$33: I raise w/ JJ, villain moves all-in L3

[Dr_Jeckyl_00]

Everyone plays AA-QQ differently, but I think that most just raise me w/ those hands, not move in... so I don't feel as if that is what I am up against, I suspect a mid pair or AQ, AK...

Seat 6 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 1: baldhusker (1249)
Seat 3: Dr_Jeckyl_00 (725)
Seat 4: Terviseks (481)
Seat 5: acarperpu (555)
Seat 6: MyPairBigger (1910)
Seat 7: badbahlz (870)
Seat 8: kindofadrag (600)
Seat 9: theswamp1225 (960)
Seat 10: ghouahspaeee (650)
badbahlz posts small blind (25)
kindofadrag posts big blind (50)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Dr_Jeckyl_00 [ Jc, Jh ]
theswamp1225 folds.
ghouahspaeee folds.
baldhusker folds.
Dr_Jeckyl_00 raises (150) to 150
Terviseks folds.
acarperpu folds.
MyPairBigger folds.
badbahlz raises (845) to 870
badbahlz is all-In.
kindofadrag folds.
HERO?

call! Folding is terrible.

[microbet]

Before looking at your stack it was a call. After looking at your stack...CALL!

You're right, most likely big ace or middle pair. I might have QQ+ there, but not most players.

[Melchiades]

It's a call. But would not be too surprised to see AA-QQ. You raised 20% of your stack, villain knows you are gonna call his push.

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]
It's a call. But would not be too surprised to see AA-QQ. You raised 20% of your stack, villain knows you are gonna call his push.

[/ QUOTE ]

a) call
b) the assumption that a player who raises 20% of his stack will call off the rest is wrong
c) the assumption that opponents think that you will call off the rest after putting in 20% is wrong
d) it's not like he put in 33% of his stack!

[pineapple888]

Well, there's no reason for villain to raise anything less than his whole stack here, so I'm not sure how much you can tell by that.

Given your read, it's a call. I'd fold this against a tight player, though. You're crushed by the range [AA-QQ, AK] for example.

[gisb0rne]

Call.

[Dr_Jeckyl_00]

I called and villain had AK, and hit a King. No big deal, but I wanted to confirm that my call was correct.

What is the lowest hand you call with? My guess is JJ?

[Hornacek]

sometimes TT but this is very read dependent.

[vinyard]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, there's no reason for villain to raise anything less than his whole stack here, so I'm not sure how much you can tell by that.

[/ QUOTE ] I would say that signicant percentage of $22 and $33 players will not push their AA and KK here. There are a few that smooth call but I think the majority raise to somwhere between 300 and 400 chips to get more chips in the pot, check the flop if called (Villain's in the SB) and come over the top of any bet. I am not saying that is how they should play but that is certainly how they do play.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's a call. But would not be too surprised to see AA-QQ. You raised 20% of your stack, villain knows you are gonna call his push.

[/ QUOTE ]

a) call
b) the assumption that a player who raises 20% of his stack will call off the rest is wrong
c) the assumption that opponents think that you will call off the rest after putting in 20% is wrong
d) it's not like he put in 33% of his stack!

[/ QUOTE ]

e) call

Call, you'll see a lower pocket pair a lot.

[playtitleist]

[ QUOTE ]
I would say that signicant percentage of $22 and $33 players will not push their AA and KK here.

[/ QUOTE ]

This could be true, but I push this all the time, I expect to get calls from shorties and biggies fairly often. I figure any shortie who will call your raise will call a push, same pretty much for a biggie. So why not just push?

I am only just starting the $22s, but haven't noticed a difference in the effectiveness of this play from the $11s.

Merely raising here implies a raise expects to action more often than a push. Will I really find the $22ers and $33ers more apt to call a smaller raise vs. lay down to a push?

[Dr_Jeckyl_00]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I would say that signicant percentage of $22 and $33 players will not push their AA and KK here.

[/ QUOTE ]

This could be true, but I push this all the time, I expect to get calls from shorties and biggies fairly often. I figure any shortie who will call your raise will call a push, same pretty much for a biggie. So why not just push?

I am only just starting the $22s, but haven't noticed a difference in the effectiveness of this play from the $11s.

Merely raising here implies a raise expects to action more often than a push. Will I really find the $22ers and $33ers more apt to call a smaller raise vs. lay down to a push?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think you want to push AA, KK. That seems as it would discourage action, you want action with those hands and while you may occassionally get someone to call your push, you are probably losing bets in the long run, IMO...

[pineapple888]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I would say that signicant percentage of $22 and $33 players will not push their AA and KK here.

[/ QUOTE ]

This could be true, but I push this all the time, I expect to get calls from shorties and biggies fairly often. I figure any shortie who will call your raise will call a push, same pretty much for a biggie. So why not just push?

I am only just starting the $22s, but haven't noticed a difference in the effectiveness of this play from the $11s.

Merely raising here implies a raise expects to action more often than a push. Will I really find the $22ers and $33ers more apt to call a smaller raise vs. lay down to a push?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think you want to push AA, KK. That seems as it would discourage action, you want action with those hands and while you may occassionally get someone to call your push, you are probably losing bets in the long run, IMO...

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. Except look at all the 2+2ers who call with JJ here. Now add in all the donks who also call here. Now what would you do with AA?

[player1]

what is the proper play if the villain does a standard reraise?

also, what if we have AK or AQ instead of JJ, and the villain pushes, should we call?

thanks,
jc

[Marc H]

[ QUOTE ]
what if we have AK or AQ instead of JJ, and the villain pushes, should we call?

[/ QUOTE ]

NO!
You've got to be the pusher, not pushee, with those.

[Dr_Jeckyl_00]

[ QUOTE ]
what is the proper play if the villain does a standard reraise?

also, what if we have AK or AQ instead of JJ, and the villain pushes, should we call?

thanks,
jc

[/ QUOTE ]

Part 1... Hard to say. depending on my mood, any reads, etc I might push to a standard raise, but the correct play is probably to fold, especially against a tight player, maybe push into a loose player.

Part 2, I would probably not be in the hand L3 w/ AQ, but if I was (b/c I had position) I would fold AQ to a reraise, and fold AK to an all-in reraise (unless maybe villain was loose), but call a standard raise.

Fold.




Just kidding. Call. /images/graemlins/wink.gif