The bad side of it all...

This note is a goodbye or sorts.

Not many know me, but they'd know me if I posted under another name.

I used to think I was a good player, got into bad personal problems, and now have resorted to trying to get back to normal on my mother's credit.

This game is no good for anyone without a great amount of luck. This is my goodbye to 2+2, my family, and the world. Don't let thinking you're good at a game of cards ruin your life like it did mine.

I sat there and tried to find a suicide chat room on the internet, all you can find is phone numbers. I'm too ashamed to talk to someone over a telephone, so I figured I'd post here.

Poker ruined my relationship because the money wasn't regular. I made enough, but it wasn't regular enough, and maybe that's just a bad girl. But then I tried to get more and more trying to please the chick, and I [censored] myself over.

Don't fall into my trap. Online poker was a death trap for me, and I was a "winning" player. It only takes a bit of a bad run to kill you and make you hate your life. I just hope this serves as a message to all of the prospective "pros" out there. You better make a few hundred grand, and then go for a few hundred more safely.

But hey, I put someone through college, paid off 2 cars and a house. I must have did OK, right? Guess not...

Goodbye 2+2, and sorry for sounding like a bitch but my bipolar ass can't take this [censored] anymore.

I just feel like writing more.

There is only 1 other way in America to go as flat ass down and out as I did, and that's being an idiot in the stock market.

I hate myself right now, mainly just because I posted here instead of some dumb forum made for talk of [censored] like I'm speaking of.

The game consumed me and my life, I guess that's the only point I'm trying to make and I hope someone reads this. If not hopefully to say something to maybe save my dumb ass, then maybe to save someone else.

There is a bad side to this game, and you don't see it with as many top players as there are here. /images/graemlins/frown.gif I guess I personify the worst in everything that can happen, and I guess karma is a bitch.

28 views and not one reply. I guess I'm the only losing player here and I should promptly get on with it. Have fun, 2+2er's, just remember there's a bad side to it all.

So you're at the bottom now. At least there's nowhere else to go but up. Suck it up. You've been successful before and you'll get there again.

And I hope you're just joking man.

[Alobar]

if you wanna talk to someone, PM me and ill give you my phone numver....im not a suicide hotline, and ill prolly tell you you are just being a little bitch, but ill at least listen and [censored]

[ QUOTE ]
So you're at the bottom now. At least there's nowhere else to go but up. Suck it up. You've been successful before and you'll get there again.

And I hope you're just joking man.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you really think I'm joking? I'm sitting here debating either pulling a trigger or stealing from my own mother, to try to get back to normal. At that point, I'm thinking situation 1 is probably better.

[Alobar]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So you're at the bottom now. At least there's nowhere else to go but up. Suck it up. You've been successful before and you'll get there again.

And I hope you're just joking man.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you really think I'm joking? I'm sitting here debating either pulling a trigger or stealing from my own mother, to try to get back to normal. At that point, I'm thinking situation 1 is probably better.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah im sure thats what ure mom would want too

[chuddo]

http://jameth.whatthefuck.com/oct2005/kickflip.gif

[ QUOTE ]
if you wanna talk to someone, PM me and ill give you my phone numver....im not a suicide hotline, and ill prolly tell you you are just being a little bitch, but ill at least listen and [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

Why do you think I posted here... probably the biggest thing I need is someone to tell me I'm being a little bitch.

I'm only like a grand in the hole after taking care of everything the ex left in the warpath, and everything for her for the last 3 years.

But when you have nothing, you have the tendency to want to grab something that isn't yours to get what should be yours.

So in essence, I'm being a little bitch, but I'm also on the verge of stealing from loved ones, and I think I'd rather say [censored] it and go away than sit here and actually believe that I'm contemplating it.

I'm just really [censored] in the head right now, and didn't know where else to turn or post. So I figured even if it was just 2+2ers screaming at me, that's better than having no one to talk to.

I'm not hopeless, I'm just pissed off, bipolar, broke, alone, and contemplating [censored] theft to try to get out of a hole.

[censored] Gamblers Anonymous, give me some 2+2ers to set me straight.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So you're at the bottom now. At least there's nowhere else to go but up. Suck it up. You've been successful before and you'll get there again.

And I hope you're just joking man.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you really think I'm joking? I'm sitting here debating either pulling a trigger or stealing from my own mother, to try to get back to normal. At that point, I'm thinking situation 1 is probably better.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah im sure thats what ure mom would want too

[/ QUOTE ]

Rather than think her son was a two-bit thief that would contemplate theft from her, quite possibly. /images/graemlins/frown.gif

I don't know, I'm going to go have a smoke and come back. Maybe I'm just freaking out on myself.

At least now, even if some of the replies I get are negative, at least I'm talking. That's more than I had 20 minutes ago. /images/graemlins/frown.gif

You need to sleep off whatever you've been drinking. Just remember you live in the land of opportunity and not some crappy third world hellhole. There's always hope here.

[Alobar]

so then quit being a [censored] pussy, take your damn meds, make some money the old fashion way and snap out of it.

Dont cop out into the whole "I cant stop myself from doing what I knoew is wrong" lame ass excuse and just [censored] do what it is you know you should be doing.

[Lazymeatball]

http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/8338/hello5sw.jpg

[imitation]

I'll go into my local street where I live, in China, and take some photos of people who live next to an area which smells like an open sewer, and are sorting through garbage for there next meal whilst folding pieces of paper they find so they can pedal it 30km to sell for about $1USD. Your life is a luxury. Get over yourself.

My life is a luxury?? I love it, you made me laugh.

All of my normal income has come to paying off delinquent bills ran up by my ex. Hence, in turn I borrow money off my family to try to make it the way I know best. It's not enough - I need more - but now I know the only way I'm getting more than $100 is to steal.

I'm not a thief, and frankly I'm quite unsatisfied with my life. I lost the love of my life, my house, my car, and most of my family in a [censored] year.

What the hell would you do? I've explored every damn alternative, there is no escaping the hole I'm in, other than to make a big score. It's not like I don't work a job and I'm some vagrant, the money just doesn't satisfy all I'm now responsible for because of the choices I made for my former female companionship.

I guess the question is, do I try to make the big score thieving, or just blow my brains out now?

I could take enough to win enough to get myself out of the hole to where life would be manageable. Even working 60+ hours a week the last two months, I'm just scratching the surface of what my ex rang up on us.

So it's either A) stoop and become a thief and take 5 bills and hope to make around $1800 in the next week, - B) get them to take me to the doctor because the stress has obviously made me insane - C) Shoot myself in the head - or D) Do nothing but work, make myself worse and post more messages to a bunch of folks who could give a [censored] what I really do.

What would you do?

[chuddo]

file for bankruptcy. go to a third world country (i suggest somewhere in africa) and spend a year or so doing nothing but helping people way less fortunate than you.

teach some poor kids how to speak english, read, and do basic math.

if you are too self-censored to even consider something like this, then by all means so long nice to know you.

i have always considered suicide to be one of the most selfish and cowardly things possible.

[gmrankin]

http://www.morethings.com/fan/the_shield/pictures/vic-get_over_it64.jpg

[WackityWhiz]

ever jerk it to your avatar?

[ QUOTE ]
file for bankruptcy. go to a third world country (i suggest somewhere in africa) and spend a year or so doing nothing but helping people way less fortunate than you.

teach some poor kids how to speak english, read, and do basic math.

if you are too self-censored to even consider something like this, then by all means so long nice to know you.

i have always considered suicide to be one of the most selfish and cowardly things possible.

[/ QUOTE ]

My job is helping the handicapped. I'm a wheelchair coordinator for Spirit Airlines, my only job is to help those less fortunate than me to travel. Help them get checked in, get on their planes, or get off the plane, get their baggage and get to their loved ones.

