Why did I even leave 2/4? (no strategy)

[winky51]

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em
Converted w/ PonksSaver: http://www.pokermentor.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=510
- - - HAND 3134626224 - - -
PreFlop: <font color="blue">HERO</font> is BB with <font color="black">Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif</font> <font color="red">K/images/graemlins/heart.gif</font> (9 Players)
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 2 <font color="darkred">folds</font>, CO calls, 1 <font color="darkred">fold</font>, SB calls, <font color="blue">HERO</font> checks,

Flop: (5.00 SB) <font color="red">2/images/graemlins/heart.gif</font> <font color="green">K/images/graemlins/club.gif</font> <font color="green">7/images/graemlins/club.gif</font> (5 Players)
SB checks, <font color="blue">HERO</font> <font color="green">bets</font>, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, CO <font color="darkred">folds</font>, SB calls,

Turn: (4.50 BB) <font color="blue">2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif</font> (4 Players)
SB checks, <font color="blue">HERO</font> <font color="green">bets</font>, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, SB <font color="darkred">folds</font>,

River: (7.50 BB) <font color="black">2/images/graemlins/spade.gif</font> (3 Players)
<font color="blue">HERO</font> <font color="green">bets</font>, UTG <font color="darkgreen">raises</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="blue">HERO</font> <font color="darkgreen">raises</font>, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls,

Final Pot: 16.50 BB

Results below:
<font color="blue">HERO</font> has Qs Kh (a full house Twos full of kings).
Outcome: <font color="blue">HERO</font> wins 16.50 BB.

Other 2 had [ 8h, 7h river raiser] [ 9s, 9d river caller]

Took a huge beating at 3/6 (42% WSD) the last 2 days so I decided to move to 2/4 for a couple nights. Get that confidence back.

Why did I ever move up to 3/6 when I get this playing 6 tables of 2/4. Wow what a difference in the players. 2/4 is so much easier to play than 3/6. I don't remember it being this easy. Players kept doint silly things like that all night on me. Maybe it was just one of those nights where all the fish came out.

[ncboiler]

I agree that 2/4 is WAY easier than 3/6 but to move up you have to go through 3/6 so therefore I am learning to play it even though right now I can probably make more money playing 2/4

[SackUp]

Don't make non-strat posts here. it clutters the already overwhelmed forum.

Post in the Zoo, General, or BBV forum.

[ncboiler]

It's a small stakes question right?

[ QUOTE ]
to move up you have to go through 3/6

[/ QUOTE ]
Not necessarily. I'm contemplating skipping 3/6 myself once I suck less at 2/4, and know others who have done the same with good results.

It's a big BR leap from 2/4 to 5/10, though.

[ QUOTE ]
It's a small stakes question right?

[/ QUOTE ]
BBV is limit-agnostic.

[ncboiler]

I like to see not strat questions in the forum occasionally and this needs to be here. Not sure what you mean by BBV though. And if you want to skip 3/6 then more power to you.

It seems that the full table games at the other levels are significantly harder though because of the availability of the 6 max tables that dont exist at 2/4. (even 1/2 full table seems less fishy than 2/4)

Why does someone move up? If I move up it's to make more money. 3/6 might actually be less profitable than 2/4 so it's kind of a bummer to go there.

I wonder if 3/6 6-max is more profitable than 2/4 full table. Im actually thinking of just working more on my short handed game (on the 1/2 table for now), since it seems that on most sites that seems to be the easier games at the higher (lower) limits.

[ QUOTE ]
I like to see not strat questions in the forum occasionally and this needs to be here. Not sure what you mean by BBV though.

[/ QUOTE ]
Beats, Brags and Variance. And OP has all three!

[SackUp]

[ QUOTE ]
I like to see not strat questions in the forum occasionally and this needs to be here. Not sure what you mean by BBV though. And if you want to skip 3/6 then more power to you.

[/ QUOTE ]

You see the list on the left? There are about 95 options on it, over half of which have nothing to do with poker strategy. If you want to mix it up visit them. Posting non-strategy questions in a strat forum just adds to the clutter.

Mods?? Donde esta??

[Harv72b]

[ QUOTE ]
Not necessarily. I'm contemplating skipping 3/6 myself once I suck less at 2/4, and know others who have done the same with good results.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure there are players who skipped 3/6 and did well at 5/10 and beyond, but I don't think skipping 3/6 is anything close to a good idea for the vast majority of players.

[winky51]

Wow didnt really expect to get responces. But there was a question in this post otherwise it would have said (no content) all you anal people.

3/6 is its own beast. I have actually started sliding to 5/10 occasionally to test the water. And while I don't find it easier I find it more predictable. There are slightly less big fish but at the same time not as many TAGs. The players there know more of what they are doing but are stil not playing optimally. 3/6 has a lot of TAGs, LAGs, and cautious fish.

In 3/6 I get plays like this.

MP3 raises, I reraise from the SB with KQs.

