HH from Stars 100+9 [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

Rizen

12-05-2005, 10:59 PM

Warning, this is a pretty big file, I just dumped the entire tournament to a file. Anyways, I think I only luckboxed once for my entire stack. I know for a fact I made a couple of mistakes, but enjoy and feel free to ask/discuss hands:

http://www.sneakybuffalo.com/starshh.txt

-Rizen

KneeCo

12-05-2005, 11:01 PM

Thanks for sharing.

gobboboy

12-05-2005, 11:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
*** FLOP *** [Tc Qs 8c]
Rizen: bets 400
rock82: raises 1400 to 1800
Rizen: raises 1153 to 2953 and is all-in
rock82: calls 1153
Rizen said, "nh"
*** TURN *** [Tc Qs 8c] [4s]
*** RIVER *** [Tc Qs 8c 4s] [4h]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Rizen: shows [6h Qh] (two pair, Queens and Fours)
rock82: shows [5c Kc] (a pair of Fours)
Rizen collected 6506 from pot

rock82 said, "rizen, guess u dont win much, u r one of them programed played that cant fold top pair 6 kicker"
Rizen said, "I never win /images/graemlins/frown.gif"
rock82 said, "good luck, i hope u dont get top pair beat this tourney"
rock82 said, "u will have a shot"
...
rock82 said, "u did have the 6 though"
Rizen said, "the 6 is powerful"
rock82 said, "was it that obvious, ot do you suck, be honest?"
Rizen said, "I suck /images/graemlins/frown.gif"
rock82 said, "good, cause i would make that play again if i could see your cards"
Rizen said, "and I would make my play again if I could see your cards /images/graemlins/wink.gif"
Rizen said, "so I gues we're even"
rock82 said, "yea guess so, good luck with my chips"

*Rizen busts him*

[/ QUOTE ]

This is comedic gold.

mlagoo

12-06-2005, 12:31 AM

care to share your thoughts here? seems a bit reckless given the BBs stack size:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t600 (7 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t5594)
MP1 (t13838)
MP2 (t14417)
CO (t12145)
Hero (t13888)
SB (t6765)
BB (t12563)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
4 folds, Hero raises to t13888, 2 folds.

Final Pot: t14188

and thanks again for sharing this.

mlagoo

12-06-2005, 12:39 AM

actually there were a number of hands where you pushed for 15xBB or more.

could you share your thoughts on this, generally?

mlagoo

12-06-2005, 12:42 AM

hmm, here is another interesting one. did you have a specific read on the guy?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t1600 (5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

SB (t22962)
Hero (t71485)
UTG (t15670)
MP (t30967)
Button (t32548)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
1 fold, MP raises to t30967, 3 folds.

Final Pot: t31267

Rizen

12-06-2005, 12:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
hmm, here is another interesting one. did you have a specific read on the guy?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t1600 (5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

SB (t22962)
Hero (t71485)
UTG (t15670)
MP (t30967)
Button (t32548)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
1 fold, MP raises to t30967, 3 folds.

Final Pot: t31267

[/ QUOTE ]

Villian raised there less than 2% of hands, so it was read specific. I probably would have called anyone else at the table there. That's if I'm remembering the hand right.

-Rizen

Rizen

12-06-2005, 01:29 AM

[ QUOTE ]
care to share your thoughts here? seems a bit reckless given the BBs stack size:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t600 (7 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t5594)
MP1 (t13838)
MP2 (t14417)
CO (t12145)
Hero (t13888)
SB (t6765)
BB (t12563)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
4 folds, Hero raises to t13888, 2 folds.

Final Pot: t14188

and thanks again for sharing this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Against those particular players in that situation (since the SB was short and the BB was a tricky/aggressive player) I would have called a re-raise all in by either had I raised, I pushed. I don't always do this, but once my M reaches about 10, I like to mix some pushes into my game occasionally, especially in situations against players who I would call their push from anyways. This serves to A) let the players at the table know I don't mind getting my chips in the middle and B) to put the pressure on my opponents.