It's not a question of moral fiber. It's a question of having before, and not having now with more responsibilities than I should have because of an idiot former companion.

I don't even care that she's gone, I care that I'm actually contemplating thieving to make my life somewhat normal again.

I do appreciate the response even though it may seem that I'm bitter towards it. I just needed people to talk to. I'm just having a really hard time coping with everything that has been shoveled into my lap.

[ZeeJustin]

Your life probably sucks right now, and I know exactly what it's like to be unbearable, but I can't see how you are in a position where suicide is the best option.

I know exactly what you are going through. For very different reasons, I was very close to ending my life a couple of times back in 7th grade. Looking back, I am unbelievably fortunate that I decided not to end things. My life is amazing now, and it's absurd to me when I think about how close I was to ending it all.

Maybe the next week of your life will suck. Maybe the next month will suck. Maybe the next year will suck. Maybe the next couple of years will suck. Maybe.

If you end your life, that's it for your existence on earth. You will be no more. All that joy that you could have experienced in the rest of your life will no longer have a chance. Maybe you will fall in love. Maybe you will have kids. Maybe you will find some meaning for your life. There is no maybe if you end it all tonight.

Through my depression, my biggest regret was not talking to anyone. I had a few real close friends, and my parents were very loving and supportive, but I was always too afraid to bring it up with them. There was a lot they could have done to help, from emotional support to doctors to drugs. I never gave them a chance to help out, and I almost screwed things up for myself by doing that. I am just very fortunate to be here today despite my stupid actions (or lack there of) in the past. I hope that you will make the right decision, and you will be here too, for decisions other than luck.

Stealing and poker are probably not the answers for you. Talk to your mom. Talk to your other family / friends. See what they recommend. There are always other options. They're not always fun, especially at the start, but they are options none the less.

-Don't do it
-Justin Bonomo

[gmrankin]

[ QUOTE ]
ever jerk it to your avatar?

[/ QUOTE ]

ahh that was good... time to wash up?

[gmrankin]

http://www.notinthenameofpeace.com/wp-content/thumb-eatthai.jpg

[ QUOTE ]
Your life probably sucks right now, and I know exactly what it's like to be unbearable, but I can't see how you are in a position where suicide is the best option.

I know exactly what you are going through. For very different reasons, I was very close to ending my life a couple of times back in 7th grade. Looking back, I am unbelievably fortunate that I decided not to end things. My life is amazing now, and it's absurd to me when I think about how close I was to ending it all.

Maybe the next week of your life will suck. Maybe the next month will suck. Maybe the next year will suck. Maybe the next couple of years will suck. Maybe.

If you end your life, that's it for your existence on earth. You will be no more. All that joy that you could have experienced in the rest of your life will no longer have a chance. Maybe you will fall in love. Maybe you will have kids. Maybe you will find some meaning for your life. There is no maybe if you end it all tonight.

Through my depression, my biggest regret was not talking to anyone. I had a few real close friends, and my parents were very loving and supportive, but I was always too afraid to bring it up with them. There was a lot they could have done to help, from emotional support to doctors to drugs. I never gave them a chance to help out, and I almost screwed things up for myself by doing that. I am just very fortunate to be here today despite my stupid actions (or lack there of) in the past. I hope that you will make the right decision, and you will be here too, for decisions other than luck.

Stealing and poker are probably not the answers for you. Talk to your mom. Talk to your other family / friends. See what they recommend. There are always other options. They're not always fun, especially at the start, but they are options none the less.

-Don't do it
-Justin Bonomo

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm just at a loss, man. I hear your voice, and as long as I've lurked here I have a *great* idea of your success.

I used to be successful too, but not to your degree. Now it's like everything that can come down, IS. I lost my father at 12 to Agent Orange (he served 3 tours in Nam). I'm diagnosed PTSS, bipolar. I should have never started in the game in the first place, but it and a job paid the bills for a long time. I paid off school for my ex, her car, my car, etc, etc, etc. I could bore you with the details, but I won't. It basically came down to the endless flood of money ran out, and when it did she was only too happy to leave, and leave all the bills and other trauma on my lap because it was nearly all in my name.

I just want my life back, man. I gave it up for a woman who i thought would be the one to - as you say - "get married, have kids", type deal. I never thought about her leaving and doing me like this.

I appreciate all of these responses, even the ones meant to pick fun at me for being such an idiotic little bitch. I actually unloaded the gun and put on the safety if it means anything to anyone here.

I realize I'd be taking a cowards way out. But what's worse, knowing that everything will get worse if you do nothing but what you're doing (working hard), or stealing once and possibly getting quite back to a sense of normalcy?

----

Oh, and the other person who claimed I should "sleep off the drink" - I haven't had a drink in nearly 6 months. I tried to quit because my ex had an alcohol problem, so I was going to quit for her. I quit, she didn't, we split - and now here we are.

----

I thank you very much, Justin. Through my time lurking here I've become a great fan of not only your play, but your idiosyncratic posts as well, and it means a lot that someone of your stature would send a post on such a dumb subject as this. I didn't know your situation was that tough before you made it.

[Stu Pidasso]

[ QUOTE ]
So it's either A) stoop and become a thief and take 5 bills and hope to make around $1800 in the next week, - B) get them to take me to the doctor because the stress has obviously made me insane - C) Shoot myself in the head - or D) Do nothing but work, make myself worse and post more messages to a bunch of folks who could give a [censored] what I really do.

What would you do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Option B is the only +EV decision but you already know that.

Stu

[ZeeJustin]

[ QUOTE ]
I actually unloaded the gun and put on the safety if it means anything to anyone here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm very happy to hear that. I hope that you never have to think about this again.

[young nut]

You gotta start thinking of life as long term. This is just short term variance that sucks, it will pass soon.

[diebitter]

Here's what Yoda would say... (http://gallery.erikv.nl/albums/stfu/up_the_shut_fuck.highlight.jpg)

[mostsmooth]

after reading it all, it looks like youre thinking straight , so go file for bankruptcy and start over.

[ QUOTE ]
after reading it all, it looks like youre thinking straight , so go file for bankruptcy and start over.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's an idea, but I've already thrown so much money at the situation that it would probably just piss me off. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

At least I'm laughing about it now. I'd like to thank ZeeJustin and Devin especially for sending some really quality messages privately that really helped get my mind back on track.

It's not that much money, but it's enough to make you not think clearly and want to blow your brains out.

I think it's more the case that I know I was capable of making this type of money before my ex made me give the game up and then subsequently left me. It just feels like my life was nearly stripped from me, so it didn't seem like as much of a stretch to either steal to get it back or end it.

Thanks for helping me think a bit more clearly, 2+2. I'm going to go take a nap and sleep on it a bit, and see how I feel in the afternoon.

Hopefully this isn't a complete flame-fest when I return. Even though the subject matter isn't a great topic, I don't think I'm an idiot that deserves a ton of flames. I got a lot more help out of this thread than you could possibly know.

Thanks again 2+2.

[mostsmooth]

by the way, this thread should have been started in the psych forum /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[phil_ivey_fan]

[ QUOTE ]
This note is a goodbye or sorts.

Not many know me, but they'd know me if I posted under another name.

I used to think I was a good player, got into bad personal problems, and now have resorted to trying to get back to normal on my mother's credit.

This game is no good for anyone without a great amount of luck. This is my goodbye to 2+2, my family, and the world. Don't let thinking you're good at a game of cards ruin your life like it did mine.

I sat there and tried to find a suicide chat room on the internet, all you can find is phone numbers. I'm too ashamed to talk to someone over a telephone, so I figured I'd post here.