Flop comes K rag rag. I bet, he calls.
Turn comes rag. I bet, he raises, I call. (don't ask my instincts just knew I was ahead)
River comes rang, I check, he bets, I call. Opponent flips over AQ!?! No pair no draw.

This guy was reasonably decent VPIP around 20x%, PFR 9%, TAF 1.5. Then for whatever reason he makes a move like this against a player that has shown nothing but good cards when I 3 bet PF. This guy's play makes no sense to me considering he has nothing vs a reraiser PF and there's a fricken "K" on the board AND I'm betting!!!

At 5/10 I see players making semibluffs and some good plays with value. I have to think to make the right call. But 3/6 there is some lunacy to their tactics at time.

Who know maybe Ive been getting lucky at 5/10. Maybe its because I play only 2 tables not 4. Maybe my style of play is better suited for 5/10 than 3/6. I still need to conquer 3/6 before I permanently move up I say.

2/4 was like a wet dream last night. I forgot how bad they were. Players calling down with a pair of 55s with a AKQT on the board after I PF raised. I thinking to see a J for the str8 on the river and poof 55 instead. WOW. Made over 4 BB per 100 last night. Half of that was unbelievable call downs with the most rediculous hands like the one I posted. Also in 2/4 a fish bets or raises you its easy to fold. Only caught one frisky one last night trying to get aggressive with marginal hands. He has A3, I had A8, we both has aces and he is raising me.

[sean c]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not necessarily. I'm contemplating skipping 3/6 myself once I suck less at 2/4, and know others who have done the same with good results.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure there are players who skipped 3/6 and did well at 5/10 and beyond, but I don't think skipping 3/6 is anything close to a good idea for the vast majority of players.

[/ QUOTE ]

I Harv i am going to ask why? I also planned on skipping 3/6.

[newhizzle]

[ QUOTE ]
Not necessarily. I'm contemplating skipping 3/6 myself once I suck less at 2/4, and know others who have done the same with good results.


[/ QUOTE ]

from my experience, 3/6 is tighter, but 5/10 is where it starts getting real aggressive, id recomend playing 3/6 first

[TripleH68]

I have played quite a bit of 2/4 and 3/6 in the last six months - and I think you are speaking in too general of terms here imo.

The biggest difference I have noticed over time is players making better folds/better reads at 3/6.

I have actually found more maniacs/super loose players. Just in my experience.

I'm just about to move up, and it seems like 3/6 full kinda sucks.

I'm considering just going this route- 3/6 short, 5/10 short, 10/20 short ... etc.

Why play full ring? 3/6 and 5/10 seem full of TAGs and it appears that the worst players are always at the short tables. Is this correct?

I mean, I know variance sucks, but the whole point of playing poker is to play people that are worse than you are and I'm gonna try and go wherever I can find that, if I gotta stay away from sucky full ring games I gotta.

[BigBrother]

[ QUOTE ]


3/6 is its own beast... There are slightly less big fish but at the same time not as many TAGs. The players there know more of what they are doing but are stil not playing optimally....


...Also in 2/4 a fish bets or raises you its easy to fold...

[/ QUOTE ]

In my experience the play at 2/4 is much more erratic than at 3/6. When a fish at 2/4 raises me on the turn I will often call it down to find MHIG and they were making a silly move with trash. At 3/6 if I call down with what I was representing (TP or overpair) I usually get confirmation that MHING.

I believe that even if one has the BR for 5/10, a stop at 3/6 is worthwile. The bad players are there at every limit, but the higher you go, the better the best players are at extracting value from you.

There are valuable lessons to be learned regarding table selection, identifying table texture and varying your play accordingly, blind stealing and defense, heads-up post-flop, etc.

That said, if BR can handle it, there is NO reason not to be taking shots at juicy games up to 10/20 (assuming you have a reliable way of determining 'juicy' for that limit).

[Harv72b]

[ QUOTE ]
Harv i am going to ask why? I also planned on skipping 3/6.

[/ QUOTE ]

2/4 to 3/6 is, IMO, the most difficult jump to make in small to mid stakes LHE. There are a lot of lessons which most players need to learn at the 3/6 game that will be imperative to their success at 5/10 and higher limits--blinds play, short-handed situations, aggressive isolation (both pre- and postflop), value-betting borderline hands, countering sophisticated postflop bluffs, making sophisticated postflop bluffs against the right opponents, and careful table/seat selection, to name a few.

There are some players who already aware of and fairly skilled in these situations before they attempt to move up from 2/4, and there are others for whom these skills will come naturally. Those players likely can jump straight up to 5/10 w/o many ill effects. But for the vast majority, the time spent at 3/6 tweaking these parts of their game will make the difference between a successful transition to the middle stakes game and a short-lived and expensive shot at 5/10.

Even if you're absolutely convinced that you fall into the group capable of making the bigger leap, what could it possibly hurt to spend a month or two on 3/6 first?