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View Full Version : Is this stupid? or a clever way to accumulate chips?


AceofSpades
12-13-2005, 09:54 PM
FLOP: K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 4 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

MP3 - Kx?
Villain: 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif K/images/graemlins/heart.gif 0.565%
HERO: A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 0.435%

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Button (t1720)
Hero (t1655)
BB (t6133)
UTG (t6040)
UTG+1 (t2090)
MP1 (t2195)
MP2 (t1650)
MP3 (t4740)
CO (t2560)

Preflop: Hero is SB with T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises to t200</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Button calls t200, Hero calls t150, BB calls t100.

Flop: (t800) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
Hero checks, BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets t800</font>, Button calls t800, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t1455</font>, BB folds, MP3 folds, Button calls t655.

Final Pot: t4510

I was hoping MP3 would come along for the ride here...

reecelights
12-13-2005, 10:00 PM
This would be better if you had two overcards, on say a 944 flop. This makes you a favorite on the hand if villain doesn't have KK-99.

A_PLUS
12-13-2005, 11:35 PM
Ironically, this is more of a value call than a 'move' per se.

Assuming all of the chips are going in of you and the Button, you only need about 33% equity to make this call. I think you can feel good about having at least that.

Now, that being said. Normally, you would have a decision to make here. With the decision being wether or not you want both players in to maximize equity, or structure the hand, to have the most F.E.

Here, it is tough, a decent bet by either player is likely to be pot comitting, and a push is a little drastic. Given what you did is fine, both should have been along for the ride. I think the EV of an open push and a CR push is pretty close. I lean towards your line, b/c it is the higher Variance of the two lines, and given your stack size I think variance has some inherent value.

stone_7
12-14-2005, 01:37 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I lean towards your line, b/c it is the higher Variance of the two lines, and given your stack size I think variance has some inherent value.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think I understand this at all but I am going to try to explain it to make sure I get it.

Variance is a measure of how far the potential outcomes are likely to be from the average outcome. By increasing variance in this situation you are increasing the likely hood of going broke and of tripling up. Is this correct? The average outcome is unchanged because after enough times you will still average out to the same point. This happens even though you have given up the "value" you gain by inducing a fold of a better hand because you will more often win everybody's chips.

A_PLUS
12-14-2005, 03:47 AM
Yeah.

Pushing folds out weak Kings, TT, etc. So we win a smallish 800 TC pot the majority of the time. The remaining hands, we usually bust, or double up +800

CRing, will lead you to go broke more often. But will have you double-triple up more often as well.

I think the numbers are close enough, that I would chose the second.

I think high variance in this spot is good. B/c 40xBB has a distinct strategic advantage over 15-20BB. I think you can be more profitable more so than a chip count would suggest.

So, I give that result more positive weight. Meaning that the high variance line (which leads to a 40+xBB stack more often, will has an 'extra' value to me.