I can't stand conversations that involve politics

[Go_Blue88]

I find discussions about politics to be really annoying at any form of social gathering. It irritates me most of all at parties; I can't stand guys who somehow think the louder they talk, the more right they are. And the ones who try to impress chicks with their political knowledge and how passionate they are/how they think people who oppose them are idiots, are the actual idiots. Girls are not gonna hook up with a guy b/c of his political beliefs or how pretentious he is; in fact, most won't even talk to a guy like that. So, wtf? Thoughts on this?

And today at Thansgiving dinner there were a few political discussions where one guy somehow thought he could convince another he was wrong. These conversations seem so fruitless; no one is going to change their mind on the issue and if they do, they're not going to admit it.

I was wondering if any of you agree with me on this, or if you actually enjoy these political conversations.

Also, I do realize that this post may have come off as somewhat hostile to those of you who may actually do this, which was not the intent. I'm just curious about these conversations b/c they happen all the time and I just don't get it.

[fluxrad]

I enjoy political conversations when I'm with close friends and we're drinking. Otherwise, you can get away with talking politics, but it has to be a sort of "political small-talk" that everyone can agree on.

"Boy. I sure do think torture is wrong."

"Indeed. I agree with that. We definitely shouldn't torture people."

"Agreed. My, this turkey is unusually good."

[bills217]

People who like politics talk about politics, people who like sports talk about sports, etc.

And both of those subjects are a lot alike in the sense that 98% of those w/ strong opinions have no idea what's going on.

I have strong political opinions on most things, and I love to talk about them, and I can tell you why. However, I am open-minded and love to have discourse w/ other open-minded people about politics.

Unfortunately, such a conversation is all too rare, usually replaced w/ mindless ripping of any opposing viewpoint. I agree w/ you in that I find THESE conversations highly annoying and pointless.

As for someone trying to impress a girl with their political savvy...generally not a good idea. I talk about politics because I enjoy doing so, not because I'm trying to impress some blonde bimbo who doesn't even know who the vice president is.

[Sponger15SB]

I'm a political science major and I completely agree.

[cdxx]

i hate people who talk. especially at parties. they think that if they talk, then girls are going to be more likely to hook up with them. MORONS! those girls are lesbos! they ain't hooking up with any of you! i've tried talking to them, and it's painfully clear they are lesbos!

*sarcasm off*

politics can be boring, but you should try reading something intelligent about it and developing a logical opinion. you'll be that more interested in politics, and that much more interesting to talk to at parties.

[HopeydaFish]

You need to stay out of the Politics forum then. It is basically what you described, except in text form. I don't know why people bother posting there. It's not a discussion, it's just a means for each ideology to spout off their views and to shout down the views of the opposing side.

[fluxrad]

The politics forum is not a politics forum. It's arguing on the internet with politics as the premise.

[Voltron87]

if you are smart and talk in an understated manner talking about some political/world issues can score you a lot of points with certain girls.

[cdxx]

certain girls? the visual i have is someone trying to score with a young janet reno. or maybe a young hillary. or a young, pre-crazy ann coulter.

[gamblore99]

I don't really find politics interesting, but never shy away from a philosophy arguement (very simliar for the most part). They can be very enjoyable, and you can learn something from them. And the point of everything isn't to impress girls. Sometimes you may be at a party and a friend or acquantence has some view you disagree with and want to challenge. With a lot of people these talks won't go anywhere, but there are people who can be very stimulating and challenge what you thought you knew. Even if they have nothing interesting to say, you have a chance to reorganize your arguments and kind of challenge yourself on the issue. And sometimes the other person will walk away with something you have told them.

But I do agree with you, to many people think they have all the answers and don't really want to discuss, but show of how smart they are.

[Tron]

[ QUOTE ]
certain girls? the visual i have is someone trying to score with a young janet reno. or maybe a young hillary. or a young, pre-crazy ann coulter.

[/ QUOTE ]

...all of which sound hot to me.

[IronDragon1]

The problem that I find with most political conversations is that they don't even attempt to get to what politics as we know them are trying to do: improve the lot of people's lives.