Poker ruined my relationship because the money wasn't regular. I made enough, but it wasn't regular enough, and maybe that's just a bad girl. But then I tried to get more and more trying to please the chick, and I [censored] myself over.

Don't fall into my trap. Online poker was a death trap for me, and I was a "winning" player. It only takes a bit of a bad run to kill you and make you hate your life. I just hope this serves as a message to all of the prospective "pros" out there. You better make a few hundred grand, and then go for a few hundred more safely.

But hey, I put someone through college, paid off 2 cars and a house. I must have did OK, right? Guess not...

Goodbye 2+2, and sorry for sounding like a bitch but my bipolar ass can't take this [censored] anymore.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're getting better KKF

[Uglyowl]

Visit a children's hospital with 3 year old kids with terminal diseases and you will never feel sorry for yourself again.

[darkcore]

[ QUOTE ]
Visit a children's hospital with 3 year old kids with terminal diseases and you will never feel sorry for yourself again.

[/ QUOTE ]

best advice so far....

[Good Idea]

Didn't you just post that you needed $1800? $1800? C'mon, when my ex-wife left and I started opening my own mail I discovered that I was stuck $80,000 in credit card debt and $70,000 worth of stocks had been sold and the cash gone. It's very difficult to stand in the middle of a storm and remember that the sun is shining somewhere, but it is. And eventually it will shine on you again. $1800? I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you are 21 years old or younger. If you're actually older than 21 then you need to man up and handle your business. Either way I would strongly reccommend that you speak to a professional if for no other reason than to verbalize how you feel about your current situation. You would be amazed how that puts things into perspective. Seriously, $1800?

Regards,
G.I.

[zephed]

[ QUOTE ]
Didn't you just post that you needed $1800? $1800? C'mon, when my ex-wife left and I started opening my own mail I discovered that I was stuck $80,000 in credit card debt and $70,000 worth of stocks had been sold and the cash gone. It's very difficult to stand in the middle of a storm and remember that the sun is shining somewhere, but it is. And eventually it will shine on you again. $1800? I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you are 21 years old or younger. If you're actually older than 21 then you need to man up and handle your business. Either way I would strongly reccommend that you speak to a professional if for no other reason than to verbalize how you feel about your current situation. You would be amazed how that puts things into perspective. Seriously, $1800?

Regards,
G.I.

[/ QUOTE ]
WTF? That requires a story. You didn't even notice?

For the original poster:

Watch the movie: "What the Bleep do we know"

I think it will put things into perspective for you.

Also, I think think this is an important concept:

No matter how f*cked up my current situation is, I just think about my life in 5 years from now and how whatever just happened to me right now, I probably wont even remember it.

[Big Limpin']

[ QUOTE ]
I actually unloaded the gun and put on the safety if it means anything to anyone here.


[/ QUOTE ]
Good. Now go sell that gun use that $ to play cards.
2 birds/ 1 stone.
The *worst* case is you bust that $, so you are back where you started, sans gun. THats still better.

[ QUOTE ]
you're getting better KKF


[/ QUOTE ]
I hope you're right. He hasn't posted since this a.m.

It sounds like you're assuming a victim role stance, which isn't surprising given that you think you're powerless over other people and events. Also, you apparently have a problem with dichotomous 'all or nothing' type thinking. For example, you say either you commit suicide or you steal mom's money. I would be pretty miserable too if I believed those were my only two options. Rather, you have a whole host of other options you have discounted. Perhaps you're unaware that you don't have to allow yourself to think and behave in a self-defeating, irrational manner. In fact, people and things do not disturb us, rather we disturb ourselves by believing they CAN disturb us. You act as though you're the innocent victim of a heartless witch (ex-girlfriend) but in reality you've allowed yourself to be exploited.

Also, if we take your ideology to the extreme all people who are having severe financial problems like bankruptcy should commit suicide. Can't you see how insane this is? I think you should seriously consider seeing a cognitive behavioral therapist (and/or psychiatrist) to work on your absolutist, dichotomous, and generally irrational thinking. You are definately awfulizing and catastrophizing and the obvious result is severe depression. The problem is not what has happened to you, rather your beliefs about what have happened to you. For it's your beliefs and not the original activating event (e.g. going broke) that leads to the cognitive/emotive consequence.

If you're mind isn't racing too fast and you're composed enough to read a book I recommend reading anything by Albert Ellis (founder of cognitive therapy, specifically Rational-Emotive Therapy). In particular, try 'How to Stubbornley Refuse to Allow Yourself to Feel Miserable About Anything...YES ANYTHING!' If you can't afford a copy go to your local library or try Amazon.com for used copies.

If you truly feel imminently suicidal you need immediate medical help, beyond what anybody here can offer. I truly hope the best for you and can relate as I take anti-convulsants for mood-disorder (bipolar and Aspergar's). Also, I was $15,000 in the hole due to medical bills. I was extremely depressed but fought my way back over 3 years (it wasn't easy). The fight itself can be rewarding in and of itself. That being said, get thy butt to the hospital if you feel out of control or suicidal.

JeffreyREBT

[jzpiano14]

sounds to me like u just want attention, seriously though $1k, even somebody at McDonalds can earn this

I make 1k in 1 good night at 10-20 like wtf

[Python49]

A very well thought out attempt by a 12 year old to have $1800 shipped to his account. I hope nobody was duped.

[ QUOTE ]
A very well thought out attempt by a 12 year old to have $1800 shipped to his account. I hope nobody was duped.

[/ QUOTE ]

First off, piss off.

If I want to stake myself, I got a perfectly good CC# here to steal off of, that's a family members. Nice try.

The main point of the post was to try to talk myself out of both/either stealing from my family in an attempt to make my life better, or pulling a trigger and ending my [censored] life.

Thanks for taking the prick point of view though, you are of course entitled to it.

$1800 would make my life better for about 3 weeks, until the next round of bills came through. I was just looking for people to talk to, but thanks for making it seem like I'm just scrounging for cash.

If I was, I'd just rip it off this credit card, hell of a lot easier.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I actually unloaded the gun and put on the safety if it means anything to anyone here.


[/ QUOTE ]
Good. Now go sell that gun use that $ to play cards.
2 birds/ 1 stone.
The *worst* case is you bust that $, so you are back where you started, sans gun. THats still better.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, and if I bust that, then I have to go to a painful way to end it.

After talking to people last night I felt a lot better. Then [censored] starting building on this night and I feel a lot worse.

What's worse? Being a thief that will steal from your own family; being a person who will kill themselves to avoid responsibility for things they shouldn't really have to be responsible for or; being someone trying to talk a problem out with strangers?

I've been taking choice 3, although with todays responses I'm not so sure I shouldn't just rip the gat out and end it.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you're getting better KKF


[/ QUOTE ]
I hope you're right. He hasn't posted since this a.m.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am still alive.

Private messages made me see through to another day.

These public messages are making me wish I hadn't. I'm not a [censored] thief, I don't want to be staked, I just was looking for some guidance on a public message board that I know gets millions of hits daily because there is nothing for suicidal people online. I don't want to talk over a phone to some hotline.

Talking online last night made me feel better, seeing these messages today just makes me feel like dogshit.

There is a bad side to poker, your girl can hate it and make you quit and then when you don't have that income anymore she can leave you and stick you with tens of thousands in bills.

Whatever I guess it really doesn't matter, I guess I see what the majority of the board thinks of me, like I'm some 12 year old out to score money.

[censored] that, I don't want your money, I just wanted support, and some talk and maybe some guidance. Apparently I should have just sucked it up and called a hotline and had them tell me "You don't want to do it, please don't."

