Tiger

His score today doesn't really reflect it, but Tiger played a great round of golf today. Hit 15 greens and missed 2 fairways on a brutal course in high winds for much of the round. I laughed when Johnny Miller likened Sergio Garcia's swing to Hogan's. Yeah, when Hogan was 19 and hooking it all over the place trying to make enough to buy a hamburger maybe. But I don't think Hogan ever re-gripped 23 times and or had that loose whippy horrible looking action. (Maybe when he was a pup, but I still can't imagine it.) Then Tiger steps up and has a better-than-Hogan, on-plane, solid foundation, no excess action, tight swing that is total power in complete control. Just like Hogan but better. What am I missing Johnny? Tiger's round was a champion's round. We are seeing the best ever. Never thought I'd see anybody better than Nicklaus. Tiger is. I hope he stays healthy so he can break Nicklaus's records. It is a joy to watch.


Phil didn't even blow it, Tiger just had him beat completely and did what he had to do in the final round.

i was proud of phil, and in a sense he made a breakthru in this tourney...lol, at least from my perspective....what can you say..tiger is the man...gl

you gonna be in vegas july 4 weekend? gl

Maybe. You? If HDPW is either visiting family or working the whole time I might go. If I am not working the 5th that is. We'll see. If I go I'll pack the clubs with me. I played my first round of the year today and hope springs eternal. (Tiger and I both shot 2 over for 18 today. The course he played was just a shade tougher than than the executive length meadow I knocked it around in today. I wish those numbers were in the same universe, but they're not. No semblance of similarity unfortunately) I'll take on any 2+2ers for symbolic stakes like beers or California Pizzas. Or Tommy Angelo stakes of course, particularly if you are any good and the course is over 5500 yards.

"Tiger played a great round of golf today"


-Couldn't agree more. He putted terribly (loved Miller's comment on 18 after those two dreadful putts Tiger his, "It's a non-event, but I'd hit this one a little easier."), but played beautifully. I told my son's golf instructor on Thursday night that the tournament was over, nobody would get to 3 under and Tiger just doesn't back up.


"I laughed when Johnny Miller likened Sergio Garcia's swing to Hogan's"


-I'm with you again. They were New Yorkers who yelled at Garcia "hit it already," and Hogan was anything but a New Yorker, but I think Hogan would have told Sergio the same thing. Is there anything in the sports world to compare with the excruciating agony of watching Sergio waggling like that? I counted 19 on one wedge shot. He's great for the game in that he's so dynamic, but holy cow he's hard to watch.


"We are seeing the best ever."


-We agree again. He plays the game better than anyone ever has. Yeah, I know, the equipment is a helluva lot better than Snead and Hogan had to play with, but seven majors in his last eleven tries? When he was in his junior year at Stanford, Tom Watson said he's the best prospect in the last 50 years. I remember thinking at the time that Watson, being a Stanfod man himself, wasn't being objective. Little did I know.


Watson, BTW, won 8 majors and 39 tournaments in his career, a great career that got him voted the 9th greatest player of the 20th century. Tiger, at age 26, has now won 32( I think) tournaments and 7 majors. This probably puts him, already, at about the 12th or 13th greatest player in history if his career ended tomorrow. Nicklaus won 70 tournaments. Although one never knows, it seems inevitable Tiger will surpass that total.


"Phil didn't even blow it"


-I agree again. Phil was all class, IMO. He doesn't care about finishing second, he wants to win and plays like it. He couldn't have been more gracious about the fans, the course, everything. He's maturing as a person, and playing great. I predict he'll win the PGA later this year.


One more thing: I hate it when some of the pros complain about the course being hard. What difference does it make? I think the U.S. Open should be played on a course where par is good score. It plays the same for everyone. You should be punished if you miss the fairways and the greens. What difference does it make if you win the U.S. Open at 17 under par or 17 over par? You'd probably get more respect if you won at 17 over.


Nothing could be better for the game than Tiger Woods winning on a public golf course. A great day for golf.

I agree: Phil's finest moment, pure class and graciousness. (see my post below).

I have played the vast majority of my golf at public courses and like them. If I ever make money I'll probably join a crappy country club. (Pine Valley, Cypress, or Winged Foot aren't in the cards) But I agree, public course golf is the backbone of the game. Public course golf can be fun and some tough players come from public courses. I've never played Bethpage, but the stories about sleeping there all night to get a tee time make me wonder whether you can really have the total public course experience there. I mean, how can you stroll out to a tee with 6 guys and a proposition bet if you have to wait 10 years to get a time? How can illegal aliens with 6 clubs and a bag of beer sneak on and play close to par on the holes away from the clubhouse? Love those public courses. Just wish the ones I got to play on were Tillinghasts.

"the stories about sleeping there all night to get a tee time make me wonder whether you can really have the total public course experience there."


This is true, although it wasn't always that way. As you can imagine, the interest in Bethpage rose exponentially when the 2002 U.S. Open was announced. The people followed. This is especially true of the black course. Many golfers avoided it, as it was kicking the asses of golfers of all handicaps even before the USGA got a hold of it.