Almost invariably it's just biased news gourmandizing based upon a pre-determined set of beliefs and not reason.

[ChipWrecked]

[ QUOTE ]
The politics forum is not a politics forum. It's arguing on the internet with politics as the premise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I do read it though. I enjoy the thoughts of Cyrus and pvn; even though I fall somewhere in between their views, they are both pretty smart fellers.

[Sightless]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm a political science major and I completely agree.

[/ QUOTE ]

what kind of job are you planning to get with this major?

[ChipWrecked]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm a political science major and I completely agree.

[/ QUOTE ]

what kind of job are you planning to get with this major?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hell, pro surfer, what else? /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Voltron87]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
certain girls? the visual i have is someone trying to score with a young janet reno. or maybe a young hillary. or a young, pre-crazy ann coulter.

[/ QUOTE ]

...all of which sound hot to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Supposedly at USC there is no type of girl that is not hot, i think the story is much different at... cornell.

seriously, for most semi intelligent girls, it really helps if you are smart and know how to show it. this involves being understated, some other intangible stuff, basically the opposite of the loud angry guy.

A few things:

1. I used to hate when people talked about politics, but recently in an English class we write a lot about American wars so things are more interesting now, the more informed I am.

2. I don't know how old you are, but college students like myself or our generation are said to be apathetic towards current events. IMO I think it is important to be knowledgable about current events, but there is no need to know everything or know nothing.

3. Many people when they sit with others at a meal try and talk about neutral things like the weather, sometimes its good when people start mixing it up with each other.

[PITTM]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm a political science major and I completely agree.

[/ QUOTE ]

hah, ucsb political science major...that sounds familar. i was that, now im a ucsc economics/politics major, i pretty much hate politics though, after awhile it just turns into the same roundabout argument.

rj

[diebitter]

Hmm, I never like talking politics any more, cos it just seems petty.

I now accept politics machinations etc are well beyond my control as an individual, and to act individually to try and change things is either a waste of time, act of frustration, or for the extremists who do this, an act of disgusting violence.

There's so many more ways you can either be happier or better yourself or use your time than waste time on this, it seems a pretty trivial subject. I no longer read newspapers, for example, cos they are either not news (celebrity gossip, stupid speculation that doesn't serve any purpose other than scare/confuse/misdirect attetion), or they are full of political navel-gazing.

The only exception to this I think the previous poster touched on - good to know the historical perspectives on things, as this makes you better understand the culture and times we live in.

Politics is a huge sap on thinking time, there is science, art, music, philosophy, history, geography + travel, learning about other cultures etc that are all much more worthwhile and productive, IMHO.

Edit: For me, the big problem is I don't agree with any single party's manifesto/approaches/goals. I agree with one on 1 subject, another on another subject, and none of em on a third. I think most people feel this, too, and thus become disinterested, as no one party truly represents them.

[Go_Blue88]

I took a political science class and I actually found it very interesting; namely the game theory aspects of running a government.

Most of the posters mentioned a lot of the stuff that I believe. I find that it can be interesting to talk about specific issues with friends sometimes, as long as they arent deuches about it (ie-they just talk and hear opinions without freaking out about it). However, I don't think that a party atmosphere is the best place for this, nor an enjoyable dinner with friends and family.

As for the girl issue, I don't feel like people who seemingly are knowledgeable (although many times just regurgitate stuff they've heard from media sources) are necessarily smart. As someone mentioned, it's similar to discussing sports; I can name almost every player on the Bears but that doesn't entail any form of intelligence. So my conclusion for this would be that it shouldn't impress a girl and if it does, it'll be a minority of girls.

As for the guy who seemed to insinuate that I was saying "nobody should ever talk at parties!" way to make no sense there buddy.

[lastchance]

One thing I learned in the past year: Getting into a shouting match over a random topic that is meaningless is incredibly entertaining and fun, as long as you can talk enough about the subject, especially when neither of you will give in.