Instead, I'll probably just steal from my own mother because there's a huge reload, try to roll it up far too fast, bust, and then blow my [censored] brains out. Not like anyone would really give a [censored], because I know I don't think I give much of one anymore either.

[ QUOTE ]
It sounds like you're assuming a victim role stance, which isn't surprising given that you think you're powerless over other people and events. Also, you apparently have a problem with dichotomous 'all or nothing' type thinking. For example, you say either you commit suicide or you steal mom's money. I would be pretty miserable too if I believed those were my only two options. Rather, you have a whole host of other options you have discounted. Perhaps you're unaware that you don't have to allow yourself to think and behave in a self-defeating, irrational manner. In fact, people and things do not disturb us, rather we disturb ourselves by believing they CAN disturb us. You act as though you're the innocent victim of a heartless witch (ex-girlfriend) but in reality you've allowed yourself to be exploited.

[/ QUOTE ]

Point taken, well put - and probably 100% percent correct.

[ QUOTE ]


Also, if we take your ideology to the extreme all people who are having severe financial problems like bankruptcy should commit suicide. Can't you see how insane this is? I think you should seriously consider seeing a cognitive behavioral therapist (and/or psychiatrist) to work on your absolutist, dichotomous, and generally irrational thinking. You are definately awfulizing and catastrophizing and the obvious result is severe depression. The problem is not what has happened to you, rather your beliefs about what have happened to you. For it's your beliefs and not the original activating event (e.g. going broke) that leads to the cognitive/emotive consequence.



[/ QUOTE ]

No offense, but you want to pay the doc bill? I completely hear what you are saying, but I'm already broke with no medical insurance. To see a "cognitive behavioral therapist" takes mucho dinero I'm sure.

I'd love to have a medical professional tell me I'm insane and try to help, unfortunately in our [censored] up world that takes money. I haven't been to a doc since I was able to be under my family insurance (years ago), and back then all they did was throw me on Prozac and Zoloft - which did basically squat because I have a pretty strong mind to still see through to everything that was bothering me. After all, I'm [censored] depressed, not stupid. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ QUOTE ]


If you're mind isn't racing too fast and you're composed enough to read a book I recommend reading anything by Albert Ellis (founder of cognitive therapy, specifically Rational-Emotive Therapy). In particular, try 'How to Stubbornley Refuse to Allow Yourself to Feel Miserable About Anything...YES ANYTHING!' If you can't afford a copy go to your local library or try Amazon.com for used copies.

If you truly feel imminently suicidal you need immediate medical help, beyond what anybody here can offer. I truly hope the best for you and can relate as I take anti-convulsants for mood-disorder (bipolar and Aspergar's). Also, I was $15,000 in the hole due to medical bills. I was extremely depressed but fought my way back over 3 years (it wasn't easy). The fight itself can be rewarding in and of itself. That being said, get thy butt to the hospital if you feel out of control or suicidal.



[/ QUOTE ]

No offense, but I don't see going to a hospital and being strapped to a chair and termed "insane" as particularly helpful to my situation. Yes, I probably could go read a book, and I know lots of places to steal excellent literature online. (And, for the authors of this website, let me tell you - I've *NEVER* seen a pirate 2+2 book in existence, which with the explosion of the poker boom, is very suprising.)

Anyways, reading a book and learning why I am [censored] up isn't going to help much. I know why I'm [censored] up. I'm bipolar, diagnosed PTSS after watching my father die a terrible death for 3 years from Agent Orange. (If you don't know what this is, read some Vietnam literature.)

The pills don't help, probably because I have a strong psyche. Obviously, I've wanted to throw it all away for at least a night now, slept it off, came back and got right back on the same tip after I read some of the stupider posts I've seen.

Many have been helpful and supportive. I *really* thank you. I don't really want to kill myself, but I don't want to steal either, especially from my own family. But, the fact of the matter is that once you have relied on this game for a substantial portion of your income, and then you let it go because you have "other" things to lean on (a 2nd income, ala fiancee), and then realize once those "other" things are gone that the only way you can get back to "normal" is to get money - you'll trip out just like I am.

Anyways, while I'm posting tonight I don't have a gun in my hands, just my keyboard. I owe it to all of the kind posters that have responded either publically or privately to stay the course at least one more night and try to figure out something to help myself, even if its just telling everyone to [censored] off and moving to Kamchatka and playing RISK with Ethiopians for several years.

[ QUOTE ]
I make 1k in 1 good night at 10-20 like wtf

[/ QUOTE ]

Woo-hoo... that's 50 bets, want a cookie?

It's responses like this that really irk me. First off, If I had the bankroll to play 10-20 legitimately - I probably wouldn't have financial problems. Secondly, if I had the bankroll to play 10-20 legitimately, the thought of killing myself would probably have never have entered my mind.

I mean [censored] man, save this for the idiots that come in begging for a stake. All I wanted was good chatter because I can't talk about this [censored] with any of my friends or family on this level without being locked up and strapped down.

I'm glad you make 50 bets a session at 10/20, though. At the same time, I fail to see how it's relevant to the conversation. Everyone's stumbling on this $1800 mark, that's just enough to get [censored] off my back for the next month (IE, through the holidays). If all I needed to fix my life was $1800, I'd bite bullet, grab my gun and go rob the neighborhood 7-11, and be done with it. I definitely wouldn't fathom blowing my own brains out.

BTW - Thanks to the moderator for moving this to the psychology forum. In my state last night I did not even begin to think that this would be a more appropriate place.

No offense Rivermonger, but it doesn't sound like you believe you can do anything to resolve or improve your self-imposed misery. And this is important: IT IS SELF-IMPOSED. To reiterate, you are chosing to think in this crazy, illogical, dichotomous fashion.

I would be in the depths of a serious major depression if I thought the way you did (and I used to). And I 'don't want to pay the doctor bill.' But, if you are as poverty-stricken as you say you are (and I have no reason to doubt) you may not need money to get comprehensive medical attention. First of all, if you are poor and/or mentally disabled (bipolar is recognized as a severe medical impairment) you probably quality for medicaid/medical assistance. And if you're too mentally disorganized to work you could get disability. Futhermore, many therapists and mental health professionals work on sliding scales. Also, the materials I referenced (by Albert Ellis on rational emotive psychology) are free or inexpensively purchased used. Even if you didn't quality for anything you could see a medical professional anyways since bankruptcy is in your imminent future and the law says you have to be treated at the ER if they accept federal medical insurance.

BTW, I didn't mean to state or imply drugs were your only hope. I personally have found working on thinking more rationally has improved my life exponentially. I was in a really vile, pathetic position about 3 years ago and it literally saved my life. A psychologist gave me CBT (cognitive-behavioral psychology) book for free and I actually employed the techniques and worked with great desire to improve my thinking and self-defeating behaviors. It worked it my estimation. Let me tell you something, I was probably in a position similar to yours. And this is why you will never get the symphathy you think you deserve on this message board: almost all of us have had extremely difficult, nasty, unfair cirumstances and have been forced to overcome them. There is nothing special or unique about your case. You come across as egotistical (not to me) but to others because I think it appears as though you vastly over-rate the importance of your material problems. I don't think most people wish harm on you; they just think it sounds like you're having whining tantrums about how life is unfair and how you've been mistreated. They are simply saying: GET OVER IT!

I hope you reread my original message. I adamently tried to describe the reason for your misery (which is obvious). Perhaps I failed. PEOPLE AND THINGS DO NOT DISTURB US, rather we upset OURSELVES by believe they CAN disturb us. You are not upset, depressed and miserable because you are poor or because your your girlfriend left you. You are upset, depressed and miserable because of your beliefs about being poor or being shunned. If you didn't believe 'I musn't be poor or I will be hopelessly depressed and useless' you wouldn't be so miserable. You probably would realize you're in an unfortunate position that isn't desireable and would try to improve your financial status.

