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View Full Version : Marginal Call With Junk after CR All In 10+1

PokerAmateur4
12-01-2005, 02:30 PM
The Call was marginal, did I mess up anywhere in this hand? I realize if I intend on calling with junk I should either push or fold but besides thatproblem..

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

MP2 (t650)
CO (t2625)
Hero (t915)
SB (t460)
BB (t1020)
UTG (t555)
UTG+1 (t740)
MP1 (t1035)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls t30, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t125</font>, SB calls t110, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG folds.

Flop: (t310) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t150</font>, sb checkraises all-in, Hero calls t185.

Turn: (t645) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

River: (t645) 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

Final Pot: t645
cunningham22
12-01-2005, 02:32 PM
Hero bets t150, Hero calls t185.


...........
splashpot
12-01-2005, 02:32 PM
Fold preflop.
PokerAmateur4
12-01-2005, 02:34 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Hero bets t150, Hero calls t185.


...........

[/ QUOTE ]Ok I could of guessed that but please be more specific. basicly I would like to know

1) Should I of pushed or checked on the flop?

2) Considering I made the mistake of betting some, should I call the rest due to pot odds?

And why.

Cheers.
12-01-2005, 02:35 PM
Isn't it easy enough to figure out that the SB reraised all-in and hero called the final 185?
12-01-2005, 02:49 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Fold preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the best advise. The second best advise is to check fold on the flop
tigerite
12-01-2005, 02:51 PM
Ok, who invited the fish to 2+2? This is the second godawful play I've seen posted today.
DDH
12-01-2005, 02:58 PM
Either just call pre-flop, or fold.
12-01-2005, 03:00 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I realize if I intend on calling with junk I should either push or fold but besides thatproblem..

[/ QUOTE ]I don't think you ever had any reason to believe you were ahead in this hand. I would have folded pre-flop. I would not have bet the flop.

But, you want to know about pot odds to call the all-in. There is 310+150+335=795 in the pot and you have to call 185. 795:185 is about 4.25:1. PokerStove says you're 25.7% to beat A8o =&gt; you're about 3:1 to win the hand against A8o. You're getting the odds to call the all-in.

Even against AQo, you're 24.7% to win. If SB has AJ or KQ, you're a serious underdog (relative to pot odds), likewise if he has a set or if his Ax is two clubs. I guess you just have to decide what he might have.

Think of it this way: if you call the all-in, no one is going to tell you that was your worst play during the hand.
PokerAmateur4
12-01-2005, 03:12 PM
Thanks Zabt.

Call PF because such a bet like that is too small to push and an EP caller if he's smart has better than me therefore no advtange to raising(even with pos?)?

I don't think a fold on the button is any good?
---
If you could make fun of me while providing rational for why my moves were bad then have at, otherwise why bother? And I know the bet on flop was wrose then a check or a push, it was a mistake as I was not paying attention to chip stacks.
12-01-2005, 03:21 PM
[ QUOTE ]
And I know the bet on flop was wrose then a check or a push, it was a mistake as I was not paying attention to chip stacks.

[/ QUOTE ]Yesterday I failed to call a 25 chip raise when I didn't realize the player had gone all-in. Too many things going on on too many tables -- sure felt stupid.

I'd fold pre-flop, but I have an aversion to limping. Even with position, I don't think you're going to have a good idea where you are post-flop. Look at the actual hand to see a good example.
PokerAmateur4
12-01-2005, 03:23 PM
I don't see why it's between fold and call pre.

I figure a push is prolly bad but if it is why.
downtown
12-01-2005, 03:38 PM
If you're going to donk it up postflop, then a fold is obviously better pre. A pf fold is probably better here, but ok, a limp isn't terrible. Raising is.

If you limp, check behind on the flop though and check fold the turn. I mean, it's hard to answer what to do on later streets when earlier streets are so [censored], you know?
PokerAmateur4
12-01-2005, 03:48 PM
thats cool, but if you can explain why a raise is bad that would be very helpful
12-01-2005, 04:33 PM
Well, how about you tell us why you think a raise is good? What does it accomplish?
PokerAmateur4
12-02-2005, 01:23 AM
Pros for raising on the button:
-JK not bad
-Value added by being last to act in the hand if it goes to flop
-Value added by the possibility that UTG folds

I'm sure you're right but why.
wiggs73
12-02-2005, 01:46 AM
Playing KJ from any position for any amount of money during the first 2 levels is a leak.

You're going to often flop 2nd pair.
You're going to often flop top pair, but find yourself behind to AK, AJ, or KQ.
You're going to often miss completely and wish you hadn't put chips in with such a marginal hand.

Basically, it's a trouble hand. You're going to have a tough time winning big pots with this hand, but an easy time losing them.

In the first 2 levels, blinds are insignificant, so look for hands that you can play pots with confidently or get away from cheaply.