Learning Weird Stuff About Yourself

I just thought I'd share a weird story about myself. OOT'ers are welcome to contribute similar things.

A little background first. I've always been one of the smartest people in my age. I learned to read early, learned math really early, and just have a pretty interconnected way of thinking. I've been in highly advanced classes since 1st grade.

Fast foward to now. About to finish high school, still in advanced classes, still near the top of the school, still feel smarter than every other dumb teenager.

But it turns out, I wasn't always like this. In fact, I didn't speak until I was about 3. I would say words, but never complete sentences. Obviously concerned, my parents took me to be examined by a doctor. They thought I was mentally retarded. Not just learning disabled; really mentally retarded. Apparently, the doctor asked to talk to me alone. My parents said he came out about half an hour later, and said "There's nothing wrong with him; he's just shy." Then I started talking, and had actually already taught myself to read, and my parents didn't even know it! I was shocked to learn this. If they hadn't taken me to that doctor, would I have been put in "special" classes? Would I have become just a complete loner who never speaks? It really kind of freaked me out to know that I could have been pretty much the exact opposite person I am now had my parents not taken me to that doctor.

I crapped my pants until I was 13. my parents thought I was retarded too. Turns out, I just liked the way it felt and I had already taught myself to crap in a toilet when I was 4 months old.

[miajag81]

[ QUOTE ]
I crapped my pants until I was 13. my parents thought I was retarded too. Turns out, I just liked the way it felt and I had already taught myself to crap in a toilet when I was 4 months old.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's kind of sad. And by sad I mean awesome.

[whiskeytown]

I have found there is a strong history of mental illness and addiction in my family.

I suspected my immediate family, but apparently some grandparents were institutionalized as well back in the day for psychological/bipolar/depression/mania and all that.

That caught me off guard, but made me feel a bit like all my screwed up life wasn't ENTIRELY my fault - we appear to have a genetic tendency towards certain behaviors...family tradition.

Oh, and when I was a baby I was so fat I used to roll before I learned how to crawl, so I understand - and I was reading so well as a 6 year old they let me go to other classes in the 2nd and 3rd grade for certain stuff like math and reading - I never did get to skip the WHOLE grade though. I found out my Mom thought it would stunt my growth and killed the idea - but it was proposed by the School and I never knew it till a couple years ago - LOL

god, I was picked on so much in HS as it was, being a year younger would NOT have helped.

RB

[miajag81]

Kind of along similar lines to the OP:

I stopped growing for a year when I was 5. Kept eating, etc., just no growing at all for a whole year. My parents took me to several doctors because they were afraid I would be a midget or something. I eventually started growing again but had fallen behind others my age and was always very small for my age until I hit my growth spurt in 7th-8th grade.

Also, for a few months when I was 8 or 9 I inexplicably starting interchanging W's and R's, Elmer Fudd-style. My parents kept asking me if I had hit my head or something, and I was terrified that I had a brain tumor or was retarded. One day I just returned to saying W's and R's normally again.

[mason55]

You probably just saved >50% of OOT from having to tell their stories.

[daryn]

once when i was too young to remember, i accidentally stepped on a cake my mother had made for a family function.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
once when i was too young to remember, i accidentally stepped on a cake my mother had made for a family function.

[/ QUOTE ]

I pooped under the Christmas tree.

[miajag81]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
once when i was too young to remember, i accidentally stepped on a cake my mother had made for a family function.

[/ QUOTE ]

I pooped under the Christmas tree.

[/ QUOTE ]

I peed in the fireplace once in front of a bunch of my parents' friends.

[StacysMom]

OP: I do not believe you tought yourself to read.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
once when i was too young to remember, i accidentally stepped on a cake my mother had made for a family function.

[/ QUOTE ]

I pooped under the Christmas tree.

[/ QUOTE ]

I peed in the fireplace once in front of a bunch of my parents' friends.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, I meant tonight. But it was really a weird thing to learn I didnt need to be drunk to do this.

[Blarg]

This kind of story is less rare than you think. A lot of people have been put in special ed classes and thought retarded for actual physical deficits, like being deaf or hard of hearing, or having really bad eyesight so they can't really see or notice what other people are doing.

And sometimes the kids just have unusual personalities, or the parents are even at fault for their own personality problems.

It sounds like you were just told about this by your parents, rather than it being a memory. It's cool your parents told you; that's worth sharing.

And it's definitely a little creepy that sometimes it's only a bit of luck in life that keeps pretty bad things from happening to you.

[ QUOTE ]
I crapped my pants until I was 13[ QUOTE ]
That's kind of sad. And by sad I mean awesome.

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

And by awesome he means f**king retarded.

I suppose I phrashed that wrong. First of all, I remember none of this; it's all my parents talking. When my mom told me this, I said the same thing. How did I teach myself to read? The only explanation my mom has is this. They would read to me every night and I learned just by watching the pages. She says that she never tried to teach me. And, it's not like I was writing papers on Socialist art movements. I knew the alphabets and basic words. And if you still don't believe me, then blame my parents. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[dblgutshot]

My family is chinese. I was born here, and speak english only. Apparently though, I learned to speak Chinese before English. After a while I switched languages and lost one.