Assume that A is an 'activating event' like losing a girlfriend or being broke. Many people falsely believe that they are depressed becaus something negative (like the above) happened. Let us plot a few variables and see what your situation looks like.

A='Activating Event' Losing girlfriend and going broke
B='Belief about Activating Event' This is HORRIBLE and I can't stand it. How unfair and cruel. This is AWFUL!
C='Consequence' You feel very hopeless, angry and depressed

Now, it's not activating event 'A' that actually makes you upset and depressed. Rather, intervening variable 'B' is the culprit. Your negative cognitive-emotive result is a function of your ideology on poverty and being dumped, not the actual event itself. Let us replace 'B' with a more rational thought and see what happens:

A='Activating Event' Losing girlfriend and going broke
B='Belief about Activating Event' This is very unfortunate, frustrating and upsetting but I can still find ways to find enjoyment in my life and next time use better judgment. C='Consequence' You feel healthy remorse and a healthy level of frustration that leads you to make better choices in the future. You don't feel hopelessly powerless and suicidal but instead tell yourself 'tough luck, this is highly unfortunate but that's life.'

Anyways, this model (which is admittedly an oversimplification of the original to some extent) has helped me in a tremendous way. I was living in an ant-infested apartment with $15,000 in credit card debt from medical bills and felt suicidal and miserable. I utilized these cognitive techniques and effectively and rationally dealt with financial, emotional, and economic problems (rather than having tantrums and making unrealistic demands of the world and myself). I'm saying you could do the same if only you'd give up your irrational set of beliefs and behaviors.

Good luck,

JeffreyREBT

[ QUOTE ]
No offense Rivermonger, but it doesn't sound like you believe you can do anything to resolve or improve your self-imposed misery. And this is important: IT IS SELF-IMPOSED. To reiterate, you are chosing to think in this crazy, illogical, dichotomous fashion.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why is it self-imposed? I'm over the woman leaving, I'm not over the financial destruction she left in her path. It's not like I'm indigent, unemployed, and a fool. I am doing everything I can to get out of the hole, yet it just gets deeper. I have a good job, have arranged payment plans with all of the creditors involved, etc.

The fact of the matter is that almost every dime I have I spend to get out of debt that really shouldn't be there in the first place. THIS is my fault, as I shouldn't have entered into a contract with a [censored] woman, whether she be fiancee, wife, mother - etc. If I'd never signed my name on the dotted lines, I'd not be in this unfortunate position.

The fact that I'm miserable isn't self-imposed. The fact that I'm broke after every paycheck with little to nothing to show for it other than enough to live day-to-day and be able to eat isn't self-imposed either. The fact that all I have is this is making me miserable. I'd like to take my next paycheck and go to one of the Michigan casinos and play some damn cards, maybe go on a date, maybe go and spend a night at the bar with my friends. I'm not in position to do anything but work, eat, sleep and pay at this point. That's not self-imposed.

[ QUOTE ]


I would be in the depths of a serious major depression if I thought the way you did (and I used to). And I 'don't want to pay the doctor bill.' But, if you are as poverty-stricken as you say you are (and I have no reason to doubt) you may not need money to get comprehensive medical attention. First of all, if you are poor and/or mentally disabled (bipolar is recognized as a severe medical impairment) you probably quality for medicaid/medical assistance. And if you're too mentally disorganized to work you could get disability. Futhermore, many therapists and mental health professionals work on sliding scales. Also, the materials I referenced (by Albert Ellis on rational emotive psychology) are free or inexpensively purchased used. Even if you didn't quality for anything you could see a medical professional anyways since bankruptcy is in your imminent future and the law says you have to be treated at the ER if they accept federal medical insurance.



[/ QUOTE ]

I am not indigent. I work, and work a lot. Unfortunately, we are not offered benefits, or I would probably already have been to a doc, as good as I think it would really do me. I'm also not in bankruptcy, the main reason I'm as screwed as I am is the fact that I *KEEP* paying these creditors. I'm just sick of paying for [censored] that I truly didn't accrue. The living arrangements wouldn't have went to hell had I lived there, that was just a stupid mistake that I made trusting a female. I have enough money to eat, and keep in my current living arrangements. I have no extras, as I pay these bills. That's probably why I seem as crazy as I sound, because I haven't had a speck of fun since the bitch left.

[ QUOTE ]


BTW, I didn't mean to state or imply drugs were your only hope. I personally have found working on thinking more rationally has improved my life exponentially. I was in a really vile, pathetic position about 3 years ago and it literally saved my life. A psychologist gave me CBT (cognitive-behavioral psychology) book for free and I actually employed the techniques and worked with great desire to improve my thinking and self-defeating behaviors. It worked it my estimation. Let me tell you something, I was probably in a position similar to yours. And this is why you will never get the symphathy you think you deserve on this message board: almost all of us have had extremely difficult, nasty, unfair cirumstances and have been forced to overcome them. There is nothing special or unique about your case. You come across as egotistical (not to me) but to others because I think it appears as though you vastly over-rate the importance of your material problems. I don't think most people wish harm on you; they just think it sounds like you're having whining tantrums about how life is unfair and how you've been mistreated. They are simply saying: GET OVER IT!



[/ QUOTE ]

I actually have thought quite rationally. I do not want to talk to some shrink over a phone on a suicide hotline. I came here because I knew that it was a vast community from all walks of life, and from my lurking and former posts I knew I could expect a wide variety of answers.

I think you misread me, I am far from looking for sympathy - far from it. I was more or less looking for guidance and a reason to keep myself alive. I don't need sympathy, because at a suicidal point - you really don't give a damn for yourself. I haven't for some time.

If I was to be struck down tomorrow without killing myself, I would probably welcome it. I guess I'm just too much of a pussy to do it myself, so I came here looking for a reason to justify NOT doing it.

It's only money, but in our crazy society, money makes the world go around. Those who have it, usually want not for anything. Those who don't have it, want for everything. I am a special case, in the fact that I don't want money for myself.

The reason, if you read my original post - that I started contemplating suicide was because I was contemplating stealing off my mother's credit card to stake myself into poker. At that point, where I would think of stealing from a family member to try to recoup enough financially to get some breathing room for a month or two, I seriously though about ending it. It's not like I'm thinking of this so I can have material things, I'm thinking of it so I can fix problems.

[ QUOTE ]

I hope you reread my original message. I adamently tried to describe the reason for your misery (which is obvious). Perhaps I failed. PEOPLE AND THINGS DO NOT DISTURB US, rather we upset OURSELVES by believe they CAN disturb us. You are not upset, depressed and miserable because you are poor or because your your girlfriend left you. You are upset, depressed and miserable because of your beliefs about being poor or being shunned. If you didn't believe 'I musn't be poor or I will be hopelessly depressed and useless' you wouldn't be so miserable. You probably would realize you're in an unfortunate position that isn't desireable and would try to improve your financial status.


[/ QUOTE ]

That's the thing, I'm not poor, and without all of this dumped in my lap, I really wouldn't have much cause to "improve my financial status". I do fairly well at my job, and will be eligible for company benefits soon as they are opening up benefits to non-executives. If it was a magic slate that could just wipe clean, I wouldn't need poker, or a second job to be completely comfortable for the rest of my life. I also could give a damn about the girl, we had a great relationship, and it didn't end by cheating or anything of the kind. The only thing I care about her is the fact that she is unwilling to help with any of the mess she caused because she isn't "legally responsible". I love her to death, but I contemplated her death before I contemplated mine.

