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View Full Version : Please explain why raising is good here...


12-02-2005, 01:24 PM
There was a hand quiz post a few days ago and without fail everyone agreed that it's correct to raise in this situation:

"Suppose you are in a full ring game 10 handed.

(1) It's folded to you in MP. What do you do with:

d) K J offsuit (RAISE)"

What are the reasons to raise this hand in this situation? What are we trying to accomplish with the raise? SSHE says to limp. Clearly I must be missing some good raising opportunities as I've been limping in this situation.

tiltaholic
12-02-2005, 01:27 PM
look up gregatron's post called something like "about the first 2 cards"

milesdyson
12-02-2005, 01:34 PM
what is MP?

utg utg+1 utg+2 mp1 mp2 mp3 co btn sb bb.

if it's folded to me 3 off the button (utg in a 6-handed game, mp2 in a 10-handed game), it's a raise. 4 off the button i still raise it. 5 off and i fold it.

it's all about position (and hand strength as well, but let's ignore that because position is so important to start thinking about for microplayers).

the best that can happen is you steal the blinds.
next best is that only one blind calls.
next next best is that only both blinds call.

you are close enough to the button to try to "buy it." we love having position on the field, and there are only 3 players behind us when we open raise this in mp2. if we limp, we have no initiative and we'll basically almost always get a player in behind us with position on us. so a huge part of raising this hand is buying position on the field.

12-02-2005, 01:44 PM
[ QUOTE ]
what is MP?

utg utg+1 utg+2 mp1 mp2 mp3 co btn sb bb.

if it's folded to me 3 off the button (utg in a 6-handed game, mp2 in a 10-handed game), it's a raise. 4 off the button i still raise it. 5 off and i fold it.

it's all about position (and hand strength as well, but let's ignore that because position is so important to start thinking about for microplayers).

the best that can happen is you steal the blinds.
next best is that only one blind calls.
next next best is that only both blinds call.

you are close enough to the button to try to "buy it." we love having position on the field, and there are only 3 players behind us when we open raise this in mp2. if we limp, we have no initiative and we'll basically almost always get a player in behind us with position on us. so a huge part of raising this hand is buying position on the field.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with the above, but would add that you CANNOT become stuck on this hand post flop. I usually auto bet when checked to, but will really need a read if an OOP player bets the flop. I think you are looking to steal the blinds or win on the flop unless you catch a good piece of the flop. I don't want a show-down unless I've made a solid hand or the next time you try this, you may get a cold call from the CO or button. I consider this a "hit and run" type of hand that has the best probability of success with decent reads on the players left to act.

12-02-2005, 01:55 PM
I think if you read between the lines in what Miles said, you are wiping out all the implied odds hands that are behind you in LP. People with hands such as A9s or worse are unlikely to call for two bets with hardly anyone in the pot. Assuming it gets folded to the blinds you are up against two random hands - your KJ is probably a favorite at this point. If you did not raise, you would essentially be giving the big blind a free card, this way you charge him for it.

I think another factor that must be emphasized is that you are the first person in the pot. SSHE tables are not so specific which is why they suggest limping with KJ.

12-02-2005, 02:05 PM
[ QUOTE ]
SSHE says to limp.

[/ QUOTE ]
SSHE also says, in no uncertain terms, that the starting hand charts are guidelines only.

And more importantly, from the paragraph I have accepted as my personal savior:

"In general, do not spend too much time contemplating specific preflop plays. If you have to think about it too long, the options probably run close in value. Instead, use that time to improve your postflop play."