[Blarg]

When I was like 2, my mom told me I used to be crazy for hard boiled eggs. Which always struck me as strange, because I haven't been crazy about them since. She also said I was speaking in complete sentences before I was a year old. They tried to get me to skip a grade or even two when I was in grade school a few times, and to sign me up for college when I was in high school, but each time my parents wanted none of it.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
My family is chinese. I was born here, and speak english only. Apparently though, I learned to speak Chinese before English. After a while I switched languages and lost one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very common. English wasn't my first language either, but sometimes I dream in my original language and can understand extended stretches of it, yet can put together only a word or two on my own.

[man]

when I was 19 I smoked weed for the first time and had a pretty bad panic attack. this was the first panic attack I've ever had. I woke up the next morning with depersonification, which is when you don't feel like you're in your body, and that persisted for about six weeks. I saw a few therapists, thought I was going insane, and spent the next six months in an anxious, neurotic cycle. it was probably the worst thing that's ever happened to me. I also developed somniphobia, and started getting sleep paralysis.

my doctors told me I have mild generalized anxiety, which i never knew before. I don't really know what that means, but I guess I just worry all the time. I guess I just need to get laid.

[flatline]

[ QUOTE ]
when I was 19 I smoked weed for the first time and had a pretty bad panic attack. this was the first panic attack I've ever had. I woke up the next morning with depersonification, which is when you don't feel like you're in your body, and that persisted for about six weeks. I saw a few therapists, thought I was going insane, and spent the next six months in an anxious, neurotic cycle. it was probably the worst thing that's ever happened to me. I also developed somniphobia, and started getting sleep paralysis.

my doctors told me I have mild generalized anxiety, which i never knew before. I don't really know what that means, but I guess I just worry all the time. I guess I just need to get laid.

[/ QUOTE ]

That always happens when you smoke weed the first time- you should give it another shot.

[Blarg]

I think he was telling you to get the hell out of his office.

[ChipWrecked]

[ QUOTE ]
I crapped my pants until I was 13. my parents thought I was retarded too. Turns out, I just liked the way it felt and I had already taught myself to crap in a toilet when I was 4 months old.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have no problem believing any of this. Well, I don't believe that last part.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
She also said I was speaking in complete sentences before I was a year old. They tried to get me to skip a grade or even two when I was in grade school a few times, and to sign me up for college when I was in high school, but each time my parents wanted none of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

im like this, only my parents chose to skip grades rather than not. made a huge, huge difference.

[craig r]

[ QUOTE ]
when I was 19 I smoked weed for the first time and had a pretty bad panic attack. this was the first panic attack I've ever had. I woke up the next morning with depersonification, which is when you don't feel like you're in your body, and that persisted for about six weeks. I saw a few therapists, thought I was going insane, and spent the next six months in an anxious, neurotic cycle. it was probably the worst thing that's ever happened to me. I also developed somniphobia, and started getting sleep paralysis.

my doctors told me I have mild generalized anxiety, which i never knew before. I don't really know what that means, but I guess I just worry all the time. I guess I just need to get laid.

[/ QUOTE ]

When I was 16 I flipped out on shrooms. It was one of the worst experiences I have ever had. I had never flipped out on shrooms, acid, or pot ever before that. I never did shrooms or acid since then, but somtimes I would feel like i did when I was flipping out. I finally saw a shrink a year later and was told that the shrooms had nothing to do with it and that I had generalized anxiety disorder. I took it seriously then, but now, I am told that I have other things that seem like anxiety but aren't. Anyways...I doubt the pot was the cause of your anxiety, just like the shrooms weren't the cause of mine. It is more likely that these things brought on our attacks. Wow, OOT, for fun and a healing group.

craig

[astroglide]

you didn't teach yourself to read

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
She also said I was speaking in complete sentences before I was a year old. They tried to get me to skip a grade or even two when I was in grade school a few times, and to sign me up for college when I was in high school, but each time my parents wanted none of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

im like this, only my parents chose to skip grades rather than not. made a huge, huge difference.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cool, I wish it had been that way for me. If I would ever have kids, I'd let them go for it and try to reach the heights of their abilities. I'd be thrilled for them.

[Reef]

I thought I had black eyes until my teen years when I went up close to a mirror and checked. Whadya know? I have dk. brown eyes.

wow, I'm so glad to get that off my chest

[astroglide]

it's sorta hard to un-ring that bell once it starts though. grade-skipping can have big social effects, especially once they start to come out of grade school. it would be a tough thing for me to assess.

[Blarg]

It's my opinion that all drugs, or booze, can do is spark whatever is inside you anyway.

"I wouldn't have done that, but I was so drunk." Yeah, right. Works great for both guys and gals. Guys: Yes, it's not the booze, you really are a jerk and no one cares that you drank first. Gals: Yes, you're not really this kind of girl, of course, we know that.

That's why really uptight people often freak out the most. They've got a lot more inside that they can't deal with and need to repress, and when it comes out all at once, BOOM.

[craig r]

[ QUOTE ]
It's my opinion that all drugs, or booze, can do is spark whatever is inside you anyway.