Ex: My friend thinks Obi-Wan is more awesome than Yoda. He is clearly wrong, and arguing about his wrongness is fun. But, I don't dislike him for thinking Obi-Wan is more awesome than Yoda, though I should. :P

[Lazymeatball]

[ QUOTE ]
certain girls? the visual i have is someone trying to score with a young janet reno. or maybe a young hillary. or a young, pre-crazy ann coulter.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll take the present day super crazy Ann Coulter.
http://oraculations.blogspot.com/uploaded_images/coulter%20gun-753470.jpg

[nicky g]

Well you've come to the right place.

Funnily enough, despite my penchant for this board, in real life I tend to avoid political conversations like the plague, except with very close friends and family.

[Darryl_P]

[ QUOTE ]
As for the girl issue, I don't feel like people who seemingly are knowledgeable (although many times just regurgitate stuff they've heard from media sources) are necessarily smart. As someone mentioned, it's similar to discussing sports; I can name almost every player on the Bears but that doesn't entail any form of intelligence. So my conclusion for this would be that it shouldn't impress a girl and if it does, it'll be a minority of girls.


[/ QUOTE ]

Very observant and 100% correct IMO. Many a teenage girl will instinctively pick up on whether a dude's knowledge is useful or not, while a lot of 40+ dudes have no clue about what really matters, except maybe in the little microcosm they choose to operate in.

The sports analogy works nicely for me since I've been making my living betting on sports for 6 years now yet I can hardly name any players/coaches/owners etc. and usually seem rather clueless in any typical sports conversation. Dudes are constantly telling me what's really important and I just go uh-huh um-hmm and pretend I'm learning something (well actually I am learning more about what dumdums tend to bet on and what biases are likely to exist in the lines, so it helps me know what kind of things to bet AGAINST)

[ QUOTE ]
I find discussions about politics to be really annoying at any form of social gathering. It irritates me most of all at parties; I can't stand guys who somehow think the louder they talk, the more right they are. And the ones who try to impress chicks with their political knowledge and how passionate they are/how they think people who oppose them are idiots, are the actual idiots. Girls are not gonna hook up with a guy b/c of his political beliefs or how pretentious he is; in fact, most won't even talk to a guy like that. So, wtf? Thoughts on this?

And today at Thansgiving dinner there were a few political discussions where one guy somehow thought he could convince another he was wrong. These conversations seem so fruitless; no one is going to change their mind on the issue and if they do, they're not going to admit it.

I was wondering if any of you agree with me on this, or if you actually enjoy these political conversations.

Also, I do realize that this post may have come off as somewhat hostile to those of you who may actually do this, which was not the intent. I'm just curious about these conversations b/c they happen all the time and I just don't get it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm extremely curious. What do discuss at your parties, in terms of impressing women or otherwise? Given the choice, what would you talk to a strange woman about for 15-20 minutes at a party (besides the +EV HER?) Cars? Clothes? Reality TV? No thanks, no thanks, and no f'ing thanks. I'm not at all interested in the internet capabilities of a goddamned cell phone either.


I agree talking politics at a party is not likely to impress most women, but it's not a universal rule.

[Darryl_P]

[ QUOTE ]
what would you talk to a strange woman about for 15-20 minutes at a party (besides the +EV HER?)

[/ QUOTE ]

This situation is either raise or fold IMO. If you want to shag the chick, you maximize EV and talk about her, if not, just ignore her. If you do the latter conspicuously enough it might even get you in the sack faster.

[cdxx]

[ QUOTE ]
Supposedly at USC there is no type of girl that is not hot, i think the story is much different at... cornell.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol. most definitely. but reno and coulter were a cornell reference.

[Beer and Pizza]

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/nq/2005/nq051124.gif

[mackthefork]

It is okay for us man, there is not a lot of problems that absolutely need to be changed in the West, for some people 'disgusting acts of violence' are the only shot they have.

Mack

[mackthefork]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what would you talk to a strange woman about for 15-20 minutes at a party (besides the +EV HER?)

[/ QUOTE ]

This situation is either raise or fold IMO. If you want to shag the chick, you maximize EV and talk about her, if not, just ignore her. If you do the latter conspicuously enough it might even get you in the sack faster.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh is that measured in EV now, how do you do that when you don't know how good it will be, you could be thinking you went in with AA only to find out 30 seconds later that you only have 2s and are hoping for a coinflip, heads I win, tails you lose.

