ATo in 6-way pot ($11)

What's my line here? I'm obviously not super short on chips, but I'm not great either. I don't remember too many reads, except that MP1 had something like a 77% VPIP. I considered folding this pre-flop, but I figured that in an unraised pot there was a decent chance that I had the best A. I know I throw this away a lot, but I think I pick up the pot very often when an A comes out. If I remember the table correctly (and I may not), I get paid off by some worse aces at least sometimes. Plus, I have position.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

BB (t985)
UTG (t980)
UTG+1 (t590)
MP1 (t975)
MP2 (t605)
MP3 (t1140)
CO (t735)
Hero (t695)
SB (t1295)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP1 calls t50, MP2 calls t50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls t50, Hero calls t50, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t300) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, CO checks, Hero...

My first thought was to just muck this preflop.

I changed my mind and i think a push could be a decent play here depending on reads, pushing 695 to pick up 225 here is a big help to your stack.

p.s. i hate the call

This early, with this many people, I'd fold this pre-flop. But as it is, I would probably put in a pot-size bet or maybe a little less. Anybody with an A is going to call (in my opinion), and people without an A will not like this flop very much (if they didn't flop a monster).

[tigerite]

Fold on the button with ATo and three limpers..? Seems awful weak-tight to me. Well, anyway, you have to bet this I think, for value if nothing else. I hate how it's a dry flop though so AJ/AQ/AK could be in there (though the last two, you would hope, would raise pf). I don't agree with pushing though. There's absolutely no need.

I bet the flop for t250, it's a nice situation because it looks so much like a bluff due to the 5 checks ahead, and therefore you'll get worse hands than usual looking you up, I'm probably going to the felt with this hand if I'm raised... just because I see so often middle pocket pairs coming over the top, thinking you're buying the pot.

PF I also limp along, I'm on the button and the pot is nice, I'll happily take a flop, I agree that folding does just seem too weak/tight.

[liucipher]

What would you do here if there were only 2 limpers? 1 limper?

Would you be still inclined to limp the former and raise the latter? Or maybe fold since your pot odds decrease?

*confused about these marginal hands in the 7-12xBB zone*

[tigerite]

2 limpers, I'd have to give it some thought. 1 limper, I may well shove, dependant on reads.

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1 limper, I may well shove, dependant on reads.

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Seriously? To win t125? Doesn't seem right to me?

[tigerite]

As I say it depends on reads.. if it's a donk for instance he is unlikely to have ATo beat anyways. If it's a solid player, I probably wouldn't do it.

[liucipher]

Really? Hero has 14xBB 9-handed and he's in the middle of the pack. Blinds won't hit him for 7 hands or something. Would you really shove to pick up 2.5xBB w/ just one limper?

I feel like I'd be more inclined to shove w/ 3 limpers - putting all my chips at risk for 4.5xBB starts sounding like the reward part of the risk/reward ratio is getting attractive.

Or is the risk part of getting called rise too quickly w/ 3 limpers?

[tigerite]

Well obviously it also depends on the position of the limper. There's more than one factor in play as to whether I shove but I do it sometimes; that's all I am saying.

With 3 people in, then no, there is too much chance one will call with a pocket pair or something in my opinion.

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I bet the flop for t250, it's a nice situation because it looks so much like a bluff due to the 5 checks ahead, and therefore you'll get worse hands than usual looking you up, I'm probably going to the felt with this hand if I'm raised... just because I see so often middle pocket pairs coming over the top, thinking you're buying the pot.

PF I also limp along, I'm on the button and the pot is nice, I'll happily take a flop, I agree that folding does just seem too weak/tight.

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IMO, a 250 chip bet here from his stack does not look like he's buying the pot at all. If you had 99 for example, and there were 5 other people in the hand, and the flop came ace high, you're gonna check-raise and put him all in? That's nuts.

[liucipher]

Umm, this may sound stupid but I want to make sure I have the intuition right.

You would respect an early position limper more than a late position limper, correct?

My thinking: early positioning warrants stronger hands to be limped than in later positions where those should be raised

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I bet the flop for t250, it's a nice situation because it looks so much like a bluff due to the 5 checks ahead, and therefore you'll get worse hands than usual looking you up, I'm probably going to the felt with this hand if I'm raised... just because I see so often middle pocket pairs coming over the top, thinking you're buying the pot.

PF I also limp along, I'm on the button and the pot is nice, I'll happily take a flop, I agree that folding does just seem too weak/tight.

[/ QUOTE ]

IMO, a 250 chip bet here from his stack does not look like he's buying the pot at all. If you had 99 for example, and there were 5 other people in the hand, and the flop came ace high, you're gonna check-raise and put him all in? That's nuts.

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No, I'm not saying I would do that... HOWEVER, I do see this happen quite a lot. (although saying that it maybe because I'm at the $10 SNGs at the moment!)

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Fold on the button with ATo and three limpers..? Seems awful weak-tight to me. Well, anyway, you have to bet this I think, for value if nothing else. I hate how it's a dry flop though so AJ/AQ/AK could be in there (though the last two, you would hope, would raise pf). I don't agree with pushing though. There's absolutely no need.

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Do you mean that you don't like pushing pf or on the flop? I'm not sure what to do on the flop other than push. Even if I only bet 200, I'm down to 445, and I'm certainly going to call any push. I suppose that 445 isn't an unreasonably low number, so maybe 200 would be a good bet.

Thanks,
Will

P.S. In an $11, I pretty much assume that AJ-AK are going to be raise pf, although I do run into AK and AQ (but not AJ) limped often enough to at least think about this. However, I usually don't worry about it unless I have a particular read.