[ QUOTE ]

Assume that A is an 'activating event' like losing a girlfriend or being broke. Many people falsely believe that they are depressed becaus something negative (like the above) happened. Let us plot a few variables and see what your situation looks like.

A='Activating Event' Losing girlfriend and going broke
B='Belief about Activating Event' This is HORRIBLE and I can't stand it. How unfair and cruel. This is AWFUL!
C='Consequence' You feel very hopeless, angry and depressed



[/ QUOTE ]

A - activating event was not losing the girlfriend, but rather having to pay 18 months of $1100 rent, plus $3600 tacked on top of the security deposit. Nearly $24,000 in one angry creditor demanding near immediate compensation is bad.

B='Belief about Activating Event' This is HORRIBLE and I can't stand it. How unfair and cruel. This is AWFUL!

C='Consequence' You feel very hopeless, angry and depressed

As you'll notice, your B and C are completely unaltered, but still completely true to the situation.

[ QUOTE ]


Now, it's not activating event 'A' that actually makes you upset and depressed. Rather, intervening variable 'B' is the culprit. Your negative cognitive-emotive result is a function of your ideology on poverty and being dumped, not the actual event itself.



[/ QUOTE ]

Again, I could care less about being dumped. And yes, the fact that I've paid out nearly $14k in the last 6 months on [censored] I didn't accrue is actually the culprit, not my feelings towards it. If I have the 14k, I don't care about the girl, the living space, anything of the sort.

[ QUOTE ]

Let us replace 'B' with a more rational thought and see what happens:

A='Activating Event' Losing girlfriend and going broke
B='Belief about Activating Event' This is very unfortunate, frustrating and upsetting but I can still find ways to find enjoyment in my life and next time use better judgment. C='Consequence' You feel healthy remorse and a healthy level of frustration that leads you to make better choices in the future. You don't feel hopelessly powerless and suicidal but instead tell yourself 'tough luck, this is highly unfortunate but that's life.'


[/ QUOTE ]

That's the problem. It's not losing the money, it's the fact that losing the money has taken all of the enjoyment out of my life. I work 45-60 hours a week, and the only thing I look forward to daily is my dinner and my pillow. I haven't had a night of fun in nearly 5 months because I can't afford it. My friends will ask me to go out and I decline because I can not afford to even go see a movie. I can't remember the last time I sat down to eat something I didn't cook. No more restaurants, no more movies, no more bars with friends, no more football on Sundays, etc. No, I sit and go to work so I can pay off a [censored] cunts debt.

If my belief was that I could still find enjoyment in my life through this [censored], I wouldn't be fathoming killing myself or stealing from my loved ones to try to get back to normal. Your analysis would probably be spot on in most cases, but I think you're missing the mark here, especially since a lot of your focus is on the female, and not the destruction she left in her wake.

If I don't kill myself, I'll ultimately make better decisions. I'll never sign my name to a contract for anything that a woman will be a part of without her signature as well for one. I'll probably never make the bad decision of becoming intimately involved to that level (living with) with a woman again. Many other things, but I think those take the cake to start.

[ QUOTE ]

Anyways, this model (which is admittedly an oversimplification of the original to some extent) has helped me in a tremendous way. I was living in an ant-infested apartment with $15,000 in credit card debt from medical bills and felt suicidal and miserable. I utilized these cognitive techniques and effectively and rationally dealt with financial, emotional, and economic problems (rather than having tantrums and making unrealistic demands of the world and myself).



[/ QUOTE ]

Who is having tantrums? I've thought the last two nights I've maintained a fairly even keel for a suicidal person in talking the problem out with a bunch of strangers. Also, did you not have insurance? If not, then you're pretty much in the same boat I am now, at least at that point. You didn't cover yourself in a contract, and you got screwed.

[ QUOTE ]


I'm saying you could do the same if only you'd give up your irrational set of beliefs and behaviors.



[/ QUOTE ]

I honestly think I'm fairly rational. I decided to put my problem on display for a large group of people to see in hopes of getting posts like this one. While I don't agree with some of what you've said, talking about it has helped me immensely.

That's the work of a rational person, not an irrational one. Yes, contemplating suicide and theft is irrational, but it's still just contemplation. I took the rational step instead and tried to talk my problem out with strangers (which is what any doctor would be right now, a stranger).

I am interested in what you are saying however, and I greatly thank you for your well thought out and articulate reply.

[Mason Hellmuth]

[ QUOTE ]
moving to Kamchatka and playing RISK with Ethiopians for several years

[/ QUOTE ]
Brilliant in my opinion!

[mostsmooth]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
after reading it all, it looks like youre thinking straight , so go file for bankruptcy and start over.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's an idea, but I've already thrown so much money at the situation that it would probably just piss me off. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
how would eliminating all your debt piss you off?
because you spent X dollars already and didnt think of bankruptcy? or?

Post deleted by chesspain

[TheGame1020]

Post deleted by chesspain

[idrinkcoors]

Rivermonger,

If your Mom is like 100% of the Moms out there, she would rather have you steal from her credit card than to take your own life. Mike Matasow has admitted to stealing from his mom at one point.

Yes, some woman screwed you over big. A guy I work with had the same thing happen to him: she left him with a big debt for him to take over, she took his kids, house, etc. And the thing is, SHE CHEATED ON HIM!. (I think he had a bad lawyer). He was miserable and talked about killing his ex-wife. A lot of us at work didn't think he was joking. Now, six years later, he has a girlfriend, house, friends and enjoys life.

It is a corny cliche, but true: time heals all wounds. Emotional, financial, etc. Don't leave your Mom alone to think about what she could have done to help.

My best to you, and I will say a prayer for you, whether you believe in God or not.

[PairTheBoard]

Bankruptcy sounds like the best plan to me. That's why the Banks charge such usurious interest on credit cards to begin with - to offset the bankruptcies people naturally get forced into from the overextended credit. Getting this woman behind you is the best thing that could have happenned to you financially. She would have kept you broke forever.

Looks like Worm had it right in this case, about Women being the Rake. Better luck next time.

PairTheBoard

Greetings,

Thank you for the response as I find this conversation highly enjoyable and really empathize with the challenges you are confronting. I just think it's easy to get lose sight of what is the ultimate challenge. My personal belief is that your financial situation, while a very important aspect of life, is not the most important challenge for you. Rather, I think you need to unlearn some deeply held irrational ideas.

I have a friend named Jim who seems to have an ideology that is almost identical to yours. His belief is that money is life's best painkiller and the only ticket to happiness. You see, he's miserable a good deal of the time because he clings to this ideology that wealth is essentially happiness. Hence, when he hits it big on video poker or makes a fortitous trade on the penny stocks he's elated and at least outwardly excited. However, during the more common down periods (and he's not a wealthy man) he's invariably sad and irritable. In my opinion, his problem is identical to yours: the ideology that having money is a necessary condition of being happy. Now if I try to tell him you can be happy with little or no money he scoffs and makes a cynical wisecrack. And yes, in our society money is a barometer of happiness for many people. Perhaps they have unfortunately learned this from their parents or the media.

To me, it doesn't matter where they learned this crazy belief. I to have held this same position. The problem is that it didn't serve me well. For when you are not monied you are miserable. Also, I find the position logically untenable because there are many counterexamples to the argument. Happiness can be obtained through other mediums be it learning new information, appreciating nature, meaningful relationships, helping others, a hobby, a political cause, self-improvement and a host of other pursuits.