Regards Mack

[tylerdurden]

[ QUOTE ]
The problem that I find with most political conversations is that they don't even attempt to get to what politics as we know them are trying to do: improve the lot of people's lives.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure what "politics" are *trying* to do, but I'm pretty sure that what they actually do is *worsen* people's lives on the whole (obviously, *some* people's lives are improved).

[diebitter]

[ QUOTE ]
It is okay for us man, there is not a lot of problems that absolutely need to be changed in the West, for some people 'disgusting acts of violence' are the only shot they have.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is there a point here? - and I mean specifically about my statement on the disconnection I feel with moden politics and how much better you can spend your thinking time, not about the world and its problems in general, so don't babble on if there isn't one, okay?

[whiskeytown]

[ QUOTE ]
Girls are not gonna hook up with a guy b/c of his political beliefs or how pretentious he is; in fact, most won't even talk to a guy like that. So, wtf? Thoughts on this?


[/ QUOTE ]

Um....well - maybe not if you're a Republican who wants to see them regulated to 2nd class status and take away their right to choice - LOL.

As for me, the last couple I dated would have been very upset had they felt I was a Republican (one joked "Get Out of My House" before I informed her I had switched sides a few years ago) - and part of that whole "first 20 minutes" that are sort of feeling out when two people first meet definately centered a bit on politics.

(you know the questions...fav movie, what do you wanna do someday, fav songs...hobbies - if you could go anywhere free, where would it be) - somehow religion and politics usually come up and while it may not be a selling point, per se, it can sure as hell be a black mark.

The discussion of Politics is multipurpose - first off, the smart people will get smarter as they sharpen their reasons and lines of attack. You may find someone who you can't refute and change your mind. I did so on the death penalty. Situation get bad enough, I'll probably be able to justify Aritic drilling - just not right now.

Only stupid people fix to slogans and party lines. The smart ones examine the new situations as they come up instead of relying on catch phrases and realize that in some cases, they may be disagreeing with their political party.

That's why I'm here so much - I love debate - sometimes I may change my stance on things, and sometimes I won't - I think when the whole Terri Schavio thing started I used to be "keep em alive forever" - but after evaluating how I would want to be treated in that spot, I did a fast 180. No way I'd want to live like that myself and it's wrong to ask others to if they expressed wishes not to.

RB

[lehighguy]

Why talk about anything. I couldn't convince my end-game WoW itemization is imbalanced, but I enjoyed the conversation. I enjoy political discourse, so I do it.

[mackthefork]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It is okay for us man, there is not a lot of problems that absolutely need to be changed in the West, for some people 'disgusting acts of violence' are the only shot they have.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is there a point here? - and I mean specifically about my statement on the disconnection I feel with moden politics and how much better you can spend your thinking time, not about the world and its problems in general, so don't babble on if there isn't one, okay?

[/ QUOTE ]

More that a lot of people feel the same as you do, because generally speaking life is pretty much okay here. Other people elsewhere in the world can't ignore the problems they have, and violent revolution is the only realistic option for them. It's easy for us to ignore other peoples problems, but if we contribute towards those problems they can easily become our own.

I think OOT is making you take things too personally, okay?

Have a good one.

Mack

[diebitter]

Fair point. Let's go bowling sometime. You can pay. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[mackthefork]

[ QUOTE ]
Fair point. Let's go bowling sometime. You can pay. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen.

Regards Mack

[Go_Blue88]

First, ya, I've met some girls that are similar to the ones you describe. But I found their "like oh my god, you're political beliefs like totally suck" (clearly all girls talk like that...) to be a huge turn-off.

Second, ya, I enjoy debating, as you put it. However, these types of enjoyable debates rarely occur in a party atmosphere--people always try to use "sophisticated" words, and rarely give the "opposition" any respect (I may be biased here since I despise condescending and pretentious people and seemingly there's a correlation with these two virtues and political conversations).

Anyways, my point wasn't really that people should never have these discussions, it's just the actual way they present themselves that irritates me (and their motives for having the conversation).