As an FYI - I always think of my stack in terms of it's relation to the size of the initial pot, and never in terms of big blinds. There is a definite strategy chance between sites like Stars (with antes) and Party (those without). I would never have made this move on Party, FWIW. Not sure how well I answered your question though /images/graemlins/wink.gif

-Rizen

beenben

12-06-2005, 08:33 AM

It seemed like you only played solid cards. I didn't see one steal raise (I stopped reading when you reached the FT). (other than 44 that you folded when someone came back over the top).

What was interesting to me was that when you raised, you raised all-in even if it didn't seem like you need to- ie you had more than 10x BB . Do you have a different rule than 10xBB for when you push vs. 3x BB? Then when it got to 2k/4k you switched to 3xBB. Was this b/c you had a high chip position or because of the blind level.

badluckal

12-06-2005, 10:29 AM

Thanks for sharing, much appreciated! I enjoyed reading through the tournament and playing along with you.

Do you have notes on many of these players that help with your reads? You also mention in the TT hand that the player raised less than 2% of his hands - is this verbatim from poker tracker or was this more of an approximation?

Thanks again.

Rizen

12-06-2005, 12:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for sharing, much appreciated! I enjoyed reading through the tournament and playing along with you.

Do you have notes on many of these players that help with your reads? You also mention in the TT hand that the player raised less than 2% of his hands - is this verbatim from poker tracker or was this more of an approximation?

Thanks again.

[/ QUOTE ]

Verbatim from Poker Tracker via Poker Ace HUD. I wish I could remember things that well /images/graemlins/smile.gif

-Rizen

Rizen

12-06-2005, 12:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for sharing, much appreciated! I enjoyed reading through the tournament and playing along with you.

Do you have notes on many of these players that help with your reads? You also mention in the TT hand that the player raised less than 2% of his hands - is this verbatim from poker tracker or was this more of an approximation?

Thanks again.

[/ QUOTE ]

Verbatim from Poker Tracker via Poker Ace HUD. I wish I could remember things that well /images/graemlins/smile.gif

-Rizen

[/ QUOTE ]

Also, after talking with Kneeco about this TT hand, I wanted to add a little context. This is the Final Table, I felt I had a clear edge over the field, and this particular player was pushing while he was 3rd in chips, and I had over double the nearest stack. I really didn't feel the need to gamble with TT against a tight player who made an odd move considering his chip position. I thought his range was something like 88-QQ and AJ+. I don't think he does this with KK or AA. Calling against that range is probably +cEV, but this is one of those final table situations where I feel it is -EV.

Also, I believe at that point I was pretty well running over the table and chipping up off uncontested pots pretty easily. Cutting my stack in half would have made it much tougher for me to keep the stranglehold I felt I had on the FT at the time.

Out of context I think this fold looks bad, but given the situation I felt the fold was pretty easy, and quite honestly I didn't even think very long about it.

-Rizen

12-06-2005, 12:59 PM

Is HUD compatible with Stars now?

Rizen

12-06-2005, 01:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
It seemed like you only played solid cards. I didn't see one steal raise (I stopped reading when you reached the FT). (other than 44 that you folded when someone came back over the top).

What was interesting to me was that when you raised, you raised all-in even if it didn't seem like you need to- ie you had more than 10x BB . Do you have a different rule than 10xBB for when you push vs. 3x BB? Then when it got to 2k/4k you switched to 3xBB. Was this b/c you had a high chip position or because of the blind level.

[/ QUOTE ]

I base my plays off the initial chip value in the pot (M) and not the BB. Play differs from sites with antes to sites without, and thinking in terms of the big blind I think it is mistake (althoguh thinking only in terms of M is a mistake as well).

A lot of when I'll start to consider open pushing depends a lot on the overall table aggression factor. You can't just think in terms of the 3xBB raise, you also have to think of how big the pot is, and if you decide to make a continuation bet how much that is going to be, and then if you fire both of these barrels and miss if you'll have enough left to fold and not leave yourself crippled.

I think we can all agree raising with hand then folding every time you miss a flop is a mistake, so is making a cont. bet every single time. This particular table that I made a lot of pushes at was one that was very aggressive post-flop if I recall correctly (I'm at work, so not going through the HH too thoroughly).

Is the amount of pushing I did in this particular tournament standard?? Not at all. Did I think it was the correct move for the particular table I was at?? Absolutely. One of my hesitations about posting a HH is that the course of a tournament is often like a painting. Every stroke you make doesn't always make sense by itself, and even a great artist doesn't make every stroke perfect (and regardless of what some people think, I don't consider myself a 'great' player). When it's all said and done though, it's all building a big picture.

