Party SNG's

Does anyone else hate Party's SNG's? Why do they give such a crummy little stack of 800 chips, while every other site gives you 1500? Unless you win some pots, your M is below 20 by the second level. I assume they do this just to make the tourneys go faster so they can scam us out of more entry fees. From now on I am boycotting Party Poker SNG's.

[citanul]

we'll miss you. have a good life.

[mlagoo]

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M is below 20 by the second level.

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tigerite to thread /images/graemlins/blush.gif


also, we like the chip structure because faster tournaments = more $/hr. which is, you know, nice.

[Sabrazack]

Thats the point moron. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[Seth Money]

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Does anyone else hate Party's SNG's? Why do they give such a crummy little stack of 800 chips, while every other site gives you 1500? Unless you win some pots, your M is below 20 by the second level. I assume they do this just to make the tourneys go faster so they can scam us out of more entry fees. From now on I am boycotting Party Poker SNG's.

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There goes the london stock exchange. Just saw party dropped .000001 EURO's on this shockening news. Guess the owners are only worth 1.599999999999 billion now

Seth

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Thats the point moron. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

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Is there any need for insults? I didn't mean to hurt your feelings. I just think Stars SNG's are alot better because they allow you to actually play poker, rather than being blinded down so quickly.

[mlagoo]

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Thats the point moron. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

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Is there any need for insults? I didn't mean to hurt your feelings. I just think Stars SNG's are alot better because they allow you to actually play poker, rather than being blinded down so quickly.

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playing poker is what level 1 is for /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[citanul]

sabra,

you have 0 of 1 personal insults remaining.

OP,

most of the people on this forum play poker to make money. not to play poker.

c

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sabra,

you have 0 of 1 personal insults remaining.

OP,

most of the people on this forum play poker to make money. not to play poker.

c

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But don't you feel you can make more money when you have enough chips to outmaneuver the worse players? With such shallow stacks, your cards become too much of a factor.

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With such shallow stacks, your cards become too much of a factor.

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Infact not.

[Sabrazack]

Meh, i Sweden a smirk after an insult means it's all in fun. /images/graemlins/cool.gif I don't insult people, not intentionally anyway. I'm sorry Mr.OP.

Nevermind, guess it won't happen again, intentionally or not.

[tigerite]

I can't be bothered to reply about M anymore. If people want to keep using it, let them.

[citanul]

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Meh, i Sweden a smirk after an insult means it's all in fun. /images/graemlins/cool.gif I don't insult people, not intentionally anyway. I'm sorry Mr.OP.

Nevermind, guess it won't happen again, intentionally or not.

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, fine, you have 1 of 1 remaining. it's not like i remember who has 0 left anyway.

c

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I can't be bothered to reply about M anymore. If people want to keep using it, let them.

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You don't use M at all? Why not?

[downtown]

It's not a matter of feelings, it's a matter of math. $/hr is higher in Party tournies for most posters here, so Party tournies dominate the discussion. ROI is higher in the situation you describe, but Stars tournies take longer, so $/hr is lower. Some people play Stars because they like it more. So... just play Stars then. And leave us wallowing in our poker subclass with our massive hourly rates, ok? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[splashpot]

Playing deep stack poker requires actual skill. Which none of us have.

[tigerite]

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I can't be bothered to reply about M anymore. If people want to keep using it, let them.

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You don't use M at all? Why not?

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'Cos it's absolutely meaningless in SNG poker compared to ICM.

[pineapple888]

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Playing deep stack poker requires actual skill. Which none of us use .

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FYP

[downtown]

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Meh, i Sweden a smirk after an insult means it's all in fun. /images/graemlins/cool.gif I don't insult people, not intentionally anyway. I'm sorry Mr.OP.

Nevermind, guess it won't happen again, intentionally or not.

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, fine, you have 1 of 1 remaining. it's not like i remember who has 0 left anyway.

c

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn, I was hoping to use my 1 personal insult of 1 in some sort of spectacular fashion. Oh well, I guess I'll just have to go back to cursing out cabbies instead.

(Almost got hit by one this morning while crossing the street at a stop sign, crazy me - cabbies have 0 of 1 such encounters allowed for the rest of today.)

[splashpot]

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Playing deep stack poker requires actual skill. Which none of us use .

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FYP

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I like mine better.

[playtitleist]

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Playing deep stack poker requires actual skill. Which none of us have time to develop, cuz we are busy making money.