[DVaut1]

[ QUOTE ]
However, these types of enjoyable debates rarely occur in a party atmosphere

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you kids party on the Diag these days? Do the frat boys talk politics at PiKE? Or are there some serious political debates going on at Skeepers and Charley's I don't know about? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

When I was there, I thought U of M was strangely apolitical sometimes - not that you'd rationally expect kids to be talking politics while doing keg stands, though.

Wherever you go, <font color="blue"> Go Blue. </font>

[Go_Blue88]

hahaha well, the frat guys use lots of cheesy sh.it like explaining how amazing the catcher in the rye and the great gatsby is written (although to be honest, i'm just basing this off of a specific frat guy i know).

when i go to charley's i go with my buddies, and we don't talk politics. i like it a lot there; great food, pretty good music, fun atmosphere.

however, at a house party i had, and a few i've been to lately, there's been these shmucks debating about really dumb political stuff--ie- not even interesting issues. more like, "you like bush dude! what is wrong with you! he's destroying our country!"

i'm not sure what skeepers is, should i check it out? i like going to the brown jug, as well.

edit--i've only been to pike once, and they had a real cool ratio going. good times...

[DVaut1]

[ QUOTE ]
hahaha well, the frat guys use lots of cheesy sh.it like explaining how amazing the catcher in the rye and the great gatsby is written (although to be honest, i'm just basing this off of a specific frat guy i know).

when i go to charley's i go with my buddies, and we don't talk politics. i like it a lot there; great food, pretty good music, fun atmosphere.

however, at a house party i had, and a few i've been to lately, there's been these shmucks debating about really dumb political stuff--ie- not even interesting issues. more like, "you like bush dude! what is wrong with you! he's destroying our country!"

i'm not sure what skeepers is, should i check it out? i like going to the brown jug, as well.

edit--i've only been to pike once, and they had a real cool ratio going. good times...

[/ QUOTE ]

skeepers = Scorekeepers -- off of E. Liberty, across the street from Borders. I'm guessing you know what it is/have been there. We used to call it skeepers.

As I remember, dumb schmucks abounded at every party. When they talked politics or were having otherwise faux academic/intellectual conversations, I just cringed and walked away. They should have saved that crap for their GSI.

Pike ALWAYS had a good ratio. I had a few buddies who were in there and let me in -- but they were pretty vigilant about keeping the ratios at the right level. /images/graemlins/smile.gif I don't think I ever stepped foot in a frat house after my freshman year -- but yeah Pike was good times.

[hmkpoker]

I've had good political discussions and bad ones. It can be an interesting subject, but it usually is loud, arrogant banter. I simply try not to associate with insecure males that try to show off, and my life is a lot better for it ^_^

[chessforlife]

[ QUOTE ]
I find discussions about politics to be really annoying at any form of social gathering. It irritates me most of all at parties; I can't stand guys who somehow think the louder they talk, the more right they are. And the ones who try to impress chicks with their political knowledge and how passionate they are/how they think people who oppose them are idiots, are the actual idiots. Girls are not gonna hook up with a guy b/c of his political beliefs or how pretentious he is; in fact, most won't even talk to a guy like that. So, wtf? Thoughts on this?

And today at Thansgiving dinner there were a few political discussions where one guy somehow thought he could convince another he was wrong. These conversations seem so fruitless; no one is going to change their mind on the issue and if they do, they're not going to admit it.

I was wondering if any of you agree with me on this, or if you actually enjoy these political conversations.

Also, I do realize that this post may have come off as somewhat hostile to those of you who may actually do this, which was not the intent. I'm just curious about these conversations b/c they happen all the time and I just don't get it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. It seems such conversations sway no one, and always cultivate negative feelings.

I also think most people base global opinions on irrelevant childhood experiences. For example, if your parents were poor, then you think the rich should pay more taxes REGARDLESS of the economics of the issue, and you can not possibly be dissuaded from this opinion.

[lehighguy]

I have a no politics at work policy, except with foriegners. I try to explain that smarter American's know how stupid our politicians are and we can't do anything about it. They appreciate it. But I almost never talk to other Americans.