against my villian - live 8-16 - HAND 3

[brick]

Hand 3)
EP raises (average player), Mp calls, LP (PFGP-post flop good player from last hand) cold calls, I call with Ac8c from BB.
4 ways for 2 bets.
Flop: 9s8d3c
I check, EP bets, 1 fold, PFGP raises, I c/3-bet with second pair, EP calls.
PFGP calls.
Turn: Js
I bet (almost all in 1/2 bet left), EP folds, PFGP raises.
I call.

[crunchy1]

[ QUOTE ]
(almost all in 1/2 bet left)

[/ QUOTE ]
WTF?!?

[brick]

Sorry man. I don't like to lose more than 25BB.
As long as you know how to adjust for your all-in hand you can still make +ev decisions.

[djhoneybear]

What kind of evaluation are you looking for? Calling three bets with middle pair and a backdoor flush draw is spewing chips. Betting out on the turn to get the rest of your chips in is a donation.

[crunchy1]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry man. I don't like to lose more than 25BB.
As long as you know how to adjust for your all-in hand you can still make +ev decisions.

[/ QUOTE ]
All 3 hands that you posted from this game (the AJo hand being the least of which) are marginal, variance-increasing situations that you put yourself in. For you to post these hands and then proclaim that you don't like to lose more than 25BB is completely contradictory. If you're going to play a little loose and try to push some small edges that's fine. If you're going to play a little loose and then walk away from good games just because you're down a little bit -I'm pretty certain this is a good road to long-term losing.

[Aces McGee]

Why'd you check/3-bet middle pair this time and bet/fold it in hand 2?

-McGee

[brick]

This is actually helpful if you think so. I put EP on big cards and LP on a draw. She would be very happy to raise a draw in this situation.

[brick]

I have been losing so maybe your right.
Would you say I should tone it down peflop to stay out of these marginal situations?

[brick]

[ QUOTE ]
Why'd you check/3-bet middle pair this time and bet/fold it in hand 2?

[/ QUOTE ]

In hand 2 I was raised by a new player to the table on a board that had less possible draws.

In hand 3 I was raised by a known agressive player and I could put EP on big cards at least some percentage of the time.

[brick]

[ QUOTE ]
Calling three bets with middle pair and a backdoor flush draw is spewing chips.

[/ QUOTE ]
I should clarify that I 3 bet the flop.

[ QUOTE ]
I have been losing so maybe your right.
Would you say I should tone it down peflop to stay out of these marginal situations?

[/ QUOTE ]

Pre-flop is a great place to start.

...but your post flop need some serious help, too, if this is evident of it.

I still don't understand the 3 bet on the flop at all.

[crunchy1]

[ QUOTE ]
I have been losing so maybe your right.
Would you say I should tone it down peflop to stay out of these marginal situations?

[/ QUOTE ]
I definitely think that you should be tightening up some. I say this given the level your post-flop play seems to be at.

Do you also quit when you're ahead 25BBs? If you go up 25BBs on the first hand and then come back down to even after an hour do you quit? At that point you would've lost 25BBs.

It concerns me why you're only willing to lose 25BBs. Poker, especially hold'em and especially LIVE where the games are so loose is a high-variance proposition. If $450 is a lot for you to lose psychologically - then perhaps you should be playing in a smaller game. The same advice applies if the reasoning is that you don't truely have the bankroll to be playing 9/18.

[brick]

[ QUOTE ]
given the level your post-flop play seems to be at.

[/ QUOTE ]
Could you please recommend how you would play each of these hands?

[ QUOTE ]

It concerns me why you're only willing to lose 25BBs.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't play as well after I loose 25bb. I like to come back refocused for the next session.
Yes, I have the bankroll and understand the swings.

[onegymrat]

Hi brick,

I don't like the 3-bet on the flop. Sure, they could be drawing but the situation is dire at best. It almost seems as if you played so aggressively just because you were almost all in. I see this is many opponents and it is a very low-quality play.

I understand what you're trying to do, putting EP on overcards and PFGP on a draw. However, you are opening yourself up to a cap as well, should EP or PFGP actually have a handl. Okay, they only called the flop, good. The turn is horrible for you. This sets up draws that hit as well as redraws on the river which will only hurt you.

The best play was to dump on the flop and avoid trouble.

[brick]

Thanks for the good response.

As some of the other posters have stated I'm getting myself into more marginal situations than I should. On this hand was I was likely biased towards staying in the hand because my pair of eights would have been good on the previous A8s hand.

I want improve my game but maybe that means I just call with A8s preflop from LP after a limper.
This way I could more comfortably fold second pair on the flop.

[MN_Mime]

I think the biggest reservation with this is that when you allow yourself to become short-stacked, you can't extract value for your hands and overall that's -EV.

The best example I can think of is you get dealt an innocent looking PP, spike your set on the flop but inexplicably get action from draws or overcards. You can't protect/isolate, you're all-in for a portion of the pot, and someone else walks off with your side-pot on the more expensive streets. That swag is what buffers your inevitable losses while you wait out a string where your edge for superior play finally overcomes the high-variance of small samples.

A budget is cool and admirable. Just walk away when you don't have enough to play a good hand or reload. You're just giving away money playing like this.