A little bit about myself and my own challenges (which parallel yours to some extent). Back in 2002 I moved to Michigan (700 miles from home) with a family promise that they'd take care of all my medical bills. I needed extensive inpatient treatment for intractible head pain and neck problems. I spent a month in the hospital and required over one thousand dollars a month just on medicine alone. Factor in diagnostic tests and doctor visits and I was spending $2,500 or more a month. I did not have prescription drug insurance to make matters worse. I was living in a ant-infested $495 a month studio apartment in a new state. I had no social supports and my credit cards were being maxed out ($15,000 in debt). Then all of a sudden my family decides they can no longer help me (even though they have the resources) with the medical bills. I had no car, no job, and my body was mired in severe physical pain. I contemplated suicide several times but then despite all my misery I had a revelation: people and things do not disturb us, rather we disturb ourselves by believing they can disturb us. For example, I realized my beliefs about being poor caused me to be upset, not actually being poor.

It's hard to understand this because it seems so counterintuitive. Most people think they are happy or sad because something 'good' or 'bad' happened. In reality, it's our beliefs that determine how we ultimately respond, not what actually happened. For example, two airline workers get laid off and one is hopelessly depressed while the other is seemingly unaffected (or even upbeat). The reason is they have divergent beliefs about job loss. One might think 'If I lose this job I'll be ruined!' Yet the other might believe, 'At least I'll have some time to myself and plus I can probably find a more meaningful job anyway.'

I'm not saying your undesireable economic situation isn't extremely distressing to you. I'm sure you believe it's unfair, wrong, cruel, and a seemingly insurmountable obstacle to finding happiness. And I'm sure you believe your ex is evil incarnate. However, I believe you and your ex (as well as the rest of us) are just hopelessly flawed human beings who invariably do stupid and irrational things at times. I think your demonizing her isn't going to help you one bit but only result in more anger.

But most importantly, I think you need to work on thinking more rationally (who doesn't). I guess you already had one powerful insight: that it's rational to ask for help (although you've probably learned this isn't necessarily the best forum based on the taunting and encouragement to commit suicide). Of course, what constitutes 'help' isn't always so clear. I think many people become suicidal because they starting thinking in absolute terms and set up these false alternatives of 'either or.' For example, either I'll steal money from my mother or I'll be suicidally depressed (as you mentioned). Of course, there are thousands of other options you haven't mentioned. Unfortunately, most probably aren't the most desireable ones but you admittedly aren't in an ideal situation. You still do have choices and the capacity to improve your lot. More importantly, you also have ability to change your dysfunctional and rigid ideologies, which if left unchallenged will incontrovertibly result in a lifetime of similar folly and inexplicable misery.

Hope you're feeling better,

JeffreyREBT

[Buccaneer]

Here are a few real stupid things to do.
Let John Hinkley out of jail to go see the premier of the next Jody Foster movie.
Sell TNT to arabs.
Install windows 95 over xp.
Play poker if you are bipolar.

Do you see why?

Why don't you ask your mother for the money?

Run your post through a word processor and replace "my ex" with "Marcia" and you will have the next Brady Bunch Movie script.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
after reading it all, it looks like youre thinking straight , so go file for bankruptcy and start over.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's an idea, but I've already thrown so much money at the situation that it would probably just piss me off. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
how would eliminating all your debt piss you off?
because you spent X dollars already and didnt think of bankruptcy? or?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because I've put enough money into the debt already that filing would be really wasteful. Maybe I wouldn't be "pissed off" so to speak, I'd just feel like I wasted a lot of money I could have saved.

But then again I guess I feel that way anyways, so I'll probably just suck it up for a few more months and pay it off.

[ QUOTE ]
Here are a few real stupid things to do.
Let John Hinkley out of jail to go see the premier of the next Jody Foster movie.
Sell TNT to arabs.
Install windows 95 over xp.
Play poker if you are bipolar.

Do you see why?

Why don't you ask your mother for the money?

Run your post through a word processor and replace "my ex" with "Marcia" and you will have the next Brady Bunch Movie script.

[/ QUOTE ]

My family wasn't all that supportive of my playing poker when I was financially able to. Now to ask for her money would be totally denied.

I am definitely laughing now though, I've never had my life compared to a Brady Bunch movie.

[4thstreetpete]

[ QUOTE ]
http://jameth.whatthefuck.com/oct2005/kickflip.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/8338/hello5sw.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]


OMG OMG!!!!!! THIS IS THE GREATEST THREAD EVER!!! /images/graemlins/grin.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif

jesus, I was drinking milk and choked it all over my keyboard when I saw that, LOL.

[4thstreetpete]

[ QUOTE ]
Greetings,

Thank you for the response as I find this conversation highly enjoyable and really empathize with the challenges you are confronting. I just think it's easy to get lose sight of what is the ultimate challenge. My personal belief is that your financial situation, while a very important aspect of life, is not the most important challenge for you. Rather, I think you need to unlearn some deeply held irrational ideas.

I have a friend named Jim who seems to have an ideology that is almost identical to yours. His belief is that money is life's best painkiller and the only ticket to happiness. You see, he's miserable a good deal of the time because he clings to this ideology that wealth is essentially happiness. Hence, when he hits it big on video poker or makes a fortitous trade on the penny stocks he's elated and at least outwardly excited. However, during the more common down periods (and he's not a wealthy man) he's invariably sad and irritable. In my opinion, his problem is identical to yours: the ideology that having money is a necessary condition of being happy. Now if I try to tell him you can be happy with little or no money he scoffs and makes a cynical wisecrack. And yes, in our society money is a barometer of happiness for many people. Perhaps they have unfortunately learned this from their parents or the media.

To me, it doesn't matter where they learned this crazy belief. I to have held this same position. The problem is that it didn't serve me well. For when you are not monied you are miserable. Also, I find the position logically untenable because there are many counterexamples to the argument. Happiness can be obtained through other mediums be it learning new information, appreciating nature, meaningful relationships, helping others, a hobby, a political cause, self-improvement and a host of other pursuits.

A little bit about myself and my own challenges (which parallel yours to some extent). Back in 2002 I moved to Michigan (700 miles from home) with a family promise that they'd take care of all my medical bills. I needed extensive inpatient treatment for intractible head pain and neck problems. I spent a month in the hospital and required over one thousand dollars a month just on medicine alone. Factor in diagnostic tests and doctor visits and I was spending $2,500 or more a month. I did not have prescription drug insurance to make matters worse. I was living in a ant-infested $495 a month studio apartment in a new state. I had no social supports and my credit cards were being maxed out ($15,000 in debt). Then all of a sudden my family decides they can no longer help me (even though they have the resources) with the medical bills. I had no car, no job, and my body was mired in severe physical pain. I contemplated suicide several times but then despite all my misery I had a revelation: people and things do not disturb us, rather we disturb ourselves by believing they can disturb us. For example, I realized my beliefs about being poor caused me to be upset, not actually being poor.

It's hard to understand this because it seems so counterintuitive. Most people think they are happy or sad because something 'good' or 'bad' happened. In reality, it's our beliefs that determine how we ultimately respond, not what actually happened. For example, two airline workers get laid off and one is hopelessly depressed while the other is seemingly unaffected (or even upbeat). The reason is they have divergent beliefs about job loss. One might think 'If I lose this job I'll be ruined!' Yet the other might believe, 'At least I'll have some time to myself and plus I can probably find a more meaningful job anyway.'

I'm not saying your undesireable economic situation isn't extremely distressing to you. I'm sure you believe it's unfair, wrong, cruel, and a seemingly insurmountable obstacle to finding happiness. And I'm sure you believe your ex is evil incarnate. However, I believe you and your ex (as well as the rest of us) are just hopelessly flawed human beings who invariably do stupid and irrational things at times. I think your demonizing her isn't going to help you one bit but only result in more anger.

