Desperate EP decisions

[splashpot]

While reading through this post (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=3969122&an=0&page=0&gone w=1#UNREAD), I was thinking about situations when you get short stacked and you can't find a good spot to steal the blinds. One poster mentioned that he would rather push UTG at a table of 7 with any 2 cards than let the blinds go through him again. I think this is absurd. I would never push garbage UTG at a table of 7. I would rather take my chances in the blinds.

So let's consider this made up hand. You are UTG with 600 chips and XX garbage at a table of 7. Blinds 75/150. Who pushes and who folds? What stack sizes and blind sizes would change your mind? If you said fold, how good would your cards have to be to push?

[bawcerelli]

i fold with trash. i HATE pushing through more than 3 people. try to avoid getting yourself in this situation in the firstplace is my advice.

[splashpot]

Clearly. But you have to admit, sometimes it's unavoidable.

[Uncle Wiggly]

There are varying levels of desperation.
Pushing any two through that many players invites too big a risk for your current situation.
You're good for several more orbits where you can pick your spot more times than not.

[joeg]

sometimes I would, the key factors in choosing would be my table image, the playing tendancies of my opponents and the locations of the big stack & the remaining stacks in play. I wouldnt try it at all if my image was not solid and I would also have to think all the remaining opponents are solid, I would want the big stack to be close to my left, as they are the player who can call to eliminate me easiest, but if the act imeddiatly after me they will also have to worry about running into a hand behind them so will also need stronger holdings to call than if they were on teh button. I'd want the remaining stacks in late position to be fairly short and I'd prefer the blinds to actually have some sort of stack but not to big, if my bet puts them all in then there is a lot of hands that they can justify calling with, and the same is true if they are deep, but if my bet is around 40%-60% of their stack then loosing can take them from a fairly comfortable position to been the small stack, then despite good odds it is going to be a lot harder for them to call.

So occasionaly I'd push, but its very situational

[ QUOTE ]
There are varying levels of desperation.
Pushing any two through that many players invites too big a risk for your current situation.
You're good for several more orbits where you can pick your spot more times than not.

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't use the word several. I think he's got one, after the blinds he's down to <3bb. When the blinds come around again, there's a good chance that they've increased giving him effectively 2bb.

Still I think a fold is in order here in this particular situation. I'd probably push if it was 5 handed though.

[splashpot]

Ok apparently the original poll is a bit one sided. So let's make it a little more debatable. Same situation. Original poll is for a table of 7. This poll is for a table of 5. I would still fold.

[jeffraider]

I don't really get the whole push any two UTG deal that so many people seem to go on about. "IF THE BLINDS HIT ME I LOSE FOLD EQUITY BLAH BLAH" etc. Hey, you do get dealt a hand in the blinds, you know! It's not some automatic death sentence. And let's look at what happens if you get dealt 32o both times in the blinds and there's just no way you can play the pot, etc. What are you down to? 375? That's okay. If you can be first in with only three people to go through I think that's a lot better. Basically if you lose more than a third of your stack by getting hit by the blinds, it's not the end of the world because you can pick up a hand, you can luck out and get it folded to you in SB or button or CO, or you can wait it out until the next time and just play your next BB no matter what you're dealt. Also, you still have some FE with 375 in level 5, not a ton obviously but you will make the BB fold some hands if he doesn't have a ton of chips either.

[Freudian]

Push unless it it complete trash. I'd rather do something when I have some FE than eat blinds and be left totally without FE. I am often surprised by how often people fold in this exact situation.

Of course most likely I have found a situation I like more in the 4 hands before I am UTG so either I am healthy or gone.

[FlyWf]

On a table of seven, easy, easy fold. On a table of 5, it badly depends what stacks are in the blinds.

You get a hand in the blinds and there's no guarantee that somebody will push into your BB.

If you can't find a better place than UTG with garbage to push 1. I don't believe you and 2. That means the other people are frisky today. Let them do something stupid after you fold.