hit set on uni-suited flop [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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Pablo

12-01-2005, 10:48 AM

Do you bet this flop or wait for a safe card on the turn?

Ultimate Bet 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, MP2 calls, 3 folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players)

WalkAmongUs

12-01-2005, 10:49 AM

I'd go ahead and bet because you do have a large equity edge over anything except a made flush. In the event you are behind a made flush you have a bunch of outs to the full house.

jaxUp

12-01-2005, 10:50 AM

bet/cap flop. put in 2-3 bets on big streets UI.

Pablo

12-01-2005, 11:02 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I'd go ahead and bet because you do have a large equity edge over anything except a made flush. In the event you are behind a made flush you have a bunch of outs to the full house.

[/ QUOTE ]

That was my dilemna; I knew I had a large equity edge, but thought the extra 4 or 5 small bets going into the pot would give everybody odds to call to the river. Flawed thinking?

Pablo

12-01-2005, 11:07 AM

For better or worse, I checked the flop. When the player to my right bets the turn, should I try to protect my hand with a raise, or hope for overcalls?

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, MP2 calls, 3 folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks, MP2 checks.

Turn: (5 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, Hero ?

jaxUp

12-01-2005, 11:09 AM

I'd go a head and cap the turn and put in one bet on the river.

Pablo

12-01-2005, 11:10 AM

Comments on all streets welcome.

Ultimate Bet 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, MP2 calls, 3 folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks, MP2 checks.

Turn: (5 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, MP2 folds, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls.

River: (11 BB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, BB folds, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 13 BB

jaxUp

12-01-2005, 11:23 AM

overall this hand was way underplayed. The probability of someone having a made flush on the flop is not even close to high enough to scare us too much. What you may have been scared of was that there are still 2 cards left to come, and you don't want to put in a lot of bets only to be sucked out on. 35% of the time the flush will come in, the rest of the time we win the pot. This means that as long as we're not putting in more than 2/3 of the pot it is fine to raise like mad (until we believe there's a significant chance we're behind). Since it is not possible to be putting in more than 1/2 the pot, you should bet/raise like mad until you have good reason to believe you're behind.

@bsolute_luck

12-01-2005, 12:03 PM

you have to bet that flop. letting a lone heart out draw you is a bad idea.

Pablo

12-01-2005, 12:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
you have to bet that flop. letting a lone heart out draw you is a bad idea.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see how anybody with a heart is folding this flop; could you explain please?

jaxUp

12-01-2005, 12:19 PM

12-01-2005, 12:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
you have to bet that flop. letting a lone heart out draw you is a bad idea.

[/ QUOTE ]

this about sums it up. what are you scared off? even if a flush is out there (unlikely), you get 2 cards to redraw... just raise raise raise here.

12-01-2005, 01:58 PM

Hero raises. No question. Charge the SB and BB two bets to call with their one-heart flush out. Slowplaying sets is death. You should have been more aggressive on the flop too.

ScottieK

MrWookie47

12-01-2005, 02:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you have to bet that flop. letting a lone heart out draw you is a bad idea.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see how anybody with a heart is folding this flop; could you explain please?

[/ QUOTE ]

One thing that is an all too common misunderstanding amongst new limit players is that they can/should make it incorrect for people to draw to a flush. A FLUSH IS ALWAYS CORRECT TO CALL, except in very special circumstances, like two pair or trips boards. You won't ever be able to manipulate the pot size to make it incorrect for a flush draw to call. In fact, it's often correct for flush draws to bet and raise on the flop! If they can bet and raise for value, how do you think you're going to get them to fold? You can't. You have to accept that. Instead, when you have the best hand, you have to get your money in when you have the best of it and hope either the flush doesn't hit or you fill up. Even if the flush draw is correct to call, you're still gaining money.

milesdyson

12-01-2005, 02:20 PM

i played a hand like this yesterday.

i have KK in the small blind. K82/images/graemlins/diamond.gif flop, i bet/3-bet and the button caps.

turn 9r. i bet/call.

river 2, so i gots teh boat. i bet. he calls.

he shows T/images/graemlins/club.gif9/images/graemlins/heart.gif. wowowow. i guess the lesson is that people do stupid stuff on 1-suited flops (as well as when trips flop).

silly_monkey

12-01-2005, 02:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
For better or worse, I checked the flop. When the player to my right bets the turn, should I try to protect my hand with a raise, or hope for overcalls?

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, MP2 calls, 3 folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks, MP2 checks.

Turn: (5 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, Hero ?

[/ QUOTE ]

*grunch*

You need to bet/3-bet/cap this flop. Someone probably has has at least one heart, and there's a small chance that someone has two (less than 1 in 4). You have a ton of equity here, probably at least 50 percent. Jam as many bets as you can get in on the flop. Even if someone flopped the flush or makes it on the turn, you still have ten outs to fill up or make quads on the river.

On the turn. Given the way you played this hand you must raise here. Make the rest of the field pay to draw out. If he 3-bets just call. You DO NOT want overcalls here. If you just call you are giving great odds for people to call with a single heart.

If he just calls the turn lead the river if it isn't a heart. If he raises you are in a tough spot, but I would call. If he 3-bets the turn I would c/f the river UI. If the river is a heart, I think you can check and fold.

12-01-2005, 02:33 PM

Bet the flop. If someone is calling you with an Ah, Kh then fine, let them take the chance at it or maybe they already have a made flush. That's a shot worth taking since you have outs to a full house and quads. But since you check... you MUST raise the turn! UTG sure as hell isn't slowplaying a flush here since the only flush I could see him slowplay when there is 3 more people in the pot is an ace high flush and I have a hard time seeing him with one. Ok, I don't know his stats so he may be one of those that always limps with Axs. So with A10s+ he would prolly raise preflop. You are safe here against him. Raise and if he 3-bets, cap the turn.

Nice river card.

I just wish you would bet the flop, sure it's scary but you must test the water. Other than that, nh.