10/20 TT

[jason_t]

I'm still adjusting to the aggression in this game. The people I talked to about this hand did not reach a consensus.

I don't have data on the SB here. I have only been at the table one orbit and he played JJ extremely aggressively in one hand putting in four bets on the flop and turn.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (10 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter (http://www.pokerhand.org)

Preflop: I am Button with T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
<font color="#666666">7 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">I raise</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">I cap</font>, SB calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">I bet</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">I 3-bet</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB caps</font>, I call.

Turn: (8.50 BB) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>

Okay so far? Now what?

[tpir90036]

Edited after re-reading the action
You might be raising for value if he is jamming /images/graemlins/heart.gifs, but if he has a made hand it's hard to put him on a worse one unless he has a smaller PP. Getting 9.5:2 effective on the calldown I think you have to make it. I might have put in fewer bets total but I can't really find fault given your overplay read.

[goofball]

YOu capped and he just bet right out? I'd go ahead and just call down from here. I don't think there's any use trying to get reliable information out of him.

[CardSharpCook]

Unless you have a firmer read on him, it is time to call down. Agro-donks can be hard to play. Sometimes they give you action galore with Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif 7 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif, other times they actually have the goods and you are giving them tons of action with a lousy pair of tens. We're still not even sure that this is what he is. Slow down turbo.

[Entity]

When you asked me you said SB seemed TAG but you didn't know for sure. I thought you put too many bet in.

Rob

[Pog0]

I was going to advocate folding but then I saw that this was a blind steal situation. Looks standard so far, the decision is between a free showdown raise and a calldown now, right?

[B Dids]

Against an unknown, I probably don't cap preflop and play the flop different. As I mentioned on AIM. Against unknown players and holding hands with showdown value, I like to take lines that involve cheaper showdowns. If I lack information, I'm not trying to squeeze every bit of value out of a hand.

As you played it, it's time to call down.

[bakku]

hey dids, this is an easy PF cap after opening from the button. i also just call down after the turn bet. 99 is like one of the only hands you beats

[B Dids]

My thought behind not capping is that I feel like it gives me more options in terms of playing the flop, given that some flops are going to make me cry vs. an unknown 3-bet from the SB.

As Jason pointed out- this could also be a game texture thing, as people may 3-bet steals more frequently at this limit than where I play.

[gaming_mouse]

The way it played, I think it easy fold, but I'm not used to this aggression yet either.

More important question: If you dont buy his flop c/r, why not call and raise the turn? Not sure that's better... just curious about your thinking.

[ep510]

Going for a showdown raise on turn is bad since jason said that villian capped flop and TURN with JJ. We don't know what he could 3-bet here on the turn with.

[hobbsmann]

I think a call/call line is best as I don't want to put myself in a situation where I could be folding the best hand against a guy described as over aggroish. Against more passive types I think this a great spot for a free showdown raise, but since I wouldn't feel comfortable folding to a 3-bet I think we should just get to showdown as cheap as possible.

[gh9801]

If he can play JJ very aggressively, especially on the turn, he can play a hand like 99 or 77 very aggressively. At the same time you don't want to get threebet on the turn.

Call turn. Call river.

[me454555]

I think you gotta call down here. Sb would prolly play this line w/PPs like 99 77 and 66 which you are ahead of often enough. He might also take this line w/a hand like AKh. I think the pot is sufficiently big enough to warrent a call down even though you're likely behind.

[W. Deranged]

I think folding is problematic here for tons of reasons.

Despite my general love for free showdown raises, I really don't like it here.

So I say just go ahead and get to showdown. Call the turn and call the river.

[Klepton]

too untrustworthy = call down.

What was your plan behind the 3-bet on the flop? After Villain checkraised the flop, hasn't it become a WAWB situation? I think I would just call him down from there.

[DMBFan23]

why not call down from the flop checkraise? Do they often checkraise the flop in this spot with a hand that I really want to charge? maybe like AhQh but why not have him lead the turn regardless, instead of only when he's ahead? I almost think having the initiative here is a bad thing because it's hard for me to call down if he checkraises again on the turn, but I still like to see a showdown

[Surfbullet]

hey Jason,

I call down here given the way you plyed it, but IMO you put too many bets in on the flop. This board is pretty barren and you did cap preflop. He'll charge himself to draw to the flush by semibluffing, and if he doesn't we're in a WA/WB situation vs another PP or an 8. You need to get this hand to showdown and 4bets on the flop is a bit much.

A super-aggressive player could definitely be playing 55-77,99 this way because they kind of just ignore paired board cards when they think you are on a hand like AK, so you do need to call it down...but becaues of that I would have slowed down after the flop c/r and made sure 1 bet went in on the big streets.

Surf