"I wouldn't have done that, but I was so drunk." Yeah, right. Works great for both guys and gals. Guys: Yes, it's not the booze, you really are a jerk and no one cares that you drank first. Gals: Yes, you're not really this kind of girl, of course, we know that.

That's why really uptight people often freak out the most. They've got a lot more inside that they can't deal with and need to repress, and when it comes out all at once, BOOM.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. The problem with them being onset because of drugs is it can cause misdiagnoses. But, I am convinced most Psychiatrists open the DSM-IV and point at whatever page and that is what you have. Well not really, but it seems that way.

craig

[man]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
when I was 19 I smoked weed for the first time and had a pretty bad panic attack. this was the first panic attack I've ever had. I woke up the next morning with depersonification, which is when you don't feel like you're in your body, and that persisted for about six weeks. I saw a few therapists, thought I was going insane, and spent the next six months in an anxious, neurotic cycle. it was probably the worst thing that's ever happened to me. I also developed somniphobia, and started getting sleep paralysis.

my doctors told me I have mild generalized anxiety, which i never knew before. I don't really know what that means, but I guess I just worry all the time. I guess I just need to get laid.

[/ QUOTE ]

When I was 16 I flipped out on shrooms. It was one of the worst experiences I have ever had. I had never flipped out on shrooms, acid, or pot ever before that. I never did shrooms or acid since then, but somtimes I would feel like i did when I was flipping out. I finally saw a shrink a year later and was told that the shrooms had nothing to do with it and that I had generalized anxiety disorder. I took it seriously then, but now, I am told that I have other things that seem like anxiety but aren't. Anyways...I doubt the pot was the cause of your anxiety, just like the shrooms weren't the cause of mine. It is more likely that these things brought on our attacks. Wow, OOT, for fun and a healing group.

craig

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah I don't think all of my anxiety was caused by pot, it just caused it to spike for a brief period of time, which was enough to set of a cycle.

the pot experience was bad, but I can't even imagine what a bad trip would be like. panic attacks + dragons and spiders = nothing good

[Blarg]

You can never undo anything, but I think some things can be well worth trying anyway. And not doing them equally has an effect. There's really no way out of consequences; you just gotta choose which ones you think might be best.

In this case, consequences can be not only wasting years of life, but making a kid feel totally bored and unchallenged in that time, right when he's at the greatest potential to learn he will ever have. He can get a huge leg up in life if he's allowed to develop his brain to full capacity rather than put it in cold storage for years on end.

Heck, I slept through a lot of school because I was so bored with it. Getting good grades was not a problem, but not a reward or particularly satisfying either. I just felt basically warehoused.

Lots of kids develop behavior problems and even do things like turn to crime and drugs just out of boredom. I don't think it's healthy to leave a kid's mind on ice, and I know it's not satisfying to the kid at all. Nobody wants to live in a void with no mental stimulation, and it can't be good for you.

I think this is something the kid should really have a bigger say in. If he doesn't want to do it or feels uncomfortable doing it, I wouldn't force him. But if he's excited by the idea or finds it a relief, well, it could well be taking the good with the bad. There's bad no matter what the decision. For me, I'd say if a kid has a chance to achieve and challenge himself, let him do it. Whether that kid was me, or if I had a kid.

If he would want to step back down a bit for either social reasons or because it feels intellectually too hard, that would be cool, and it would always be possible. Let kids find their own limits, I think, and encourage them to enjoy testing them, if that's what they like.

I think the potential wasted otherwise can be just incredible.

[gamblore99]

[ QUOTE ]
it's sorta hard to un-ring that bell once it starts though. grade-skipping can have big social effects, especially once they start to come out of grade school. it would be a tough thing for me to assess.

[/ QUOTE ]

Psych surveys of kids who skip grades show it to be very positive. Very few thought it had a negative effect on their social life, and just about all of them said they would put their kid ahead if he/she was gifted too. Only about 3% regretted going ahead, and felt it was a bad idea.

People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well. Surrounding them with more socially competent adults is good for them.

[scotty34]

[ QUOTE ]
People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well. Surrounding them with more socially competent adults is good for them.


[/ QUOTE ]

You can't possibly consider high school kids to be anything close to socially competent adults.

[Blarg]

I believe this makes sense. Say you're in the 3rd grade reading at a 7th grade level or whatever. There are big jumps in the way kids think even a couple years apart, and between the smarter and dumber kids in the same grade who really belong there. Now if you're able to think as if you were several years older than your peers, you have an awful lot less to talk to them and relate to them about. You're just interested in different things. The social handicaps can well lie not in moving ahead, but in staying where you don't really belong and just being very out of place right there.

And being mentally unstimulated for years on end with your schoolwork, a major part of your life, can't be good for a kid. A mind is like a muscle, and needs stimulation. I believe some very real potential can be lost when it sits fallow for years on end, and the kid's life can be diminished. I know from personal experience that it will leave him incredibly bored all the time. With the right combo of circumstances, he might even come to feel school is stupid, and that's a bad way of thinking to let sink into a kid's head.