If I posted 10 different HHs on here, you'd probably think I had multiple personality syndrome. Sometimes I'm a maniac, other times a rock. Some tournaments (as someone here already noted) I'll be able to go the whole tournament without playing a bad starting hand (I did play a few at the final table based on reads here), other times I'll have to make multiple moves with trash to stay ahead of the escalating blinds.

Poker is definitely situational. I'm absolutely positive that I could pull at least 15 hands out of this tournament and, when posted in isolation, they would look horrible. I'm also positive that I made mistakes in this tournament. I strive for perfection in every tournament I play, and I have yet to achieve it once.

This is not meant as a defensive post at all, I appreciate the feedback and I'm happy to discuss what or why I was thinking a certain way in certain situations. I also don't at all regret posting the HH to share. Please continue to discuss, and I'll explain what I can the best I can. Just look through the HH with some degree of perspective. If you're looking for a 'guide' to tournament play, this is definitely NOT the place for it. If you're looking for perspective from someone for 1 tournament, and perhaps a look at some alternative ways to play hands, then I think you might get something out of it. Sorry for being winded, I'm still not sure how well I'm articulating what I'm trying to say /images/graemlins/smile.gif

-Rizen

Rizen

12-06-2005, 01:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is HUD compatible with Stars now?

[/ QUOTE ]

I've never had it NOT be, although I've only been using it for about 6-7 weeks now.

-Rizen

Roman

12-06-2005, 01:37 PM

I only looked through most of the FT hands, here are some I think u botched:

I hope you know why this one sucks:

*********** # 302 **************
PokerStars Game #3236518686: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XV (2000/4000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:00:13 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #9 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (71689 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (191428 in chips)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (54996 in chips)
Seat 8: DeOnTaY04 (19703 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (77684 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 200
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 200
all_in_7-8: posts the ante 200
DeOnTaY04: posts the ante 200
JTriverrat: posts the ante 200
Rizen: posts small blind 2000
Bad_reflex: posts big blind 4000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [2d Ad]
all_in_7-8: folds
DeOnTaY04: folds
JTriverrat said, "lol"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 2000
Bad_reflex: checks
*** FLOP *** [2h Jd 3s]
Rizen: bets 6000
Bad_reflex: raises 10000 to 16000
Rizen: calls 10000
*** TURN *** [2h Jd 3s] [8h]
Rizen: checks
Bad_reflex: bets 16000
Rizen: folds
Bad_reflex collected 41000 from pot
Bad_reflex: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 41000 | Rake 0
Board [2h Jd 3s 8h]
Seat 3: Rizen (small blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (big blind) collected (41000)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: DeOnTaY04 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

Complete against that guy? no way....

*********** # 317 **************
PokerStars Game #3236559749: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XVI (3000/6000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:07:02 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #9 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (109285 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (210628 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (95587 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 300
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts the ante 300
Rizen: posts small blind 3000
Bad_reflex: posts big blind 6000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [Td 5d]
all_in_7-8 [observer] said, "gg"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 3000
PaulTuetel [observer] said, "74 off rules"
Bad_reflex: raises 18000 to 24000
Rizen: folds
PaulTuetel [observer] said, "on pokerstars"
Bad_reflex collected 12900 from pot
Bad_reflex: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 12900 | Rake 0
Seat 3: Rizen (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (big blind) collected (12900)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

This one is only good under VERY specific curcumstances (ie could be a good play, could be spewing):

*********** # 309 **************
PokerStars Game #3236540002: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XVI (3000/6000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:03:44 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #6 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (57189 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (210928 in chips)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (38296 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (109087 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 300
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 300
all_in_7-8: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts small blind 3000
Rizen: posts big blind 6000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [5c Ks]
Bad_reflex: folds
all_in_7-8: raises 6000 to 12000
all_in_7-8 said, "leave bad alone, he is our chip commander"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 6000
*** FLOP *** [6d Th Tc]
Bad_reflex said, "yep, TY Dawg !"
Rizen: bets 30000
all_in_7-8: folds
Rizen collected 28200 from pot
Rizen: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 28200 | Rake 0
Board [6d Th Tc]
Seat 3: Rizen (big blind) collected (28200)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (button) folded on the Flop
Seat 9: JTriverrat (small blind) folded before Flop

overall you did a really good job in my opinion, the only thing I may have done differently is by putting more pressure on by raising with any2 on tight players BBs, you seemed to have a hand almost every time you raised.