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FYP

OP - Party structure doesn't suck, it's just a different game. Bubble play at any structure is what's important, all else pales.

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It's not a matter of feelings, it's a matter of math. $/hr is higher in Party tournies for most posters here, so Party tournies dominate the discussion. ROI is higher in the situation you describe, but Stars tournies take longer, so $/hr is lower. Some people play Stars because they like it more. So... just play Stars then. And leave us wallowing in our poker subclass with our massive hourly rates, ok? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I hear what you're saying. I suppose playing style comes into effect here as well. I like to have as much time as possible with deeper stacks because that's where I have the biggest edge, so my hourly rate is higher in those tourneys.
But if you're better at short stack play then I suppose the party SNG's are a better fit. I still think they do it just to scam us though.

[citanul]

[quote}I like to have as much time as possible with deeper stacks because that's where I have the biggest edge, so my hourly rate is higher in those tourneys.

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I very, very much doubt that this is true.

c

[jgunnip]

To OP. I started playing SNGs at Stars I didn't like was fast the blinds crept up on my stack, but after a while of reading and posting on these forums, you'll soon discover than more money can be made on Party SNGs with the proper strategy. But for many, Stars may be a better place to start at and develop some skills.

[pineapple888]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's not a matter of feelings, it's a matter of math. $/hr is higher in Party tournies for most posters here, so Party tournies dominate the discussion. ROI is higher in the situation you describe, but Stars tournies take longer, so $/hr is lower. Some people play Stars because they like it more. So... just play Stars then. And leave us wallowing in our poker subclass with our massive hourly rates, ok? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I hear what you're saying. I suppose playing style comes into effect here as well. I like to have as much time as possible with deeper stacks because that's where I have the biggest edge, so my hourly rate is higher in those tourneys.
But if you're better at short stack play then I suppose the party SNG's are a better fit. I still think they do it just to scam us though.

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I don't care why they do it, if it's better for me.

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To OP. I started playing SNGs at Stars I didn't like was fast the blinds crept up on my stack, but after a while of reading and posting on these forums, you'll soon discover than more money can be made on Party SNGs with the proper strategy. But for many, Stars may be a better place to start at and develop some skills.

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What is your strategy for Party SNG's?

How many party SNG's do you guys play at once?

I think that you're wrong on both accounts.

First (and perhaps least wrong), I don't think playing style has as much of an influence as you think. It isn't as if the best SNG players in the world choose to play on Party because they don't have the ability to adapt their playing style. Perhaps an inability to adapt YOUR playing style results in a higher $/hr at Stars for you. And yes-- I really think that the best SNG players in the world are at Party.

Secondly, I think that it's wrong to say that Party's structure is designed solely to screw the player. It's a mutally beneficial relationship. PokerStars even had to create their "Turbo" SNGs because of DEMAND, and a desire to try to compete with what was by far the most popular format.

[citanul]

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What is your strategy for Party SNG's?

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jesus. you didn't just write that did you?

c

[mlagoo]

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How many party SNG's do you guys play at once?

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i limp 55 in ep

[playtitleist]

Okay, every noob eventually needs a semi-noob to point him in the right direction. I guess I'll take this one.

OP - read the FAQ pinned to the top of the thread list before making another post. Actually, read it before playing another hand. In it you will find a wealth of information, including "Which site should I play?" and "What's the best strategy?"

Then, and only then, post hands, accept feedback, give feedback, participate in this discussion forum. You'll be a better SNGer for it.

Now go!

...and when you are no longer a noob, don't be too mean to the noobs asking these questions.

[tewall]

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Bubble play at any structure is what's important, all else pales.

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This is an interesting idea, but it seems to me that it can't possibly be true, at least as far as the professional multi-table tournaments are concerned. A number of the pros seems to suck at bubble play, yet they do consistently well in the tournaments. I think what happens is they are so good at accumulating chips that they can get away with bubble play innacuracies.

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What is your strategy for Party SNG's?

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jesus. you didn't just write that did you?
c

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Nope, definitely wasn't me

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Okay, every noob eventually needs a semi-noob to point him in the right direction. I guess I'll take this one.

OP - read the FAQ pinned to the top of the thread list before making another post. Actually, read it before playing another hand. In it you will find a wealth of information, including "Which site should I play?" and "What's the best strategy?"

Then, and only then, post hands, accept feedback, give feedback, participate in this discussion forum. You'll be a better SNGer for it.

Now go!

...and when you are no longer a noob, don't be too mean to the noobs asking these questions.