[craig r]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
when I was 19 I smoked weed for the first time and had a pretty bad panic attack. this was the first panic attack I've ever had. I woke up the next morning with depersonification, which is when you don't feel like you're in your body, and that persisted for about six weeks. I saw a few therapists, thought I was going insane, and spent the next six months in an anxious, neurotic cycle. it was probably the worst thing that's ever happened to me. I also developed somniphobia, and started getting sleep paralysis.

my doctors told me I have mild generalized anxiety, which i never knew before. I don't really know what that means, but I guess I just worry all the time. I guess I just need to get laid.

[/ QUOTE ]

When I was 16 I flipped out on shrooms. It was one of the worst experiences I have ever had. I had never flipped out on shrooms, acid, or pot ever before that. I never did shrooms or acid since then, but somtimes I would feel like i did when I was flipping out. I finally saw a shrink a year later and was told that the shrooms had nothing to do with it and that I had generalized anxiety disorder. I took it seriously then, but now, I am told that I have other things that seem like anxiety but aren't. Anyways...I doubt the pot was the cause of your anxiety, just like the shrooms weren't the cause of mine. It is more likely that these things brought on our attacks. Wow, OOT, for fun and a healing group.

craig

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah I don't think all of my anxiety was caused by pot, it just caused it to spike for a brief period of time, which was enough to set of a cycle.

the pot experience was bad, but I can't even imagine what a bad trip would be like. panic attacks + dragons and spiders = nothing good

[/ QUOTE ]

There was no bad hallucinations, it was just the feeling that was horrible. But, I think it was eventually going to happen to me either way. The shrooms just set it off. Or it was a coincidence. The thing that doesn't make sense, is that anxiety disorders generally get worse as one gets older and doesn't treat it. Which is one of the reasons I said I might have been misdiagnosed.

craig

craig

[imported_anacardo]

Turns out: My name is a killing word.

So I got that going for me, which is nice.

[Blarg]

Depends an awful lot on the kid and on the adult. Many adults never reach social competency. Some reach it very late. Some have to have kids before they pull their heads out of their butts and finally realize the universe is not just the setting for one big personal tantrum. And for others even that doesn't work.

The difference between a smart 11th grader and your average college kid is often not much at all. And it often wouldn't matter, either, as college is much more businesslike and to the point than high school is. You can get in and get out and being smart actually becomes an asset, not a handicap, for the first time in some kids' lives.

I was thrilled to leave the high school experience behind. All the smarter kids I knew felt it was a huge relief not to be in the imbecilic atmosphere of high school anymore. Once we got into college, we got a much better taste of what being a human being was about.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
it's sorta hard to un-ring that bell once it starts though. grade-skipping can have big social effects, especially once they start to come out of grade school. it would be a tough thing for me to assess.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is a really complicated issue, and both you and blarg have true points. ive thought about it tons and still dont know where i stand. its hard to draw conclusions from my own life, im really happy with the person ive become and my intellectual level but during middle school and a lot of HS socially it was a huge mistake.

there are so many complicating factors, the HS i went to was a pretty bad choice, my parents are kind of crazy, and there are a lot of things ive benefitted and learned from which you can't plan or force into a kids life. (poker is one of those things ive benefitted from in many ways, more than $$, i mean who could see that coming?) and maybe ive turned into a smart person now for the same reasons i was skipped in the first place, being skipped might not have made me a smarter person, just because i think i am now doesn't mean it contributed to it.

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it's sorta hard to un-ring that bell once it starts though. grade-skipping can have big social effects, especially once they start to come out of grade school. it would be a tough thing for me to assess.

[/ QUOTE ]

Psych surveys of kids who skip grades show it to be very positive. Very few thought it had a negative effect on their social life, and just about all of them said they would put their kid ahead if he/she was gifted too. Only about 3% regretted going ahead, and felt it was a bad idea.

People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well. Surrounding them with more socially competent adults is good for them.

[/ QUOTE ]

i pretty much disagree with everything in this post except for the last sentence.

[imported_anacardo]

I'm maybe the only skipped-ahead kid I know who thoroughly enjoyed most of high school. I was a comic legend, I generally had a blast in sports & extracurriculars, frustrating though they often were, and I had some improbable teachers come out of the woodwork of a nondescript Texas public school district to become very positive influences on my life. I felt the need for my share of rebellion, but I'm a natural rebel, so that would have happened anywhere. College was a letdown, in a lot of ways.

[Blarg]

I think sometimes adults idealize things, or maybe they just try to forget. Worrying that your kid might not like school if he skips is kind of forgetting what school is like for most everybody, by my reckoning.

It's pretty normal to not like high school, or school at any level, at least very very big parts of it. The worry that your kid might find it in many ways unpleasant is pretty much guaranteed to pan out whether you skip him some grades or not.

[craig r]

What part of Texas?

craig

[imported_anacardo]

Whitehouse, Texas. Population ~4900, at the time. Ever so slightly sou'east of Tyler, which is itself some ninety miles east of Dallas. The home of miserable football teams and generation after generation of delicious prom queen hopefuls, thus making away games there an utter delight for the visiting team. Your classic semirural bedroom community for, despite their many charms dear to my heart, perhaps the most fascist city in the most fascist state in the Union.

Any further questions?