badluckal

12-06-2005, 02:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]

*********** # 309 **************
PokerStars Game #3236540002: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XVI (3000/6000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:03:44 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #6 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (57189 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (210928 in chips)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (38296 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (109087 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 300
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 300
all_in_7-8: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts small blind 3000
Rizen: posts big blind 6000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [5c Ks]
Bad_reflex: folds
all_in_7-8: raises 6000 to 12000
all_in_7-8 said, "leave bad alone, he is our chip commander"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 6000
*** FLOP *** [6d Th Tc]
Bad_reflex said, "yep, TY Dawg !"
Rizen: bets 30000
all_in_7-8: folds
Rizen collected 28200 from pot
Rizen: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 28200 | Rake 0
Board [6d Th Tc]
Seat 3: Rizen (big blind) collected (28200)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (button) folded on the Flop
Seat 9: JTriverrat (small blind) folded before Flop

[/ QUOTE ]

This was one of my favorite hands of the FT.

The villan's min-raise from the button leaving only 26k behind doesn't mean much in terms of strength, maybe 30% steal with air/30% low pair/30% unsuited broadway/10% AA-QQ.

Rizen is getting great odds to peel, and the paired rainbow flop equals whiff for villan pretty often. So he Stop and Goes putting villan all-in while leaving 19k behind, and I think he will actually be ahead or in a flip enough of the time to justfy the move. The villan's terrible fold is just icing on the cake /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Rizen

12-06-2005, 02:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I only looked through most of the FT hands, here are some I think u botched:

I hope you know why this one sucks:

*********** # 302 **************
PokerStars Game #3236518686: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XV (2000/4000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:00:13 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #9 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (71689 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (191428 in chips)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (54996 in chips)
Seat 8: DeOnTaY04 (19703 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (77684 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 200
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 200
all_in_7-8: posts the ante 200
DeOnTaY04: posts the ante 200
JTriverrat: posts the ante 200
Rizen: posts small blind 2000
Bad_reflex: posts big blind 4000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [2d Ad]
all_in_7-8: folds
DeOnTaY04: folds
JTriverrat said, "lol"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 2000
Bad_reflex: checks
*** FLOP *** [2h Jd 3s]
Rizen: bets 6000
Bad_reflex: raises 10000 to 16000
Rizen: calls 10000
*** TURN *** [2h Jd 3s] [8h]
Rizen: checks
Bad_reflex: bets 16000
Rizen: folds
Bad_reflex collected 41000 from pot
Bad_reflex: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 41000 | Rake 0
Board [2h Jd 3s 8h]
Seat 3: Rizen (small blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (big blind) collected (41000)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: DeOnTaY04 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

Complete against that guy? no way....

*********** # 317 **************
PokerStars Game #3236559749: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XVI (3000/6000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:07:02 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #9 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (109285 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (210628 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (95587 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 300
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts the ante 300
Rizen: posts small blind 3000
Bad_reflex: posts big blind 6000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [Td 5d]
all_in_7-8 [observer] said, "gg"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 3000
PaulTuetel [observer] said, "74 off rules"
Bad_reflex: raises 18000 to 24000
Rizen: folds
PaulTuetel [observer] said, "on pokerstars"
Bad_reflex collected 12900 from pot
Bad_reflex: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 12900 | Rake 0
Seat 3: Rizen (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (big blind) collected (12900)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

This one is only good under VERY specific curcumstances (ie could be a good play, could be spewing):