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Ok Thank you, appreciated semi-noob

[mlagoo]

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Bubble play at any structure is what's important, all else pales.

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This is an interesting idea, but it seems to me that it can't possibly be true, at least as far as the professional multi-table tournaments are concerned. A number of the pros seems to suck at bubble play, yet they do consistently well in the tournaments. I think what happens is they are so good at accumulating chips that they can get away with bubble play innacuracies.

[/ QUOTE ]

im fairly certain he meant any structure of SNG

bubble play is obviously far less important in an MTT (although still very important).

[revots33]

OK, I'll try a serious answer to the OP...

Yes, theoretically deeper stacks favor the better player, as you will have more time to exert your skill edge over your opponents and "outplay" them. Makes sense. In fact that's why I stuck to Stars SNGs for a long time.

However, even though Party SNGs may be more of a crap shoot based on the smaller stack size, that is more than compensated by the added # of tournies you can play per hour (not to mention the horrendous level of the competition).

You may have a higher ITM% on Stars, but your $/hr will be higher on Party. It just makes sense to maximize your earnings per hour, if making money is the reason you play. If you are playing more for entertainment, and like the challenge of a longer tournament, then go ahead and play at Stars. But realize you are probably costing yourself money by doing it.

[GtrHtr]

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What is your strategy for Party SNG's?

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jesus. you didn't just write that did you?
c

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Nope, definitely wasn't me

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mockery, I like it.

[akudlac]

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How many party SNG's do you guys play at once?

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i limp 55 in ep

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I never get tired of these responses.

[mlagoo]

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How many party SNG's do you guys play at once?

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i limp 55 in ep

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I never get tired of these responses.

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haha, although that was supposed to be a joke (although, seriously, i do), it was supposed to be in response to his strategy request. now its just a bit absurd /images/graemlins/blush.gif.

[tipperdog]

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However, even though Party SNGs may be more of a crap shoot based on the smaller stack size, that is more than compensated by the added # of tournies you can play per hour (not to mention the horrendous level of the competition).

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I do not believe this is [entirely] correct. In fact, I get all bent when people describe Party SnGs as "crapshoots" (implying the near total-dominance of luck). If it were really a crapshoot, how could there be any long-term winners?

Playing high-blind short-stack events requires major strategic adjustments. For the most part, your opponents don't know how to make them. If you do, you have a significant edge over the competition--a skill edge.

An analogous (hypothetical) situation:

Let's say that instead of poker, we decided to play heads up "tournament craps." We each start with T1,000 and must have $10 in action every roll of the dice. Whoever goes broke first loses. This game is a "crapshoot," right? Not really. What if my opponent takes the "any seven" bet every roll. He will almost certainly lose if I play the pass line. I will win because I have the superior strategy. It ain't luck!

[revots33]

Understood, but I said "more of a crapshoot" - I didn't say total crapshoot. While skilled players still have an edge in Party's SNGs, they have a bigger edge in a bigger stack tournament with a slower blind structure.

I think most winning Party SNGers would agree that, if Party suddenly started using Stars' SNG structure, their ROI% would likely go up. Although their total earnings would go down due to the longer time spent on each tourney, and total earnings is the name of the game.

Taking your "craps tournament" analogy... say you play 2 tournaments, and in both you still bet pass line only, and your opponent still bets any seven. But lets say one tournament lasts 5 rolls, and the other 500. Which one are you most likely to win?

[tjh]

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I like to have as much time as possible with deeper stacks because that's where I have the biggest edge, so my hourly rate is higher in those tourneys.

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I very, very much doubt that this is true.


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Although you have every reason to doubt, my personal experience supports that it is possible to lose at Party and win at the deepstack SNG's.

I think the reason we win at party is partly because the fish do not see that the blinds are huge and the stacks are small and we start out the tournament almost desperately short stacked.

All the literature that a player can find, except for here, Favors a tighter playing style. A playing style that you can not afford at party.

When I started keeping records I found that I was making my online money (not much of it) at UB SNG's. So I played more of them and had a positive ROI.

I tried party but I could not win.

I was more or less able to figure out how to beat UB on my own, or by reading standard poker books. It was not until I found this forum that I was able to beat the Party format.

A party SNG is like a UB SNG on speed, and coke. It goes 4 times as fast. If the original poster reads the FAQ and the aleo-magus guide and posts some hands he will come to favor the party format. Until then he will be frustrated.

I hated them till I learned to beat them.