[craig r]

[ QUOTE ]
Whitehouse, Texas. Population ~4900, at the time. Ever so slightly sou'east of Tyler, which is itself some ninety miles east of Dallas. The home of miserable football teams and generation after generation of delicious prom queen hopefuls, thus making away games there an utter delight for the visiting team. Your classic semirural bedroom community for, despite their many charms dear to my heart, perhaps the most fascist city in the most fascist state in the Union.

Any further questions?

[/ QUOTE ]

Most fascist in Texas? I grew up in Houston. Have you ever dealt with the police there? I also went to college in Huntsville. My apartment was right across the street from where they did the executions. One time I was driving right outside of Huntsville and I see a few fires in the distance, but they seemed fairly controlled. Well, I guess the Klan was having one of their meetings. I wanted to join in the fun, but I guess they don't have affirmative action.

craig

[Popinjay]

My roommate told me I talk in my sleep. Not just a few words here and there but full on paragraphs that are supposedly unrelated. This completely freaked me out for some reason.

[imported_anacardo]

Ooh. Huntsville. [censored], tough to argue with that one. I blew up my car's engine (don't ask; it took a very interesting collaborating set of circumstances to pull that one of) in Livingston, on Highway 59, up that way; one of the most miserable nights of my life was spent in the town's one all-night diner, listening to two awful [censored] cow-people berate their retarded son.

[TimM]

[ QUOTE ]
If they hadn't taken me to that doctor, would I have been put in "special" classes? Would I have become just a complete loner who never speaks?

[/ QUOTE ]

Late speaking is not unusual. You would have been fine even if you had never seen this doctor. Even if you somehow got put in special classes at your parents urging, it would have been clear right away that you didn't belong there.

My situation was a little bit similar to yours. I also sort of taught myself to read, by watching all those educational public TV shows, and by watching as my parents read to me. I surprised them by identifying products in stores, and by correcting them if they were reading to me and tried to pull a fast one by shortening the story. I was reciting the entire alphabet by 18 months, and reading on my own by 4 or so. I don't remember much before age 5 or so (after that I remember everything), but this is stuff that was told to me by parents and grandparents and aunts and uncles on both sides, so I'm sure they were not all lying.

Yet when I was having trouble in my early years of school, my parents were sure something was wrong with me. They were worried because I spent the first 4 months of my life in the hospital with pneumonia, and thought that there might have been some brain damage.

Actually my problems in school were caused by total boredom. I was not paying attention and not doing classwork. It was too easy, and too boring. I found other ways to amuse myself and the teachers didn't like this at all, so of course they gave me poor grades.

My parents took me to a doctor, who tested me. He told my parents that I had a very high IQ, and that I needed to be placed in more advanced classes for reading and math. This was done and lasted until about junior high school, when I was pretty much merged back in with the regular "A" group. This was not very good for me.

I am still kind of bitter at the way my education was handled. Not many of my teachers really recognized that I was always going to be among the smartest in the class. They were often surprised when I turned in near perfect scores on those standardized tests they give every year, yet nothing was ever done about it. Year after year, with every new set of teachers it was like starting over. I was underachieving, and bored out of my mind for years. Not much I can do about it now, but if I have kids like this there is no way I will let this happen to them.

[craig r]

[ QUOTE ]
Ooh. Huntsville. [censored], tough to argue with that one. I blew up my car's engine (don't ask; it took a very interesting collaborating set of circumstances to pull that one of) in Livingston, on Highway 59, up that way; one of the most miserable nights of my life was spent in the town's one all-night diner, listening to two awful [censored] cow-people berate their retarded son.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I guess I would rather be stuck in Huntsville than Livingston.

craig

[Blarg]

LOL better hope he doesn't have evil tendencies like me and some old roommates, who would start working our way into another roommate's dreams by starting up conversations with him while he was sleeptalking.

[tonypaladino]

Relating to the discussion about skipping grades and the such,

I spent grammar school and junior high in "gifted" classes and went to what is supposedly the best public high school in the city, and for the most part, I think I am worse off for it.

Socially, I was very shy until I was about 19 years old, and I think a lot of that had to do with things like spending weekday afternoons on the Math Team when I was 12 rather than playing out in the street with everyone else. In high school I was reluctant to make friends with anyone because I was very put off by everyones attitues about school. Imagine an school where 95% of the students were like the crazy girl who freaks out when she gets a 98 instead of a 100 on a test.

Academically, I feel like being in a specialized high school stopped me from developing my knowledge in certain areas. I went into high school being totally interested in computers, physical science and math, but everyone in the school was so far advanced, I felt like I wasn't qualified to participate in these things. I felt like a [censored] and just stopped caring and didn't go to any classes or do any work for most of high school. I was able to graduate with an 80 average through getting 99s and 100s in classes I loved, like Italian and history, and 65's in classes I by all rights should have failed, but since i was friends with the assistant principal got passing grades.

[tonypaladino]

[ QUOTE ]
I have found there is a strong history of mental illness and addiction in my family.

I suspected my immediate family, but apparently some grandparents were institutionalized as well back in the day for psychological/bipolar/depression/mania and all that.

That caught me off guard, but made me feel a bit like all my screwed up life wasn't ENTIRELY my fault - we appear to have a genetic tendency towards certain behaviors...family tradition.