*********** # 309 **************
PokerStars Game #3236540002: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XVI (3000/6000) - 2005/12/04 - 03:03:44 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #6 is the button
Seat 3: Rizen (57189 in chips)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex (210928 in chips)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (38296 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (109087 in chips)
Rizen: posts the ante 300
Bad_reflex: posts the ante 300
all_in_7-8: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts the ante 300
JTriverrat: posts small blind 3000
Rizen: posts big blind 6000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [5c Ks]
Bad_reflex: folds
all_in_7-8: raises 6000 to 12000
all_in_7-8 said, "leave bad alone, he is our chip commander"
JTriverrat: folds
Rizen: calls 6000
*** FLOP *** [6d Th Tc]
Bad_reflex said, "yep, TY Dawg !"
Rizen: bets 30000
all_in_7-8: folds
Rizen collected 28200 from pot
Rizen: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 28200 | Rake 0
Board [6d Th Tc]
Seat 3: Rizen (big blind) collected (28200)
Seat 5: Bad_reflex folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: all_in_7-8 (button) folded on the Flop
Seat 9: JTriverrat (small blind) folded before Flop

overall you did a really good job in my opinion, the only thing I may have done differently is by putting more pressure on by raising with any2 on tight players BBs, you seemed to have a hand almost every time you raised.

[/ QUOTE ]

The A2 hand was awful, I certainly agree. There were a couple of times I completed in the SB where I wouldn't normally as well as peeled in the BB where I might not against other players. Part of it was that these players were SUPER passive post-flop (IMO at least) and if I recall correctly, I was taking a lot of pots from them on the flop with minimal risk. I waited a bit too long to change gears 3 handed though, as they both got a little more aggressive then.

The A2 hand is beyond awful, almost embarassing /images/graemlins/wink.gif The others weren't great, but at least I was adjusting my play based on a read. Overall it was an interesting final table. I think I made some good adjustments to it at times, and at others I made some bad adjustements. I actually find it quite encouraging seeing all my positive results lately and knowing that I'm still no where near the best level I can be as a player.

-Rizen

beenben

12-06-2005, 04:31 PM

Thanks for posting the HH and the fine answer to my question.

12-06-2005, 04:31 PM

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t1466)
UTG+1 (t2375)
Hero (t1803)
MP2 (t2427)
MP3 (t1324)
CO (t3205)
Button (t2690)
SB (t2005)
BB (t1490)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises to t300, 2 folds, CO calls t300, 3 folds.

Flop: (t750) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
Hero bets t400, CO folds.

Final Pot: t1150

What was your plan if he called and another blank hits? if a K or Q hits?
What about if he would have raised all-in?

I like these play when they work, but I sometime loose a big amount of my stack...

Roman

12-06-2005, 04:36 PM

Without reading what you said, I know what you mean and agree with your point. My point is that against me for example, that move would be totally reckless and terribly -EV.

12-06-2005, 04:36 PM

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

BB (t3520)
UTG (t6697)
UTG+1 (t7927)
MP1 (t6513)
MP2 (t1595)
Hero (t2828)
Button (t4382)
SB (t6419)

Preflop: Hero is CO with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
2 folds, MP1 calls t200, 1 fold, Hero raises to t2828, 3 folds, MP1 folds.

Final Pot: t3328

Don't you want to get more money with this hand or you find it very hard to play and may have to lay down the best hand?

Personnaly, I would have raised to 800 and play it from there, however, the way you played it is fine too, but you will only get called by better PP or 2 higher cards...

By the way, I understand your thinking when you puched with KQ and AT, but why don't you try to play a good hand with AK instead of pushing... Maybe it's the same thing and they were very agressive post-flop but with very strong hand I try to extract more money...

Thanks for posting this and I hope more players will do...

KneeCo

12-06-2005, 04:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG (t1466)
UTG+1 (t2375)
Hero (t1803)
MP2 (t2427)
MP3 (t1324)
CO (t3205)
Button (t2690)
SB (t2005)
BB (t1490)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises to t300, 2 folds, CO calls t300, 3 folds.

Flop: (t750) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
Hero bets t400, CO folds.

Final Pot: t1150

What was your plan if he called and another blank hits? if a K or Q hits?
What about if he would have raised all-in?

I like these play when they work, but I sometime loose a big amount of my stack...

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like a perfectly standard cont. bet IMO.
If you get raised you probably have to let it go unless you gave a strong read.
If you get called you may be getting into dark tunnel territory if you fire again at the turn unimproved (again, assuming no read).
If you get called and turn a non-club Q, probably be a good time for a CR.

