3-6 Pocket 10's

[jackdaniels]

I have been playing at the table for about 50 hands or so and while I wasn't winning any pots, it was mostly because the cards just didn't go my way. Villain (MP1) is new at the table so no reads. Other player (BB) was defending with possibly anything (as he has been).

PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
Hero raises, 2 folds, MP1 calls, 5 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (6.33 SB) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets,MP1 calls, BB calls.

Turn: (4.66 BB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (3 players)
BB checks, Hero - ???

Do I bet here with two overards and two callers? Do I check? What do I do if my bet gets raised? What do I do if I check and one of opponents bets?

[soweak.]

I would bet again, but slow down if you get overcalled again. River play depends on if it's a non straight/flush card and how many opponents go to the river with you.

Check. Betting here is throwing money away.

[jackdaniels]

[ QUOTE ]
Check. Betting here is throwing money away.

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I did check. MP1 bets BB folds. Now I have to think that MP1 has me beat, otherwise how does he bet here with a hand he calls a raise with pre-flop? I'm thinking minimum AJ. But with BB folding, do you call thinking he may be betting AQo or even AQ /images/graemlins/heart.gif? Which is the only thing I could think he would call my raise with, not 3 bet AND bet the turn unimproved. Although I would expect those two hands to pop the flop (and try for the free turn card).

[soweak.]

When you check, the amount of hands MP1 can now bet goes up from the amount he can raise you with. He still has one opponent to worry about so the chances he has complete fluff is low. Most often he is value betting a pair here, and witht he texture of the board I'd would bet that it's better than 3rd pair. There's little value in continuing in a smallish pot with 3rd pair with two very non-pretty outs.

[jackdaniels]

[ QUOTE ]
When you check, the amount of hands MP1 can now bet goes up from the amount he can raise you with. He still has one opponent to worry about so the chances he has complete fluff is low. Most often he is value betting a pair here, and witht he texture of the board I'd would bet that it's better than 3rd pair. There's little value in continuing in a smallish pot with 3rd pair with two very non-pretty outs.

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I agree with your assessment 100%. I also felt that even if he didn't raise me on the turn, he would likely call with any piece of the board (J for example) and bet the river if I checked to him. Hence my turn check and subsequent fold to his bet.

[ QUOTE ]
When you check, the amount of hands MP1 can now bet goes up from the amount he can raise you with. He still has one opponent to worry about so the chances he has complete fluff is low. Most often he is value betting a pair here, and witht he texture of the board I'd would bet that it's better than 3rd pair. There's little value in continuing in a smallish pot with 3rd pair with two very non-pretty outs.

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This looks to be 100% correct to me, expressing my thoughts on the hand bang on.

[soweak.]

I still think that betting the turn can make your later decisions easy. It can also force your opponent to make a bad fold. Remember, you raised UTG and then have bet on every street. Because you are unknown to him your oppoent is normally going to tighten his hand requirements for you. He may fold hands like KT or QJ than could bet the turn when you checked. If he were to raise here you can fold confidently.

[ QUOTE ]
I still think that betting the turn can make your later decisions easy. It can also force your opponent to make a bad fold. Remember, you raised UTG and then have bet on every street. Because you are unknown to him your oppoent is normally going to tighten his hand requirements for you. He may fold hands like KT or QJ than could bet the turn when you checked. If he were to raise here you can fold confidently.

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No one is ever folding a king for one bet on the turn. Ever. Ever.

[jackdaniels]

[ QUOTE ]
I still think that betting the turn can make your later decisions easy. It can also force your opponent to make a bad fold. Remember, you raised UTG and then have bet on every street. Because you are unknown to him your oppoent is normally going to tighten his hand requirements for you. He may fold hands like KT or QJ than could bet the turn when you checked. If he were to raise here you can fold confidently.

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I would bet the turn if I was up against a single opponent. But sandwiched between 2 players there was too much risk of getting called by a better hand (either in MP1 or BB), especially since there was no way for me to force either of them to lay down a Jack (by making them face 2 bets cold on ANY street).

Edited to add: Would you still bet the turn against 2 opponents or would you check it down?

[MisterKing]

Thinking about hand ranges here, BB looks like a flush draw, OESD, or second pair. All three cause you serious equity problems. MP1's play is hard to assess since he's shown no aggression and no willingness to fold. With no read, we cannot reasonably say more than this: it seems unlikely that, on the turn, he will fold for one more bet getting 7.3:1 on a call. For these reasons, I c/f the turn. You came, you bet, and by all reasonable interpretations, you've lost.

In a 6max game you've got to continue firing, but this is full ring, and you're flat beat.

Edit: Agree that very few players are ever folding a king here. Certainly your average 3/6er isn't, and since MP1 is unknown, we have to assume he's something close to average.