[/ QUOTE ]

It's the same thing with my family. I have relatives a few generations back that were sent away to hospitals, allegedy for TB, but now it is coming to light that most of them were actually put in mental institutions. It also turns out that there is a history of both psychological problems and epliepsy in my family, and since epelectics were treated like mental patients up until the 60's, it is not clear the entire expent of the actually psychological problems that existed, which is a little scary.

I didn't walk til i was 18 months old. I walk fine now. No problem.

When I was 6 this girl showed me her vagina in exchange for her seeing my nutsac. At the time it seemed like a fair trade, but I really think I got the best of it. For whatever reason, I didnt even get a boner! It was probably because I was still confused over the "girls have 3 holes" thing!!

[spamuell]

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She also said I was speaking in complete sentences before I was a year old. They tried to get me to skip a grade or even two when I was in grade school a few times, and to sign me up for college when I was in high school, but each time my parents wanted none of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

im like this, only my parents chose to skip grades rather than not. made a huge, huge difference.

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Cool, I wish it had been that way for me. If I would ever have kids, I'd let them go for it and try to reach the heights of their abilities. I'd be thrilled for them.

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I was in the same boat as you Blarg, I'm so so happy that my parents didn't let me skip grades. I didn't really grow up and stop being a complete dick till about 17-18 and while I might have been forced to before then if I'd skipped grades, it wouldn't have been nearly as fun and I doubt I'd be enjoying myself as much as I am now.

[spamuell]

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People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well.

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Where did you get this from? In my experience, people who are intellectually ahead are more socially conscious and can understand what's going on around them, but are frequently far less socially competent in terms of general interaction.

I'd quite like to see a source if you have one and see how "competence" is defined.

[craig r]

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People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did you get this from? In my experience, people who are intellectually ahead are more socially conscious and can understand what's going on around them, but are frequently far less socially competent in terms of general interaction.

I'd quite like to see a source if you have one and see how "competence" is defined.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are some pretty intelligent people who are not socially conscious at all. I don't even see how the two really fit together.

craig

um, they actually can be mutually exclusive, since alot of social situations arent abled to be reasoned out like someone with a science mind would want to...

I have a genius cousin, total [censored].

My iq is near the same as his, however where he is completely engineering minded, Im more the creative type... maybe there's a link there?

[samjjones]

I always thought I was the second coming of Jesus Christ. Then I broke down and had sex, and said "f-that".

[Gunny Highway]

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People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did you get this from? In my experience, people who are intellectually ahead are more socially conscious and can understand what's going on around them, but are frequently far less socially competent in terms of general interaction.

I'd quite like to see a source if you have one and see how "competence" is defined.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are some pretty intelligent people who are not socially conscious at all. I don't even see how the two really fit together.

craig

[/ QUOTE ]

You can find intelligent people that are very socially competent and very incompetent. But in general I think intelligent people are given more reason to have confidence in themselves when they're young and this carries into their adult lives. Social skills are often a byproduct of confidence. People tend to pick out the intelligent eccentric freaks and act like they're the norm for some reason. Maybe it makes stupid people feel better about themselves.

[Los Feliz Slim]

I was born with a very non-standard "birthmark" on my right cheek. It's not a portwine stain, it actually looks a lot like a scar. I went through gradeschool telling people I was a knife fighter. My other sort-of-cool abnormality is I have a bifid uvula, which means the thing that hangs down at the entrance to my throat is forked. Anyway, I also don't have wisdom teeth and am missing my bottom right molar. Finally, I have extra bones in my ankles and wrists.

Since this had always been the case and nobody had ever made a big deal of it (except dentists over the uvula, because they usually haven't seen one before), I never thought too much of it.

When my wife and I decided to have kids, we went to see a geneticist because my wife has some funky health issues. The geneticist completely ignored my wife and spent the entire time grilling me on my family history, etc. Then, on SATURDAY at 11AM she calls me from her home because she's been thinking about everything I told her and has some more questions and is a little concerned about all my genetic abnormalities.

So, like a moran, I start poking around on the internet. If you lump all my stuff together: missing teeth, bifid uvula, facial deformation, anything online told me that I'm lucky to be functional and should probably be massively developmentally challenged.

So I've got that going for me, which is nice.

[samjjones]

So what was the outcome? Can you guys have kids?

[Los Feliz Slim]

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So what was the outcome? Can you guys have kids?

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank God, the end of the story is anticlimactic. We had a perfect baby daughter, but she had a higher risk than most having a defect like a cleft palate or something like that. My wife needed to have an amnio anyway, so we knew very early on that she was fine.

[jakethebake]

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Yeah, I guess I would rather be stuck in Huntsville than Livingston.

craig

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I have a very fond memory of a bar in Huntsville. The Fox or something like that? A college friend of of a friend of mine bartended there. We drove up from Houston to seem him and ended up having a great time. I wonder what ever happened to her...? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[jba]

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I'm maybe the only skipped-ahead kid I know who thoroughly enjoyed most of high school. I was a comic legend, I generally had a blast in sports & extracurriculars, frustrating though they often were, and I had some improbable teachers come out of the woodwork of a nondescript Texas public school district to become very positive influences on my life. I felt the need for my share of rebellion, but I'm a natural rebel, so that would have happened anywhere. College was a letdown, in a lot of ways.

