6-max vs. calling space stations

I've switched to 6-max from full ring, and I'm running into more and more players on $25 NL 6-max that play...well...odd, and I'm not sure right now what exactly to do about it. I call them "calling space stations" for reasons you'll see below. I try to play somewhat aggressively in 6-max, but it just seems as though that's a money sink against these players when they call with ANY piece of the board (even as little as a gutshot), and sometimes with not even that. People just didn't play this way in full ring. Let me give some examples and maybe some of you will have some insight.

$25 NL 6-max, both relevant stacks are about $20. MP raises to .75, hero folds with garbage, BB calls.

Flop comes A66 rainbow. BB checks, MP bets about 1/2 pot, BB calls.

Turn is a J. BB check, MP bets about 1/2 pot, BB calls.

River is another J. BB checks, MP bets pot, BB raises allin. For most sane people, this would be an easy laydown with the board and the BB's betting pattern. MP, however, calls with his ATo and gets beat.

BB did not have a 6, nor an A for that matter. He had JT of clubs.


Another example, one involving hero this time:

Hero in MP has $35 and aces, BB has about $40. Hero openraises to $2 (I know this is not normal, but BB would call any even remotely reasonable preflop raise with any two cards. To paraphrase Norman Chad, I think BB would call if he were dealt Uno cards), BB calls.

Flop comes 852. BB checks, Hero bets $4, BB calls $4.

Turn is a J. BB check, Hero bets $8, BB calls $8.

River is a K. BB check, Hero checks behind (another adjustment for this player). Hero's aces beat BB's 36o.

Yes, he called an 8BB preflop raise and then called off $12 with a 3-out gutshot draw. Not that I mind, of course. I didn't bet the river because he would only call with top or second pair, and will checkraise with two pair or better, otherwise he'd fold. He would stack people who limped in and then bet small, and he'd call and hope to hit his hand, and when he hit his hand, his checkraises got paid off often enough.

So when playing against people who will call raises with speculative hands (or total crap), and will call bets with any pair/any draw (or not even that), it basically makes it imperative to only raise and bet with real hands, correct? If it's folded to me on the button with QJ suited, and I raise, and the BB from example 1 calls, and the flop comes A45, if he check/calls my continuation bet, I have no idea where I am. There's a reasonable chance I am ahead, as he could call that bet with as little as a 2 or a 3 in his hand drawing to the gutshot, or a flush draw if one is out there, or maybe even nothing, but I have no way to know that. He might actually have an ace this time, or a 4 or 5.

Also there are tables where two or three people will call a 4xBB raise. If I have AK in EP and raise it up, and get two-three callers, and the flop comes all numbers, it's hard to continuation bet into that many people that may call with as little as a draw.

Anyway, just looking for some line checks as I continue my foray into 6-max.


Thanks.

I would bet the river against a very loose passive player, probably the same amount as my turn bet, looking to get paid off from some weak pair hand.

If your opponent is very passive aces are an easy muck a check raise.

Good of you to notice and make adapations that is the heart of winning poker.

[4_2_it]

Just play these guys straight up. They are ATMs. Just don't EVER try to bluff them because they will call down with 22.

[beavens]

i wouldn't worry about it - these are great players for you.

you will get hit by them every once in a while when they catch their 2pr or miracle draw, but with all the medium sized pots you take off them you shouldn't worry about it.

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't bet the river because he would only call with top or second pair, and will checkraise with two pair or better, otherwise he'd fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

This makes checking the river an unforgivable sin.

To answer what seems to be your main question: Yes, you need a real hand against a calling station. Depending on the calling station's upper and lower calling bounds, you may need as little as a pair or as much as two pair. Bluffing against calling stations is useless, don't do it. Do, however, value bet relentlessly on all streets.

SpaceAce

[ QUOTE ]
Quote:
I didn't bet the river because he would only call with top or second pair, and will checkraise with two pair or better, otherwise he'd fold.



This makes checking the river an unforgivable sin.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have to admit that this came from wanting to play the river safe, since I had also seen him check-call me earlier when he had turned two pair. Fortunately for me, I rivered him so it turned out good in the end (board paired on the end to make my overpair get two pair, but I checked because I didn't know if he had a set or what), but that hand was the first big hand I played against him so I was still trying to get reads on him calling big turn bets, hence playing it safe. At one point, he had a stack over $75 from people trying to bluff him off middle pair or him sucking out on top pair/over pairs.

If I felt more confident of my read, I might have bet the river, but I just had more confidence in the fact that as long as I took my time and stayed patient, I was going to stack the guy, and I did. I know that's a little Hellmuthian ("4-to-1 isn't good enough"), but it was just a feeling I had.

Thanks for the replies so far, I know checking behind on the river on hand #2 was a little scaredy, but as I explained to SpaceAce, I was in a little bit of protection mode because I just felt like I'd get the chance to stack him later with the near-nuts.

My real dilemma with these kinds of players comes when I'm at a 6-max table with tight/passives that I feel like I can take money from with CO/button raises and continuations, but the calling stations get in the way.

Or when I tighten up at a table full of calling stations, raise with AQ/AK/TT or somesuch, get two or three callers and the flop is not helpful at all. It almost seems like I'm throwing money away trying to bet at the pot in that circumstance.

When I get at a table with a calling station or two, a tight/passive, and a LAG...well then I'm confused. I have little idea what to do because I'm afraid if I try to single a player out, another player will get in the way. It's just so much different from low buyin full ring...

[mustardo]

As has been said value bet and value bet again against these players. Don't get tricky. As I rule I don't cont bet completely missed hands against these players, as you said they are bad enough to call with owt and you'll never know where you are, and they won't notice that you only bet when you've hit anyway. Also as a rule these players rarely bluff so you should get to a cheap showdown if they have missed as well or have bottom pair, this doesn't hold true for all of them though.