But most importantly, I think you need to work on thinking more rationally (who doesn't). I guess you already had one powerful insight: that it's rational to ask for help (although you've probably learned this isn't necessarily the best forum based on the taunting and encouragement to commit suicide). Of course, what constitutes 'help' isn't always so clear. I think many people become suicidal because they starting thinking in absolute terms and set up these false alternatives of 'either or.' For example, either I'll steal money from my mother or I'll be suicidally depressed (as you mentioned). Of course, there are thousands of other options you haven't mentioned. Unfortunately, most probably aren't the most desireable ones but you admittedly aren't in an ideal situation. You still do have choices and the capacity to improve your lot. More importantly, you also have ability to change your dysfunctional and rigid ideologies, which if left unchallenged will incontrovertibly result in a lifetime of similar folly and inexplicable misery.

Hope you're feeling better,

JeffreyREBT

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey Jeff, what an excellent post. Why you decided to write this heartfelt thought out reply to this silly thread is beyond me but this is one of the best posts I have ever read. This is one of the few post that I've felt compelled to save. Thanks for posting and hope things are great for you now.

[ QUOTE ]


Hey Jeff, what an excellent post. Why you decided to write this heartfelt thought out reply to this silly thread is beyond me but this is one of the best posts I have ever read. This is one of the few post that I've felt compelled to save. Thanks for posting and hope things are great for you now.



[/ QUOTE ]

Why is it a silly thread? The responses I've recieved (mainly privately), have really helped out, and if even one other person reads it that may be in a similar situation to me and it helps, then that is great.

BTW - for such a silly thread, you've got 3 or 4 posts in it already, so you're obviously interested in it, even if you are just using it for comic relief (which is your right).

1. You have serious mental health issues.

2. You have inadequate support infrastructure if the stopgap between you and a .44 mag bullet in the grape is an anonymous poker chat board

3. Your financial problems really arent that big of a deal

4. Your self-pity is wretched. Get over yourself. But if you do decide to end it all, just make sure you dont take anybody with you, and remember to set down some plastic tarp so you dont ruin the rug.

[ QUOTE ]
1. You have serious mental health issues.

2. You have inadequate support infrastructure if the stopgap between you and a .44 mag bullet in the grape is an anonymous poker chat board

3. Your financial problems really arent that big of a deal

4. Your self-pity is wretched. Get over yourself. But if you do decide to end it all, just make sure you dont take anybody with you, and remember to set down some plastic tarp so you dont ruin the rug.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. No [censored]?

2. Better to talk to someone, whether it be an anonymous chat board, a hotline, etc - than putting aforementioned slug in the brain.

3. I'm glad that you know enough about my situation to make this assumption. Are you perhaps a financial advisor or investment banker?

4. Actually, if I'd pitied myself that badly, I'd probably already be gone. The fact that I care enough about myself to try to talking to people makes me feel a lot less wretched.

And don't worry, if I decide to take anyone with me, I'll make sure it's you, prick.

[ QUOTE ]
And don't worry, if I decide to take anyone with me, I'll make sure it's you, prick.

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
And don't worry, if I decide to take anyone with me, I'll make sure it's you, prick.

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, I may still be [censored] in the brain, but I can still make people laugh from time-to-time. Really starting to post here has made me realize that maybe I'm not worthless, and that after a few more months I won't be broke either. Maybe I can actually reclaim some poker thunder and make a life for myself. After all, look at Mikey The Mouth, he went from prison to instant millionaire in less than a year and 6000 entrants. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Greetings Pete,

Thank you for the kind words and flattering compliment. I suppose there are several reasons why I felt compelled to offer my vantage point to the original poster. I have a sincere belief that Rational Emotive Behavioral Therapy (a modern day rendition of stoic philosphy) has real powerful utility. The original poster's crisis represented an excellent opportunity to illustrate my philosophy and possibly offer some measure of help.

I generally take pleasure in the ability to help others if possible. And I legitimately believe the original poster can be helped. If he radically changes his distorted and goofy thinking I believe it's nearly guaranteed that he will minimize his misery and have more desireable outcomes.

I am somewhat skeptical that he is receptive to change as he persistently clings to his irrational beliefs and strongly insists that other people are responsible for his current emotional turmoil and financial hardship. Neverthless, I still benefit because maybe some day he will remember this thread and find a helpful real world application. Beyond the satisfaction of helping others, I also remind myself of the power of rational thinking when explaining its real world applications. It's easy for me to become complacent and let irrational thoughts and behaviors insidiously creep back into my life. This dialogue reminds me of my own past and the negative consequences I suffer when I allow myself to awfulize, castrophize or engage in 'must'urbation.

And I am doing much better now than before in my personal life. I wouldn't strongly espouse REBT (Rational-Emotive Behavioral Therapy) if I wasn't positively impacted. About three years ago I started utilizing the concepts and today I'm in a much different position. Here is a short list of improvements: lost 45lbs, have held a full-time job for 2 years, went off disability, took better care of my physical health, gained enough self-confidence to start dating, went from 15K in debt to 5k in assets, bought a used car, and MOST importantly became a winning poker player ;-)

JeffreyREBT

Here's an idea. Try to build a large RB check next month.

1) Scrounge around your house to find a bunch of items to hawk on E-bay. In addition, neglect one or two of your less important bills, make the calls in advance to let them know you will be late this month etc.. The goal is to get 4 or 500 bucks together.

2) Tell your employer about your GF leaving and that you really need some a little time to collect yourself. 1 Week. (Hopefully you have a salary job, if not use vacation, personal days, or try to get an advance on next years time off due to the severity of the situation.)

3) This week off you will be 10-16 hrs a day multitabling the low limits. You will probably need to play weak tight to avoid the variance monster. The goal is to build the RB check.

4) After this week, hopefully you will have won money in addition to creating a little chunk to look forward to in a few weeks. Pay the late bills. Do some whoring or more RB building if theres anything left.

This is obviously not a solution to all the problems going on, but I find in times of emotional distress, having goals, & something to look forward to always helps. Also getting out of your day job for a week will help break up the monotany, which in itself can be depressing.

A chapter of your life has just ended with rather nasty conclusion. The good news is there's a brand new one beginning! You are in the process of developing a new you. How you build him is up to you.


Good Luck
pokerchip888

It is your choice, period.

Your life is the consequence of your choices. If you haven't figured that out, you must be a loser.

You ask for attention, that is the reason you post here; not for help, as you constantly fool yourself by ignoring other's advice and still think you are smarter than them.
Being I-want-to-kill-myself does not improve your social status, and give you any privilige to sound like a arrogant rampallion, yet still want people to pay attention and listen to your bosh.

Whether you continue to live or not has nothing to do with the people here, people die everyday, life goes on. You should have a modicum of gratitute that most people still treat you with respect and even spend their time to reply to your silly post.

A billion people are living in the condition worse than you. If you can't bear with the pressure of life, if you don't want to stand up and start your life over, fine, that is your choice. Not everyone is a winner.

So I suggest you go to your mirror, look straight to that guy, mano-to-mano for 5 minutes, if you still have a slightest liking of that fellow, life goes on. If you don't, and you don't give a [censored], no one else will.

You make the choice.

Jeez, some of you people are overdoing the 'deal-with-it-toughen-up-and-btw-stfu' line.

Its not a crime to need a little attention, we are human not mineral. especially if your going through life changing [censored].

Yeah, he needs to learn to deal. He will. Do you want to help or not?

I dont beleive anything good is achieved by telling him to look in the mirror and end it if he doesnt like what he sees because nobody will ever give a [censored] about him anyway. Thats not even true. If that were true I wouldnt be here myself as I have gone through the same. It sounds like tough love but its just thoughtless, intelectually lazy posturing.

I dont disagree with you that it boils down to a choice and its his choice and he will suffer or succeed because of it, its just the tone of some of the posts that I have an issue with.