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I loved high school too and got along well with everyone, not being able to drive until i was basically a senior was a bit of a bummer but with enough driving friends it isn't so bad. most people didn't even know.

[craig r]

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People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did you get this from? In my experience, people who are intellectually ahead are more socially conscious and can understand what's going on around them, but are frequently far less socially competent in terms of general interaction.

I'd quite like to see a source if you have one and see how "competence" is defined.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are some pretty intelligent people who are not socially conscious at all. I don't even see how the two really fit together.

craig

[/ QUOTE ]

You can find intelligent people that are very socially competent and very incompetent. But in general I think intelligent people are given more reason to have confidence in themselves when they're young and this carries into their adult lives. Social skills are often a byproduct of confidence. People tend to pick out the intelligent eccentric freaks and act like they're the norm for some reason. Maybe it makes stupid people feel better about themselves.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't say that intelligent people lacked social skills, I said they aren't always necessarily socially conscious. Those are two different things. And I am also not saying just because you are intelligent, that you are not socially conscious. You could be any combination.

craig

[gamblore99]

Here is the quote of the survery from my textbook. Its more or less what I stated, but slightly off.

"Placing such a [gifted] child with older peers, critics claim may cause her to be socially isolated. Opposing this view is the fact that very bright children often seek the company of older children and adults. According to Terman (1954) one of the earliest leaders in the study of the gifted child, bright children are usually far ahead of their age-mates, not just intellectually, but socially and physically as well. Recent evidence suggests that Terman was probably right! Apparently, bright children are not viewd as"nerds" or rejected by their peers, nor do they confront unusual problems of social adjustment. Richardson and benbow (1990) assessed social development among 1,247 gifted children in accelerated education programs, comparing these young people with a group of gifted peers who were in regular classrooms. All of these children were identified between the ages of 12-14 years and then evaulued for social-emotional adjustment at 18 years and again at 23 years. Among the 18-year-olds, tgere was kuttke evudebce tgat academic acceleration had altereted their sense of selse-esteem; only 5 percent felt that being moved ahead had affected them negatviely. By age 23 years, only 3.3 percent of the students felt that their social-emotional adjustmnet had been hindered by being moved ahead rapidly in school. "

If you guys are interested in the studies themselves, here are the references.

Richardson, T.M., & Benbow, C.P(1990). Long-term effects of acceleration on the socio-emotional adjustment of mathamatically precocious youths. Journal of Education and Psychology, 82, 464-470.

Terman, L. M. (1954). The discovery and encouragement of exceptional talent. American Psychology, 9, 221-230

[astroglide]

i started kindergarten when i was 4, so i was already a year ahead. somewhere early in grade school i got the we think he's retarded because he's disengaged/we should test him/now we think he should skip grades thing. i talked to somebody about it and declined because i was already the smallest boy in my class. it never actually bothered me, but people would tease me about it. the fact that they would waste time teasing me about it was far more annoying than the actual 'meaning' of the tease, and i didn't want it to get out of hand annoying. it's not a decision i regret. but i've always been accused of being too old for my age, even now and i just turned 28.

but then again, i went from being in honors everything in the 8th grade to getting kicked out of ap classes in high school for screwing around. i graduated hs by the skin of my teeth at 17 (i was a 16 year-old senior for a little while) and wouldn't have done it if it weren't for my girlfriend at the time being worried about it. going to college was never even something i considered. i would probably go to a university if i won the lottery now though.

home life was awful then, i was commuting about a half hour to school because i had moved out of the school district. there's no way i would have taken the trouble to change schools for 1 year, it was lying to my old school or dropping out. i was in the 'work/study program' and only taking 3 easy classes (psychology, french 4, and marketing) a day. i basically went to school around 3 days a week my senior year because i just wouldn't show up on mondays or fridays and changed jobs several times which should have resulted in being expelled (and they knew i wasn't even in the school district) but lots of the administration apparently felt sorry for me because some teachers heard about my living conditions.

so i honestly have no idea what could have happened if i went with a more accellerated path. maybe my own concerns as a kid were unfounded. i'm more or less of the opinion that if you are moderately intelligent and actually do what you want in your career you can't help but be successful (in terms of happiness, money, or whatever blend between the two). i can't say i'm at all disappointed with how things turned out.

[Cancuk]

My name means "Chief", in some Native American language.

So I got that going for me, which is nice.

[MonkeeMan]

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My name means "Chief", in some Native American language.

So I got that going for me, which is nice.

[/ QUOTE ]

When I was in the Army every Native American was called "Chief". Some didn't mind, others did a war dance.

[Cancuk]

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My name means "Chief", in some Native American language.

So I got that going for me, which is nice.

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When I was in the Army every Native American was called "Chief". Some didn't mind, others did a war dance.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can understand why they wouldn't like it

[Gunny Highway]

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When I was in the Army every Native American was called "Chief". Some didn't mind, others did a war dance.