My dad used to leave our house in Forest Hills (Queens) at 3:30 in the morning to get there at around 4:45. He wasn't a great golfer, but the group in which he played contained two very good golfers who always wanted to play the black, so he played on it a lot.


This was in the 1960s. So I don't know if it wasn't always this way, but it has been for a long time.


Here in La-la land, you get a golf reservation card from the city and, the way I understand it (I could be wrong, hope anyone who knows can confirm/correct) if your card begins with the number "1", you have priority for the 1st weekend of the month, with "2" the second weekend, etc. The priority allows you to call up at 6 AM on Monday for a Saturday reservation and 6 AM on Tuesday for a Sunday reservation. If you don't have the priority number for that weekend you can call beginning at 9AM.


I think my dad's group of 6 guys has, among them, a priority number for each weekend, so they always get an attractive tee off time, usually on a course they want to play on. (And usually a couple of them can't play that weekend, so there's few battles over who can play in the foursome.)

FYI,

Tiger's won 8 Professional Majors and (I think) 44 times worldwide (32 PGA events)

Good post Andy, some thoughts:


If Tiger were to die tomorrow, he has already cemented himself as the second greatest of all time. If he wins the slam this year and died in September, one could make a convincing arguement that he is the best.


He has changed the way we look at the game. It used to be that people said "You can't win the tournament on the first day, but you can lose it". This still seems to be true, but make no mistake: Tiger won this tournament on the second day. While everyone else was busy being miserable, he opened up a 7 shot lead on everyone but Harrington. That was it. Finis. From there, he geared down and said "boys come and get me" They couldn't.


Now to Phil...


"Phil didn't even blow it"


Phil *never* blows it. Why? Because every time he gets close enough to smell it, he goes Lefty and drops a shot. 18 yesterday was such a classic example, but there are others. This "make a big run then make a rally killing bogey" act from him has been seen many times before.


2 things Phil said and 1 thing he did this weekend:


1. "I'm really happy with the way I played"


Bullshit. Can you fathom Tiger finishing 2nd, 3 shots back and saying he was happy with his game. No freaking way. Phil must change this attitude if he is to catch the Man.


2. "It takes some good breaks to win these Majors"


Again: Bullshit. Do you think for one second that Tiger is thinking "Man, if I only get that one break, I can win this thing". Ha! What a loser mentality.


And the thing he did (not) do.


After the 3rd round ended, guess who was on the practice tee for two and a half hours after the round? Tiger. Guess who was the LAST person to leave? Tiger.


Phil can talk about doing what it takes, but until he is out there shoulder to shoulder doing what it takes, he will never close the gap.

Does a caddy who tours with a pro (like tiger's caddy) get paid a small percentage of the prize money won, or is he just paid a predetermined amount? (any idea what tiger's caddy makes?)

The general gudeline is 5% of a player's prize, with 10% of a win. Usually a small weekly salary for when the player doesn't make the cut or wins a small amount. Caddies pay their own expenses, including travel. These figures might have changed some with the explosion of purses, but I think it's in the ballpark. Tiger's caddy does real well. Boo Weekly's doesn't.

I think they get paid a percentage, (not sure what percentage), and I heard that, had it been based on his earn last year, Steve Williams would have earned his card on caddy fees alone.

I think the best thing that Williams does is get the hell out of Tiger's way. Tiger doesn't want/need a really active caddy (remember when Fluff caddied for him?) ala Fanny. All he needs is someone to loop for him. he reads most of his own putts, picks his own clubs, and probably has a pretty good idea of his own distances. Also, Williams has to carry Tigers food for mid round snacks. A pretty good gig if you can get it.

Phil's jiggling breasts under his turtleneck on Saturday said it all. Tiger wants to win and works his ass off in the off season and during the season in the weightroom and on the track. Phil eats jelly doughnuts.

8 professional majors is correct, which ties Watson. I don't consider wins around the world (of which I'm sure Watson has won some) as important, because of the competition. The only ones I counted in my total was British Open wins, which didn't count as official PGA wins until few years ago. Watson won 34 PGA events, plus the 5 British Opens. Tiger's British Open wins will count in his PGA win total, so I don't see why they shouldn't count in Watson's.


Anyway, it seems certain Tiger, if not already there, will soon be the greatest golfer from Stanford. Watson, by the way, seems in awe of him. Aside from his comment about Tiger being the greatest prospect of the last half century when he joined the tour, Watson has called him "supernatural" in his abilities and I remember just before Watson joined the senior tour he said something like "I can still compete with these guys (meaning the guys on the regular tour)--all but one, anyway." It was evident who he meant.

I thought the same thing.


Tom D

Except for Tiger, this generation of golfers doesn’t seem up to par. Every tournament, it seems to me, you have Tiger being chased by the Keystone Kops.


Mickelson does some spectacular things, but they don’t begin to make up for all his equally spectacular blunders. Who else? Duval is a head case. Els can’t put two good rounds together without shooting himself in the foot. Garcia is a HEAD CASE. Love has disappeared. Singh’s okay. Parnevik? Goosen? Furyk? Is there anyone who can put together a decent tournament and put some pressure on Tiger? It doesn't look like it.


