SNGPT Question

[Pudge714]

Do I only need to type in people who act after me? Does the EV change because people have folded before me? Why or why not?

[tigerite]

No, you need to type in everyone. Yes, it does change because they can no longer affect the outcome of the hand, and their chips cannot be won or lost by anyone. Lotsa reasons.

[eastbay]

[ QUOTE ]
Do I only need to type in people who act after me? Does the EV change because people have folded before me? Why or why not?

[/ QUOTE ]

First thing to note is that you can read in from a hand history file from Party or Stars; this can save a lot of time.

If you are entering hands from 2+2 or some other source, then yes, you have to put in everyone's chip count.

Say you're on the bubble, have the button, and UTG folds with blinds 100/200. You with 1500 chips have the decision to push into SB and BB who have you covered. Do you think it matters if the guy UTG who already folded has 5 chips or 5000? You bet it does. It matters a lot. If he has 5 chips you're almost guaranteed the money by just folding, if he has 5000 you need to pick up chips to make the money. SnG Power Tools accounts for this effect, so it needs to know who has how many chips.

eastbay

[ QUOTE ]
First thing to note is that you can read in from a hand history file from Party or Stars; this can save a lot of time.

[/ QUOTE ]
Can you read in a hand that is red in the tournament history? (Suppose, for instance, you wanted to adjust the betting or blinds to examine a hypothetic situation based on a real hand.)

[eastbay]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
First thing to note is that you can read in from a hand history file from Party or Stars; this can save a lot of time.

[/ QUOTE ]
Can you read in a hand that is red in the tournament history? (Suppose, for instance, you wanted to adjust the betting or blinds to examine a hypothetic situation based on a real hand.)

[/ QUOTE ]

No. I don't think it's a good idea to have the hands be read in "wrong" just so they can be analyzable. That would be pretty confusing.

I may give an option at some point to just read in chip stacks on non-analyzable hands, but it will require a hoop of some kind to prevent confusion.

eastbay

[Guthrie]

What constitutes a non-analyzable hand?

[splashpot]

[ QUOTE ]
What constitutes a non-analyzable hand?

[/ QUOTE ]
A hand that wasn't folded to you. Or that doesn't have an opponent pushing into you.

[Guthrie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What constitutes a non-analyzable hand?

[/ QUOTE ]
A hand that wasn't folded to you. Or that doesn't have an opponent pushing into you.

[/ QUOTE ]
Thanks. So is it safe to assume that ICM is only useful in these two situations?

[Roman]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do I only need to type in people who act after me? Does the EV change because people have folded before me? Why or why not?

[/ QUOTE ]

First thing to note is that you can read in from a hand history file from Party or Stars; this can save a lot of time.



[/ QUOTE ]\

im stupid, how do you do this?

[tigerite]

No. ICM is useful for all situations - look at the huge bloody maths I did the other day for instance! But SNGPT only handles simple ones. I do wish that eastbay would add at least a 'call a re-raise all-in' option as that's pretty easy, but he hasn't so far.

[bluefeet]

I notice sometimes that that isn't always the case. I periodically have hands that are in red, where I was opening - everyone having ample chips as well. I've wondered if this was just a clitch, or if there were some unknown factors.

[splashpot]

As long as you could accurately put your opponent on a range, ICM should work for all situations. But lets say you have a limp, a min-raise, a cold call, action to you. Look at all the ranges you would have to calculate. Even if you were to guess those ranges, there would be a huge margin of error.

[ QUOTE ]
So is it safe to assume that ICM is only useful in these two situations?

[/ QUOTE ]
ICM is independent chip model, which is a way of assigning equity to chip stacks in a SNG (or larger tournament, I suppose). I point this out because I think a lot of people confuse ICM with the whole process of analyzing an action (usually a push or call decision). ICM is used to evaluate the equity position before the action and after the possible outcomes, but ICM isn't involved with the middle parts. ICM is not the only method for estimating equity.

[tigerite]

Indeed it is not, but it's probably the most accurate way we have, or that has been found up til now.

[zoobird]

Can anoyone point me to a good intro to ICM?

[pergesu]

READ THIS BEFORE POSTING (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=2821605&an=0&page=0#Post 2821605)

/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[eastbay]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do I only need to type in people who act after me? Does the EV change because people have folded before me? Why or why not?

[/ QUOTE ]

First thing to note is that you can read in from a hand history file from Party or Stars; this can save a lot of time.



[/ QUOTE ]\

im stupid, how do you do this?

[/ QUOTE ]

File -> Open Tournament. Navigate to where Party or Stars histories are stored. Open one of them.

eastbay

web page (http://sharnett.bol.ucla.edu/ICM/info.html)

[taylor]

I don't understand the "reading in" to save time either although I'd like to /images/graemlins/frown.gif

or else I'm already doing it and just confused.. arrgh

[bluefeet]

~File
~Open Tournament

...find a piece of HH on your hard drive - viola

[taylor]

so this method automatically fills in all the chipstacks and action saving me doing it manually?

[taylor]

did your blue feet always move?

[bluefeet]

nah, pergesu hooked me up /images/graemlins/wink.gif


edit: & 'yes' it does

[Roman]

oh thats really cool. What do the open/call tabs mean?

[bluefeet]

it means "did you have an opportunity to OPEN PF?" and "did you have first dibs on CALLING an AI in front of you?"

if both are "no", then it is red, and cannot be analyzed.


edit: Ps. for the ones in black, don't forget you might want to play with the ranges once computed

[aLOWdAkING]

What's the best way to import a tournament summary that is in your email?

[ QUOTE ]
What's the best way to import a tournament summary that is in your email?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, but if you save the whole thing in a text file, i think you can open that text file with SNG PT.

[Roman]

wow thats really sweet, thanks a lot. Can this be used with pokerstars too?

[aLOWdAkING]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's the best way to import a tournament summary that is in your email?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, but if you save the whole thing in a text file, i think you can open that text file with SNG PT.

[/ QUOTE ]

How would you save the entire thing as a text file? It's SUPER long in the email and I really don't want to copy-paste by dragging the text. There has to be an alternative, right?

Yahoo has an option at the bottom right of the email to "save message text".