urgle gurgle 5/10 AA [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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yvesaint

11-21-2005, 06:49 AM

table seems fairly passive, i have been raising a lot though, and re-raising a fair amount

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10 BB (5 handed) internettexasholdem.com (http://www.internettexasholdem.com)

MP ($1356.50)
Button ($950)
SB ($1228)
BB ($2707)
Hero ($1163)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
Hero raises to $40, MP calls $40, 1 fold, SB calls $35, 1 fold.

Flop: ($130) T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $120, MP calls $120, SB calls $120.

Turn: ($490) 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $400

turn bet bad? i considered check-raising here, but i decided against it, not seeing what could call that id beat

MP min-raises to 800. easy fold, right?

xorbie

11-21-2005, 06:54 AM

Pushing the turn is an option.

yvesaint

11-21-2005, 06:56 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Pushing the turn is an option.

[/ QUOTE ]

what calls me? pair+draws? a strong K? theres less possibility of a draw out there with me holding the Ah

Maulik

11-21-2005, 06:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Pushing the turn is an option.

[/ QUOTE ]

what calls me? pair+draws? a strong K? theres less possibility of a draw out there with me holding the Ah

[/ QUOTE ]

Its possible KJ, KQ & AK do this here?

Maulik

11-21-2005, 06:59 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Pushing the turn is an option.

[/ QUOTE ]

what calls me? pair+draws? a strong K? theres less possibility of a draw out there with me holding the Ah

[/ QUOTE ]

Given your image i think lots of K9+ hands min-raise you on the turn.

yvesaint

11-21-2005, 07:01 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Given your image i think lots of K9+ hands min-raise you on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

dont you think i am showing a good amount of strength there though? i raise UTG, pot flop against 2 others, then pot turn again ....

a push on the turn may be called by a strong K in retrospect ..... if these guys bet at all i wanted to try check-raising but these guys were pretty passive

xorbie

11-21-2005, 07:03 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Pushing the turn is an option.

[/ QUOTE ]

what calls me? pair+draws? a strong K? theres less possibility of a draw out there with me holding the Ah

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, the push really depends on table dynamics, but I do this all the time if I've been pretty active on the flop. AK or KQ will very often look you up. Also I think there could easily be a pair + flush draw here which could call. This is a board that doesn't make a lot of two pairs, and most sets are raising the flop, so I say bomb away.

Maulik

11-21-2005, 07:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Given your image i think lots of K9+ hands min-raise you on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

dont you think i am showing a good amount of strength there though? i raise UTG, pot flop against 2 others, then pot turn again ....

a push on the turn may be called by a strong K in retrospect ..... if these guys bet at all i wanted to try check-raising but these guys were pretty passive

[/ QUOTE ]

I think xorbie was able to more eloquently state what I'm getting at. Additionally, I think a set tries to build a pot on the flop rather than the turn.

When I've been extremely active I've had villains often min-raise me with mid pair good kicker.

xorbie

11-21-2005, 07:12 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Given your image i think lots of K9+ hands min-raise you on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

dont you think i am showing a good amount of strength there though? i raise UTG, pot flop against 2 others, then pot turn again ....

a push on the turn may be called by a strong K in retrospect ..... if these guys bet at all i wanted to try check-raising but these guys were pretty passive

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's the deal. Unless I am playing in rock central, when I get called in two places on a draw heavy flop in a raised pot with AA I am pretty much getting it all in. So in order to ensure that I get it all in against the widest range possible (i.e. not just hands that beat me), I push. I'm not saying I always do that, but it's a viable option.

Maulik

11-21-2005, 07:15 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Given your image i think lots of K9+ hands min-raise you on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

dont you think i am showing a good amount of strength there though? i raise UTG, pot flop against 2 others, then pot turn again ....

a push on the turn may be called by a strong K in retrospect ..... if these guys bet at all i wanted to try check-raising but these guys were pretty passive

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's the deal. Unless I am playing in rock central, when I get called in two places on a draw heavy flop in a raised pot with AA I am pretty much getting it all in. So in order to ensure that I get it all in against the widest range possible (i.e. not just hands that beat me), I push. I'm not saying I always do that, but it's a viable option.

[/ QUOTE ]

are you open-pushing the turn or leading then pushing? clearly, calling is terrible if you're money is going in it may as well be on the turn.

xorbie

11-21-2005, 07:17 AM

Open push. Sometimes a trixy check raise, but this doesn't seem to be a great spot.

AEKDBet

11-21-2005, 07:47 AM

Min-raise is funny. With SB still around that raise = fold i think.

Bosox

11-21-2005, 04:54 PM

I'm guessing you're beat here, probably by TT. The only hand you beat dumb enough to make that turn raise would, in my experience, be Ak. Unfortunately, I think you're calling as played because the money's already in there. I'd need a convincing read here to fold. Otherwise, I'm just not sure how you might be able to get away from that. I was thinking maybe a smaller turn bet but with the flush-draw-holding SB tagging along you really don't have many options.

I think a turn open-allin is terrible because you definitely won't get looked up by anything you're beating. I also think that the MP with his set wouldn't have to build a pot on the flop if he thinks it's HU (SB has checked) and can reasonably put you on something other than QJ or a flush draw. Thus, you can't put him off a set just because he cold called the flop. So, IMO, your line isn't bad at all and i'd be hard pressed to play it any other way. I call the turn and probably go broke. Tough spot.

creedofhubris

11-21-2005, 07:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
table seems fairly passive, i have been raising a lot though, and re-raising a fair amount

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10 BB (5 handed) internettexasholdem.com (http://www.internettexasholdem.com)

MP ($1356.50)
Button ($950)
SB ($1228)
BB ($2707)
Hero ($1163)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
Hero raises to $40, MP calls $40, 1 fold, SB calls $35, 1 fold.

Flop: ($130) T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $120, MP calls $120, SB calls $120.

Turn: ($490) 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $400

turn bet bad? i considered check-raising here, but i decided against it, not seeing what could call that id beat

MP min-raises to 800. easy fold, right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Since you've built a big pot and it's now laying you decent odds, I don't mind getting allin, particularly since you're playing fast and so he might be taking a stand with Kx.

Nothing wrong with a fold though if you have a good read.

yvesaint

11-21-2005, 08:11 PM

yea this guy was pretty much a tight nit .... i pushed like a donkey and was happily shown 44 for bottom set