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I can understand why the really, really uptight ones wouldn't like it

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[Blarg]

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She also said I was speaking in complete sentences before I was a year old. They tried to get me to skip a grade or even two when I was in grade school a few times, and to sign me up for college when I was in high school, but each time my parents wanted none of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

im like this, only my parents chose to skip grades rather than not. made a huge, huge difference.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cool, I wish it had been that way for me. If I would ever have kids, I'd let them go for it and try to reach the heights of their abilities. I'd be thrilled for them.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was in the same boat as you Blarg, I'm so so happy that my parents didn't let me skip grades. I didn't really grow up and stop being a complete dick till about 17-18 and while I might have been forced to before then if I'd skipped grades, it wouldn't have been nearly as fun and I doubt I'd be enjoying myself as much as I am now.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think these things always come down to the fact that there is a price to be paid no matter what you do, and we can always see the price we paid for taking our path, and will often feel the pain acutely, but it's much harder to see the price we might have paid if we had done things differently, and almost impossible to give it anywhere near the ranking of what we've actually experienced in real life.

Giving less than fair credit to the other good sides and bad sides we weren't exposed to is basically how things work.

And, critically, it is nearly impossible to have a life without regrets, and to take them hard, and to imagine that things could have somehow been much better.

What really happens in life is that most of us will have a fair share of regrets, pain, embarrassment, and disappointment. This will happen no matter what path we go down, because growing up is a hard and sometimes lonely task, and that's how life works. We'll tend to ascribe it correctly to our own circumstances and what we did in them, but it's very hard for most of us to admit that we would have had failings and disappointments if things had gone other ways, too. Nobody likes to think that way really, especially as regards the potential and happiness of kids(even ones not themselves), but that's the way life is. Growing up is all about fitting in and then not fitting in, making constant social adjustments, some good some bad, some successful and some not, some not successful through no fault of our own(i.e., there are plenty of jerks in life, even if you're a great kid), and life just happening in ways that are out of your control and not always good.

We're all pretty much guaranteed a certain slice of misery and doubt growing up. There's no path available that will eliminate it; it's just life. And it's not the only part of it, just sometimes the most memorable part, so we sometimes are tempted to imagine things would have been vastly better, "if only."

But basically nothing is guaranteed. You can't promise or guarantee your kid happiness no matter what he does. The world is not that simple and controllable a place. So all you can do is send him off into it with all your love and support and hope he weathers it well and that you can work it out with him when the inevitable storms arise.

I'd rather have my kid not waste as many years doing nothing as I did, bored into stupefaction or outright falling asleep on his desk. That's just warehousing kids. School is for developing them, and they'll never have a better chance to charge up their still growing brains. It will never be easier or faster. Smart kids can be voracious about acquiring knowledge and very happy to do it, and very stunted from not having the chance.

Why is it we bend over backwards and freak out about our kids doing well in Little League, and are willing to spend all the time and effort in the world on that, but are in comparison indifferent to the development of their minds?

If I had a kid I'd want him to develop as many capacities as he could and wanted to. I'd support that to the very best of my ability and understanding. And I wouldn't expect him to come out of any part of life unscathed or think I could guarantee that to him. I'd just be telling him, Go for it, kid, kick some ass in this world. Your mom and I are thrilled to death just that you're trying, much less succeeding here and there, and we can't wait to see what happens next and help if we can.

I think a kid's potential is a terrible thing to waste. It's a great thing and you need it in this world, a lot. And a lot of kids don't really have all that much. If your kid can achieve and wants to do it, more power to him and let's see where he goes.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
um, they actually can be mutually exclusive, since alot of social situations arent abled to be reasoned out like someone with a science mind would want to...

I have a genius cousin, total [censored].

My iq is near the same as his, however where he is completely engineering minded, Im more the creative type... maybe there's a link there?

[/ QUOTE ]

This describes me and my cousin exactly. He's socially really loopy. Particular types of great intelligence tend to be like that more, I think.

[Blarg]

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People who are intellectually ahead, are usually more socially competent as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did you get this from? In my experience, people who are intellectually ahead are more socially conscious and can understand what's going on around them, but are frequently far less socially competent in terms of general interaction.

I'd quite like to see a source if you have one and see how "competence" is defined.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are some pretty intelligent people who are not socially conscious at all. I don't even see how the two really fit together.

craig

[/ QUOTE ]

You can find intelligent people that are very socially competent and very incompetent. But in general I think intelligent people are given more reason to have confidence in themselves when they're young and this carries into their adult lives. Social skills are often a byproduct of confidence. People tend to pick out the intelligent eccentric freaks and act like they're the norm for some reason. Maybe it makes stupid people feel better about themselves.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think both these things are very true. If you want to stunt your kid's growth and screw him up, keep telling him he can't handle social situations. After a while, there's a very good chance it will be true. An unconfident person can't do anything right socially and might not even try, and a confident person can often succeed despite being a total assclown, and if he doesn't, won't take so hard that it freaks him out or keeps him from gamely trying again next time.

And people do tend to ostracize anyone who is different for any reason. Especially in school. We all know the junior high school boiler room of frantic conformity, competitive ostracism, and bitchy cliqueishness. Anything or anyone "different" is absolutely abhorred.