Horribly played AK

[bizaff]

Villain is 10.6/1.8/1.2

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Hero ($105.20)
Button ($96.80)
SB ($24)
BB ($27)
UTG ($99)
UTG+1 ($169.80)
MP1 ($68.20)
MP2 ($37.20)
MP3 ($181)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. SB posts a blind of $0.50.
UTG calls $1, UTG+1 calls $1, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls $1, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises to $5</font>, Hero calls $5, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, UTG calls $4, UTG+1 folds, MP2 folds.

Flop: ($18.50) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets $12</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $40</font>, UTG folds, MP3 calls $164 (All-In), Hero folds.

Final Pot: $234.50

Results:
No showdown. MP3 wins $234.50.

Where did I go wrong? Let me esplain. No, there is too much - let me sum up.

Actually I'll let everyone else flame away first, then post my thoughts. Any other alternatives on the flop?

call? the way you played it is fine too though. i don't like playing tptk for a big pot so I'm more inclined to call the flop, call/check the turn and call/bet the river.

[EMcWilliams]

[ QUOTE ]
call?I'm more inclined to call the flop, call/check the turn and call/bet the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is probably your best plan here, as long as the bets are not huge in comparision to the pot.

I like the way you played it. You found out early just where you were at, and probably saved yourself some money.

[PoBoy321]

Looks fine to me.

[Bukem_]

Its not so bad.

Against super nits, I might fold Ak preflop though.

How about villians stats (10.6/1.8/1.2). This guy is pretty tight even for 9-handed. He raises pre-flop less than 2% of the time. So, 5xBB PFR, I dont put him on K10. Maybe QJs but I doubt it. This sure looks like AA, KK, or AK. So, at best, you have a push. His post flop aggression is only 1.2 and he moves all in for $164.00. I cant fold my hand quick enough here.

I also would have only made it $30 instead of $40. With villian being this tight a $30 bet (e.g., pot-sized) will let you know where you stand and also save you $10 if he moves all in.

Thoughts?

[beavens]

TPTK i think i wouldve just called.

.edit the original flop bet, not the AI.

[Guin]

I think you fold this preflop without a second thought based on those stats... I am more interested in calling with a small SC or suited one gappers vs. AK which probably won't improve vs. villians starting hands. If you had 78s or 68s you either hit hard and stack him or easily fold to any bet.

Guin

I probably play it the same except that I would have raised the flop to only $30-36, which would have saved you a few bucks but not a big deal.

Let me offer another way to play this hand though. You are either WA/WB here, right? I don't think a tight player is raising Q-J here, so he probably has A-K or a big pair. And a tight player like this might make a CB on the flop, but would probably shut down once he gets called. So you could have just called the flop and then see what he does on the turn. If he continued to bet the turn strong, you can fold being pretty sure he has at least A-K. That line only costs you $12. Of course, if he checks the turn, you bet and take it down against his likely QQ or JJ.

Again, I probably play it the way you do, but this is another possibility.

[pokernose]

I fold pre-flop. This guy doesn't get in there and play many hands, and he normally plays them weakly. If your hand is good, you won't make much money. Since he is putting you to the challenge in a big pot, you are way behind. There are better ways to earn money than taking on a guy like this with TPTK.

[wslee00]

i think you played it just fine...

[bizaff]

I dunno. I waver back and forth. While I was playing it, I knew I had to fold and not be happy. Then I looked at it later and folding just seemed wrong.

I felt my main problem was folding after putting a little under half my stack in. If I had another $20-$30, it wouldn't seem so bad.

I think a number of people picked out what I think is the key play - fold pre-flop. Against someone playing 10% of his hands and raising less than 2% of his hands, AK just isn't worth it. If I'm going to call, I should be calling with pairs to catch a set.

Thanks for the replies.

[J Chap]

EDIT: oops - I was thinking of a different AK thread: the current AK preflop thread. anyway, i'll leave this nugget of brilliance, FWIW.

[ QUOTE ]
I dunno. I waver back and forth. While I was playing it, I knew I had to fold and not be happy. Then I looked at it later and folding just seemed wrong.


[/ QUOTE ]

One thing I always tell myself: Don't let other people's bad plays make you second-guess your good plays.

When deciding whether or not you should have called, you should NOT be considering:
A) The fact that the donks behind you subsequently decided to call with all kinds of garbage

AND ESPECIALLY
B) the fact that you would have come out on top in this particular hand.

JMHO

jchap

[Finite_Risk]

Just because you put almost half your stack in is NOT a reason to feel you should have called here.

Villian's stats CLEARLY indicate you are buried here - he is not taking this line with QQ

However, stack sizes are a consideration on whether or not to raise the flop - I dont want to take a raise/fold to reraise line with half my stack. Thus, I'd just call the flop...I am also releasing this on the turn to any significant pressure

[bizaff]

[ QUOTE ]
Just because you put almost half your stack in is NOT a reason to feel you should have called here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Strictly speaking, I agree.

[ QUOTE ]
Villian's stats CLEARLY indicate you are buried here - he is not taking this line with QQ

However, stack sizes are a consideration on whether or not to raise the flop - I dont want to take a raise/fold to reraise line with half my stack. Thus, I'd just call the flop...I am also releasing this on the turn to any significant pressure

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what I'm really getting at. I should NOT raise to $40 unless I'm willing to go all the way with this. I probably salvaged my stack, but at the cost of almost half of it.

Based on his stats, the real mistake is the preflop call.

[ QUOTE ]
How about villians stats (10.6/1.8/1.2). This guy is pretty tight even for 9-handed. He raises pre-flop less than 2% of the time. So, 5xBB PFR, I dont put him on K10. Maybe QJs but I doubt it. This sure looks like AA, KK, or AK. So, at best, you have a push. His post flop aggression is only 1.2 and he moves all in for $164.00. I cant fold my hand quick enough here.

I also would have only made it $30 instead of $40. With villian being this tight a $30 bet (e.g., pot-sized) will let you know where you stand and also save you $10 if he moves all in.

Thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Totally agree. Against a weak/tight opponent who shows this much aggression TPTK is no good. In fact, if all he had was TPTK, he probably folds to the Hero's raise. Also, you don't need to raise a large amount against a W/T to find out where you're at. A min-raise will usually tell you everything you need to know.

Edit: BTW, against this guy, I'm either re-raising or folding my AK to his PF. Probably folding.

Folding preflop is an interesting and now seemingly more profitable play. If you hit and he doesn't, you probably won't get much out of him. I suppose you usually want to call raises w/ hands that have a chance of hitting huge, and being more "masked". I never thought that folding AK might be a better idea.

However, as played, I fold too, grit my teeth, and reload. I say TT here, and in VERY rare cases, KK. But I say more than TPTK 95% of the time with this guy.