$2/4 - when opponent shoves river with str8 on board

[vanHelsing]

Opponent is something like 40/15/1

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter (http://www.pokerhand.org)

Button ($465.70)
SB ($746.58)
BB ($985.29)
UTG ($384.20)
Hero ($394)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif. SB posts a blind of $2.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises to $9</font>, Hero calls $9, Button calls $9, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>.

Flop: ($33) T/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $25</font>, Hero calls $25, Button folds.

Turn: ($83) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $60</font>, UTG calls $60.

River: ($203) J/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG calls $290.20 (All-In), Hero?

At $1/2, I had a safe river laydown here.
At 2/4 things changes somehow.

I get roughly 1:3. So he needs to be freaking at least 75% to make a call correct, right?

Now, the players that have experience at Party 2/4 6max:
What's your default play against an average player who is capable of a move but not overly wild?

From his view, with let's say 2 pair against a TAG, pushing is standard here?

[Ghazban]

I would almost always fold this. I probably would've folded preflop, too.

[Hattifnatt]

Fold preflop

As played, insta-fold river.

[Bosox]

[ QUOTE ]
I probably would've folded preflop, too.

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Fold preflop

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You do NOT fold AJ preflop 5-handed to a raise barely more than double BB. After that, I think you played it well. The turn bet looks good but a river fold is unfortunately standard. KTs on his end.

[vanHelsing]

I insta folded and he showed me QQ.

I like his move very much and was curious if this is kind of standard at 2/4, which would make the fold tougher.

[Ghazban]

[ QUOTE ]
I insta folded and he showed me QQ.

I like his move very much and was curious if this is kind of standard at 2/4, which would make the fold tougher.

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Are you referring to the river action alone or his line throughout the hand? I think playing QQ the way he did is pretty lousy. His river play only worked because his flop and turn play were so poor.

Edit to add: His preflop raise sucked, too. I guess he got 1/4 streets right....

[orange]

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I insta folded and he showed me QQ.

I like his move very much and was curious if this is kind of standard at 2/4, which would make the fold tougher.

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Are you referring to the river action alone or his line throughout the hand? I think playing QQ the way he did is pretty lousy. His river play only worked because his flop and turn play were so poor.

Edit to add: His preflop raise sucked, too. I guess he got 1/4 streets right....

[/ QUOTE ]

Really? I thought villan's play was ok IMO. Do you prefer to bet flop, bet/call the turn?

Do you prefer to bet this turn instead of checking? I think the likelyhood of a straight is fairly high, and if villan is a calling station, I prefer to check/call the turn. How would you have played it ghaz? (assuming you are in villan's position with QQ).

[Bosox]

That's usually a move reserved for when you have position and are checked to. It makes sense if your opponent isn't thinking on multiple levels (or multitabling). I think it's just desperate when you don't have position and he's going to lose money on that play.

[Ghazban]

Well, I would've made a real preflop raise, not this namby pamby 2.25xBB crap. Against many players, I'll bet smallish on the turn (like 1/2 pot) and then when they minraise me, I know they have the straight but I have odds to fill on the end. If they make a real raise, they definitely have the straight already and I can fold if I don't have odds. I really hate giving a free card to a likely flush draw with a 1-card straight possible. A lot of Party players will call so many worse hands (flush draws, two pair, etc.) but not raise or bet any of them. On the end, I almost never try to push somebody out of a chop because nobody ever folds (which is why pushing just a naked king there is awesome even if its an overbet).

Depending on what I know about my opponent, I could modify this play, too. I don't think I know any opponents I would take villain's exact line against.

[orange]

Agreed on your PF thoughts. Thanks for turn analysis.

[vanHelsing]

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That's usually a move reserved for when you have position and are checked to. It makes sense if your opponent isn't thinking on multiple levels (or multitabling)...

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Hm, it made sense against me and according to your first post, it would have made sense against you as well, no?

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...a river fold is unfortunately standard.

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