A few suited A's from the CO [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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11-22-2005, 06:55 AM

I've just reached 10000 hands at 5/10 and rather than post a stats thread i'm going to post loads of simple hands to check i have the basics right. Please bare with me.

Hand 1

is this a correct peel, would anyone raise the turn?

Villians stats, 70 hands 52/9.9/1.3

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
1 fold, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB 3-bets, 1 fold, Hero calls.

Flop: (7 SB) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: (6.50 BB) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

hand 2

sb 50/11/0.5 from not many hands and plays really bad.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, SB calls, BB calls, UTG folds.

Turn: (5.50 BB) A/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, SB raises, BB folds, My line?

Hand 3

Not sure this is the correct way to play these hands vs aggressive opps. Any better line, like say c/r flop, or c/c flop and c/r either turn or river if i hit?

BB 40 hands, 52/9/2.3
button 80 hands, 60/6.3/3.5

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/club.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises, Button calls, 1 fold, BB calls.

Flop: (6.40 SB) 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, Button calls, BB calls.

Turn: (4.70 BB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, Button calls, BB calls.

River: (7.70 BB) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
BB bets, Hero folds, Button calls.

Final Pot: 9.70 BB

spydog

11-22-2005, 08:42 AM

Hand 1: Fine
Hand 2: Call down.
Hand 3: I check the turn sometimes, but betting is probably just as optimal. River fold looks fine.

MrBig30

11-22-2005, 08:52 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: Fine
Hand 2: Call down.
Hand 3: I check the turn sometimes, but betting is probably just as optimal. River fold looks fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would probably check turn hand 3, but I agree w/ spy dog.

11-22-2005, 09:17 AM

i figured most of these are going to be played reasonably well and it seems so given your response. Just thinking about possible different lines i could take, hand one, would you ever raise the turn? Hand two, are you calling even if a club hits? Hand 3, as both opps are aggressive and CO will probably bet here if i check, could i either check-raise as with my flush cards + overcard i have enough to do so, or given i check-call can i check-raise this turn. It looks strong to c/c, c/r and given i now have an extra few outs for my gutshot plus they may fold.

deepsquat

11-22-2005, 09:30 AM

The only different line i would consider is a turn raise in Hand 1. He prob has a peice of this board though and being 3bet would suck.

RunDownHouse

11-22-2005, 09:53 AM

I bet the turn in hand 3 in order to buy the button.

stigmata

11-22-2005, 09:58 AM

I agree with spydog.... just adding:

I bet turn in hand 3, button has been very aggressive and is probably checking this through pretty rarely. At least if I do the betting I have a tiny bit of fold equity. If just the button folds I can then usually take a free showdown.

flawless_victory

11-22-2005, 10:35 AM

hand 1.
cap that sh.t preflop with quickness. easy cap w/ a nice hand AND position for me.
flop, raise it.
turn, raise it.
river, prob raise, but maybe just call... if u do raise, you really need to lay it down for a third bet (ppl just dont bluff there), so if u dont want to risk not seeing a showdown, just call is fine.

hand 2.
play so far is obvious. after u get checkraised i just call down and raise riv if u fill, obviously.

hand 3.
play up to river is fine. i bet turn 100%... river is intersting. that bet from the BB is really bizarre... hes representing a T? we are supposed to be believe that?
looks v possible that he is an idiot make some ridic bluff w/ J8ish. i think u need to strongly consider raising to prevent button from overcalling. of course that is kinda expensive (and quite the parlay since button is a big donkey and could make an idiotic, but "correct" coldcall w/89), but i still like it.

11-22-2005, 10:43 AM

[ QUOTE ]
hand 1.
cap that sh.t preflop with quickness. easy cap w/ a nice hand AND position for me.
flop, raise it.
turn, raise it.
river, prob raise, but maybe just call... if u do raise, you really need to lay it down for a third bet (ppl just dont bluff there), so if u dont want to risk not seeing a showdown, just call is fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, loads of questions. What else would you cap here? If i cap an i just firing away until shown aggression? If he leads on this flop am i raising?

[ QUOTE ]
hand 2.
play so far is obvious. after u get checkraised i just call down and raise riv if u fill, obviously.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you call if the river brings a four flush?

[ QUOTE ]
hand 3.
play up to river is fine. i bet turn 100%... river is intersting. that bet from the BB is really bizarre... hes representing a T? we are supposed to be believe that?
looks v possible that he is an idiot make some ridic bluff w/ J8ish. i think u need to strongly consider raising to prevent button from overcalling. of course that is kinda expensive (and quite the parlay since button is a big donkey and could make an idiotic, but "correct" coldcall w/89), but i still like it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought bb's bet interesting, if i raise here obv button has a hard time calling with say 77, but does my raise fold out a pair from the bb.

stigmata

11-22-2005, 10:45 AM

[ QUOTE ]
hand 1.
cap that sh.t preflop with quickness. easy cap w/ a nice hand AND position for me.
flop, raise it.
turn, raise it.
river, prob raise,

[/ QUOTE ]

I did think about this line, but the guy only raises 10% preflop. Against his 3-betting range our hand doesn't look great. Of course this all depends on a read for how he plays in blind steal/re-steal situations, so a 3-bet preflop is possibly a good idea.

On the turn we have a big draw but the board fits with many potential holdings and it would really suck to get 3-bet.

flawless_victory

11-22-2005, 10:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]

On the turn we have a big draw but the board fits with many potential holdings and it would really suck to get 3-bet.

[/ QUOTE ]well, considering weve shown zero strength throughout the hand, a turn raise is a must.
he could easily have a hand like 88 here, and raising the turn will be our only chance to win the pot w/ the worst hand. getting threebet does not suck. we are gonna get 2 more bets (if not 4) when we make the nuts on the end and lose no more when we miss, so fine.
also our hand has some showdown value and if we raise there, we can take the free showdown and beat something like KJ... if we played it passive, he prob wouldve bluffed us out on the river.

11-22-2005, 11:02 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On the turn we have a big draw but the board fits with many potential holdings and it would really suck to get 3-bet.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

well, considering weve shown zero strength throughout the hand, a turn raise is a must.
he could easily have a hand like 88 here, and raising the turn will be our only chance to win the pot w/ the worst hand. getting threebet does not suck. we are gonna get 2 more bets (if not 4) when we make the nuts on the end and lose no more when we miss , so fine.
also our hand has some showdown value and if we raise there, we can take the free showdown and beat something like KJ... if we played it passive, he prob wouldve bluffed us out on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

If 3-bet are you calling this river?

stigmata

11-22-2005, 11:02 AM

Good points. I'm not convinced villain is probably folding very often, even an underpair against a turn raise. On the other hand, he doesn't need to fold that often to make the play profitable, so maybe your right.

flawless_victory

11-22-2005, 11:03 AM

[ QUOTE ]

If i cap an i just firing away until shown aggression? If he leads on this flop am i raising?

[/ QUOTE ]
yes.
usually not, that just gets you threebet.

[ QUOTE ]
Do you call if the river brings a four flush?

[/ QUOTE ]
of course.

[ QUOTE ]
but does my raise fold out a pair from the bb.

[/ QUOTE ]
probably not.
this play is based upon the BB representing either trips or a bluff. why would he play 77 like this? i think you have him beat often.

11-22-2005, 11:52 AM

What is the worst hand you will cap with here...just picking out a likely range(obv player dependant) ATs, AJo, KQs 99?