is that to be a truly independent thinker you either have to be extremely intelligent (beyond IQ tests and SAT scores), or be at least moderately intelligent and have lived in at least 2 different cultures for at least 2 years each. It also helps if you had to earn your own way from a young age.

You seem angry that most people do not live up to your standards. I'd just accept it as a fact of life if I were you and seek out those few people who do.

[siegfriedandroy]

no need for hostility. i dont recall saying anything about psychotic dreams. how are they 'psychotic'. the things you believe are clearly untrue to anyone with a sound mind. i would not say you are 'psychotic', but clearly you are very much deceived.

[siegfriedandroy]

who is not living up to my standards? i am no genius. mostly i am upset by others who are not, yet fancy themselves so.

[Darryl_P]

I did not mean only intellectually not living up to your standards, but rather character-wise. Besides, one could argue that recognizing how far you can go with your own thoughts while expecting to be taken seriously is an important component of intelligence, even if it's not measured on SATs and IQ tests.

[siegfriedandroy]

yeah i guess so

[hashi92]

did i say something dumb. im sorry

[siegfriedandroy]

nah you seem alright