Tom D

I do think he's the best ever, just not the greatest as yet. Koufax may have been the best pitcher ever for his best five years, but I do not consdier him the greatest because of the longevity factor. Tiger probably ranks close to the top ten on the greatest scale, IMO, right now. Three or four more majors, plus six or eight other wins, and he's getting into Nicklaus, Snead and Hogan territory.


No one works harder than Tiger (maybe Vijay). But I'm not so sure determination is so important. Tiger wins more than anyone else because he plays better than anyone else, not because he wants to. Vijay wants to play better than anyhone else, and probably works as hard or harder than Tiger, and he's certainly a great player. But he'll never win as much as Tiger because he doesn't have Tiger's ability.


But I understand your point. Phil has other interests that maybe might make golf not quite the priority it seems to be for Tiger (and Vijay).


But I also think one can be happy with the way you played, but dissatisfied with the results. Phil's in a financial situation where he really doesn't care about whether he finishes 2nd or 3rd of 5th, the only thing that will do is 1st.


It does take some breaks to win a major. When a guy's won eight of 'em, it ain't the breaks, you're right. Jack Nicklaus may have gotten some good breaks to win 18 majors, but hell, he got a lot of bad breaks too. I remember Watson duelling with him in the British Open and Jack shot (I think) 66-66 the last two days and Watson hit about a 900 foot putt on one of the last holes that popped up in the air and went in and he beat Jack with 66-65. I think they were 10 shots clear of the 3rd place guy.


I think what the greats have that the near-greats don't is the ability to 1) handle the pressure; and 2) make the putts when it counts. Nicklaus was never regarded as a great putter, but I never remember him not making a crucial six footer, or blowing a three footer when the chips were down. People remember San Snead's and Tom Watson's putting woes during the latter stages of their careers, but those guys had great short games in their prime.


Most importantly, what does Tiger look like during the back nine on Sunday? He relishes the pressure and handles it. Same look Jack had, and Hogan, and Arnie in his day. Compare that look with, say, that of Jeff Maggert (who's a fine player, I'm not picking on him) and you see the difference.


I thought Phil was gracious and well-spoken yesterday, the "good breaks" remark notwithstanding.


I also agree that Tiger won the tournament on the first day. I told my dad that it was over: nobody would get to 3 under and Tiger would not come back worse than 3 under. He's a remarkable player.

"Tiger doesn't want/need a really active caddy (remember when Fluff caddied for him?) ala Fanny"


Wasn't it Fanny's "activeness" what cost Faldo his first marriage?


BTW, I understand Tiger's girlfriend was Jesper Parnevik's nanny. One suspects Jesper's wife might have been the one to make the suggestion, "Why don't you introduce her to Tiger?"

Nicklaus has said that he had tougher competition because the guys he was fighting for majors (Palmer, Trevino, Watson, Irwin, Floyd) had won multiple majors and were tougher to beat in majors because of that. While they're not quite the Keystone Kops, you may have a point here.

Phil's won round-about 20 tournaments, which is about as many as Tom Kite and Lanny Wadkins won, more than Nick Price. So he's not exactly all chopped liver and jelly doughnuts.

Agreed that he's an amazing talent, but tiger is the same plus the work ethic. Not that i know what Phil's work regime is, but it's pretty obvious that Tiger works a bit harder than Phil does.

Funny, my friends and I thought the same thing about Jesper's wife. Not sure about the Fanny/Faldo thing, but it's not an image I want dancing around in my head. Especially in his pre-workout days. thanks a lot, Andy =)

My favorite caddy story is that when Andy Bean was a hot player, Tom Kite's caddy left Kite for Andy Bean to make more money. Bean went in the tank soon thereafter (where he's remained ever since) and Kite went on to be a steady winner over the next 10-12 years, eventually emerging (at the time) as the all-time leading money winner. I love it when greed goes down the tube when loyalty would have been a winner.

Andy,


I hope that's "Jesper Parnevik's children's nanny." ;-}


John


BTW, I think Fluff got fired by Tiger because he revealed how much he was earning; apparently, Tiger can pay less than other touring pros. One reason I'd like to see Phil win a big one: he's reputed to be the best tipper on tour, reportedly leaving clubhouse attendants three thousand after a win, a grand if he makes the cut, and five hundred if he doesn't make the weekend.

I hope that's "Jesper Parnevik's children's nanny."


-Me too, alas one never knows though.


Phil is the coolest guy out there. I particularly enjoyed it when I read in Sports Illustrated that during a rain delay, as he and his wife were being chauffered in a golf cart to safety, he asked the drive to stop the cart, ran to his own car, opened the trunk, took out an umbrella, and ran over to give it to a homeless guy slumped at the edge of a building.

John,


You don't need to come out West to see me. Just come out so you can have dinner with Andy Fox. I'll pay just to listen to the converstion /images/biggrin.gif .


Anyway, there is a link to a story on why Tiger fired Fluff below (Google is great!).


Regards,


Rick

Rick,


It sounds like the "official" story.


John


BTW,


Saw your note down below. Thanks, and the check's in the mail.