12-06-2005, 04:43 PM

One more :

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG+1 (t2770)
MP1 (t5947)
MP2 (t8277)
CO (t5335)
Button (t4580)
Hero (t3178)
BB (t4037)
UTG (t3504)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
6 folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t475) T/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
Hero bets t400, BB raises to t1800, Hero raises to t2953, BB calls t1153.

Turn: (t6381) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)

River: (t6381) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)

Final Pot: t6381

Vilain had Kc5c

Was that an easy call/raise (hope not)? the overbet, could have been a flush draw but since the top pair was not suited, it could have been a top pair mid-kicker + flush draw hand that crushed you... Was it read specific? Could also be a QJ or Q9 so top-pair with a gut-shot...

I would have folded, but it was a good move to go all-in. This is one of the key hands I think... The other players started to fear you and didn't try to bluff you anymore.

12-06-2005, 04:47 PM

Last 1 :

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t3000 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

CO (t40120)
Hero (t146126)
SB (t6438)
BB (t65614)
UTG (t20795)
UTG+1 (t26482)
MP1 (t76145)
MP2 (t33780)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
5 folds, Hero raises to t9000, 1 fold, BB calls t6000.

Flop: (t16050) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

Turn: (t16050) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
BB bets t6000, Hero raises to t15000, BB raises to t30000, Hero folds.

Final Pot: t61050

I think that it was a good fold, however is there a way you could have played it better? Was the turn raise a good thing? What do you think he had? A10 or 2 pairs or a set or a slowplayed flush? What rang a bell for you? Is it the raise to 30,000, would a smaller/larger raise have been called?

Once again Thanks for posting this and Congrats. Hope this is going to help you in your career.

GL

12-06-2005, 04:58 PM

If he raises all-in, there will be 750 + 400 + 1103 = 2253. It costs 1103 to call which is 1 : 2.04 . With 6 outs you have around 25% chance of winnning. But if Vilain is doing that with the flush draw, you are way ahead, so I was wondering if he planned to call a raise in this situation.

I like to do continuation bet with a good stack because it is easier to let it go after you get raised but in that case, you are below average and need to get some chips. The average after 1 hour is around 3000 and you would have 1103 left... not that great.

Rizen

12-06-2005, 05:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Last 1 :

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t3000 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

CO (t40120)
Hero (t146126)
SB (t6438)
BB (t65614)
UTG (t20795)
UTG+1 (t26482)
MP1 (t76145)
MP2 (t33780)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
5 folds, Hero raises to t9000, 1 fold, BB calls t6000.

Flop: (t16050) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

Turn: (t16050) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
BB bets t6000, Hero raises to t15000, BB raises to t30000, Hero folds.

Final Pot: t61050

I think that it was a good fold, however is there a way you could have played it better? Was the turn raise a good thing? What do you think he had? A10 or 2 pairs or a set or a slowplayed flush? What rang a bell for you? Is it the raise to 30,000, would a smaller/larger raise have been called?

Once again Thanks for posting this and Congrats. Hope this is going to help you in your career.

GL

[/ QUOTE ]

Against this particular player I checked behind on the flop with the intent to raise any non-diamond turn. The fact that a T flopped was a bit of a bonus. This particular player seemed to like to CR a lot of flops and lead a lot of turns when checked.

In hindsight, I think I might have overthought this particular hand, but that was my thought process at the time this hand happened. It was also an attempt to mix up my game a little bit that failed.

-Rizen

Rizen

12-06-2005, 05:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

BB (t3520)
UTG (t6697)
UTG+1 (t7927)
MP1 (t6513)
MP2 (t1595)
Hero (t2828)
Button (t4382)
SB (t6419)

Preflop: Hero is CO with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
2 folds, MP1 calls t200, 1 fold, Hero raises to t2828, 3 folds, MP1 folds.

Final Pot: t3328

Don't you want to get more money with this hand or you find it very hard to play and may have to lay down the best hand?

Personnaly, I would have raised to 800 and play it from there, however, the way you played it is fine too, but you will only get called by better PP or 2 higher cards...

By the way, I understand your thinking when you puched with KQ and AT, but why don't you try to play a good hand with AK instead of pushing... Maybe it's the same thing and they were very agressive post-flop but with very strong hand I try to extract more money...

