50/100 lost my opponent on the turn

[Michael Emery]

I played this hand last week but its kinda been bothering me so I though I'd post it. I didnt send myself the HH (party 50) but here it is:

Folded around to me in the CO with KQ of clubs. I raise and the button 3-bets. The button is a regular and probably a 2+2er who seems soild. He loves to 3-bet me light judging from our past experience together in this game. Of course all good players will usually always 3-bet or fold here, but I just think he gets carried away with me. He has to know I'm a tight player but must think I'm weak postflop.

So the flop comes down K 3 K, no 2-flush. I check-raise him and he 3-bets, I cap. Turn is a rag and he folds when I bet. I cant help but think he got away from a medium pocket pair type hand and saved himself $200. I just was worried that if I didnt cap and went for a check-raise on the turn instead, that he would check behind. I dont want him wiggling away from me next time. Other ways to play this hand?

Thanks,
Mike Emery

how does he check-fold on the turn? if he is the button, the he has position. If I cap the flop, I am leading the turn 100 out of 100 times here. the other alternate line to take is just call the 3-bet and check raise the turn. Assuming you caps and then led the turn, i would play the hand the same most likely.

[Entity]

How could he check-fold? He had position on you.

I think there's some merit to capping preflop. And I'm not sure that there is much of a chance of you keeping him around, given the fact that you're out of position. Your line certainly convinced him you had him beat though, but you got a fair amount (2BB) out of it.

Something like c/c c/c bet used to be used a lot but I feel like it's overused now and might be transparent.

Rob

[Michael Emery]

[ QUOTE ]
How could he check-fold? He had position on you.


[/ QUOTE ]

Correct, I just modified it. I wasnt paying attention as I proof read it before posting. I bet the turn and he folded.

[flawless_victory]

[ QUOTE ]
I cant help but think he got away from a medium pocket pair type hand and saved himself $200.

[/ QUOTE ]
he v most likely had ATish...

[andyfox]

I think the most you cost yourself was $50. If he folded on the turn, he didn't have all that much. If you don't cap the flop, he likely checks behind on the turn. Maybe a card comes off that earns you a bet on the river, but maybe a card comes off that costs you a bet.

One thing that sometimes works against 2+2 types, is to just call on the flop and then bet out on the turn. 2+2ers know this is often a bluff into a paired board and will raise you on the turn.

[rtrombone]

Your line is bad only if you wouldn't play other hands (pocket pairs, most likely) this way. I agree with those who opined that he didn't have a pocket pair; a more likely hand is something like AJ or JTs. You want him to fold on the turn with these holdings after you cap the flop with 44, right?

[TheBusiness]

I think your line is pretty good. There's not much he's going to call you down with here except the case K or a big pair, so you won't get much more out of him than you did anyway. I think you're right he'd check behind on the turn if you called his flop 3-bet and then went for the turn checkraise. The only line preferable to yours is probably to check-call the flop and lead the turn, hoping that he will put you on a bluff and raise. I think that's the only way you can get more out of him than you did.

[mscags]

Mike,
I do stuff like this too sometimes and it really bothers me when this happens. A few other lines you might consider taking. 1) Obviously you can just call the three bet and try to checkraise. If he checks behind, you're leading the river obviously. Assuming he will call this will get you an extra .5BB. If he doesn't than you lose .5BB, but honestly I don't see what he three bets with on the flop that he doesn't want to see a showdown with for just one BB. 2) You can call the three bet and then donk the turn. This line will get a wide arrary of reactions out of him. He will sometimes just fold, he will sometimes see that as a weak play and raise you, and he will sometimes call you down. 3) You could have led the flop hoping he raises and then try a check raise on the turn. This line may or may not have any merit to it.

I think I like #2 the best even though I hardly ever use it because it has a good chance of getting a wide variety of responses out of vilian. If he folds, then he probably didn't have much to begin with. He might call you down with a med PP or he might raise a med PP trying for a free showdown. Just my thoughts.

Scags

[SA125]

[ QUOTE ]
So the flop comes down K 3 K, no 2-flush. I check-raise him and he 3-bets, I cap. Turn is a rag and he folds when I bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is very close to the same scenario in the AQ hand posted with Mimi Tran in the CO, except you're in the CO instead of the BB and no 2 fl. You both said you had a tight image. I think it's close enough to reinforce the point I made there.

Just calling the 3 bet on the flop and donking the turn, instead of 4 betting and leading, will get more money from a worse hand/good player. Does a good player routinely call down a tight player who capped the flop OOP and led the turn on a QQx board?