Thanks for posting this and I hope more players will do...

[/ QUOTE ]

I actually think the way I played this hand was horrible. I don't remember the exact situation so I can't remember why I did this, but I can't imagine many situations where this would have been right for me to do.

-Rizen

Rizen

12-06-2005, 05:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
One more :

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG+1 (t2770)
MP1 (t5947)
MP2 (t8277)
CO (t5335)
Button (t4580)
Hero (t3178)
BB (t4037)
UTG (t3504)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
6 folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t475) T/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
Hero bets t400, BB raises to t1800, Hero raises to t2953, BB calls t1153.

Turn: (t6381) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)

River: (t6381) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)

Final Pot: t6381

Vilain had Kc5c

Was that an easy call/raise (hope not)? the overbet, could have been a flush draw but since the top pair was not suited, it could have been a top pair mid-kicker + flush draw hand that crushed you... Was it read specific? Could also be a QJ or Q9 so top-pair with a gut-shot...

I would have folded, but it was a good move to go all-in. This is one of the key hands I think... The other players started to fear you and didn't try to bluff you anymore.

[/ QUOTE ]

This was not an easy push and I think it was marginal. To be fair though, in a blind battle I think his range is fairly wide (if I were him, I'd probably raise with middle pair + an overcard, a draw, and lots of other hands I'm currently ahead of).

BTW, these hands aren't being converted correctly. The pot sizes aren't including all of the antes and the final pot size through the converter does not match the one in my HH.

-Rizen

Rizen

12-06-2005, 05:33 PM

Thanks for the HH review guys. One thing I think that has been made obvious to me as you all look through my HH is that I think I am often using all in as a crutch with some of my more difficult hands once I get to ~10 M. Some of this I think is due to the fact that I've been running very hot lately (sometimes I tend to play more aggressively when I'm feeling invincible), and some of it is perhaps an excuse to not have to play post flop poker with tricky hands. I do think with some hands (particularly the JJ one) I'm leaving some value on the table though. At the very least the posts have had me re-evaluate some of my decisions and that alone has been very helpful.

-Rizen

12-06-2005, 07:59 PM

*********** # 220 **************
PokerStars Game #3236172993: Tournament #15701163, Hold'em No Limit - Level XII (800/1600) - 2005/12/04 - 02:06:05 (ET)
Table '15701163 16' Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Basso (24862 in chips)
Seat 3: Rizen (69810 in chips)
Seat 4: Bandit109 (31115 in chips)
Seat 8: DeOnTaY04 (33667 in chips)
Seat 9: JTriverrat (14178 in chips)
Basso: posts the ante 75
Rizen: posts the ante 75
Bandit109: posts the ante 75
DeOnTaY04: posts the ante 75
JTriverrat: posts the ante 75
Rizen: posts small blind 800
Bandit109: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Rizen [Qd Ks]
DeOnTaY04: raises 3200 to 4800
JTriverrat: folds
Basso: folds
Basso said, "lol"
Rizen: calls 4000
Bandit109: folds
*** FLOP *** [Qh 4c Js]
Rizen: checks
DeOnTaY04: checks
*** TURN *** [Qh 4c Js] [Ad]
Rizen: bets 6400
DeOnTaY04: calls 6400
*** RIVER *** [Qh 4c Js Ad] [Th]
Rizen: bets 6400
DeOnTaY04: calls 6400
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Rizen: shows [Qd Ks] (a straight, Ten to Ace)
DeOnTaY04: mucks hand
Rizen collected 37175 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 37175 | Rake 0
Board [Qh 4c Js Ad Th]
Seat 1: Basso (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Rizen (small blind) showed [Qd Ks] and won (37175) with a straight, Ten to Ace
Seat 4: Bandit109 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 8: DeOnTaY04 mucked [As Td]
Seat 9: JTriverrat folded before Flop (didn't bet)

Why didn't you bet bigger on the river? The pot was ~20000 and you have the nuts. Why not a bet of at least 10000, maybe 15000?

-Gross

Exitonly

12-06-2005, 08:01 PM

is a non K hand going to call 10 or 15k?

12-06-2005, 08:04 PM

Probably not, but at worst you'll get a chop. At best, a hand like A-10 calls you down.

-Gross