God and the Devil

[phixxx]

I'm almost certain that this post will get moved, but for the most part I post here and in the limit forums so I'll put it here. If it needs to be moved, tell me and I'll move it.

So, I'm having a discussion with an avid group of religious girls, and they begin to tell me the conducts and doctrines of their faiths. They tell me how if you're good, you go to heaven. If you're bad you go to hell; these are givens. There's also a set of laws you live by, which if broken, earn you a trip straight to hell. Now, here is where my theory comes in.

Using the traditional sense of thinking, if you're bad you go to hell, if you obey all of gods commandments you go to heaven. Obviously in hell, you are ripped apart every day by demons and your soul is eaten over and over again. However, why would the Devil treat you badly? In his eyes, you've done exactly what you were supposed to, no?

My belief is that if you conduct yourself with the utmost stupidity during your time on this planet; you steal, kill, disobey all of gods commandments, you will be welcomed with open arms in hell. Is this not logically true? If hell is the opposite of heaven, it seems that the devil would befriend you. Maybe you could hang out in hell. Have a beer. Talk with the demons. Do whatever you want. It seems foolish that he would punish you for doing exactly what he does, which is condone evil behavior. If the devil was to inflict harm on you for doing exactly what he preaches is right, wouldn't that make him a hypocrite?

Or maybe this is my ignorance of religion talking. If I'm speaking on behalf of my own misconceptions, please correct me. If not, feel free to discuss. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[diebitter]

[ QUOTE ]
why would the Devil treat you badly?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well all got a job to do...

[CollinEstes]

This should be in the science, math, philosophy forum. But for the sake of arguement I will say this.

If you do believe in the Hell as descibed in the Bible in which the Devil resides. I don't think you can pick and choose the aspects of hell that make the most sense to you. If you believe the Bible is accurate then eveything it says about Hell is true making it a terrible place with alot of gnashing of teeth.

[MrMon]

If the Devil is punishing you for misdeeds in your life, isn't he doing the Lord's work? Is Satan really an agent of God?

Never thought about it this way, but the OP may be on to something.

[CollinEstes]

But the Devil is truely just absolute evil right? So he would punish your ass for going there becuase he has the power and he is just a really mean dude?

It is just like if I went to Prison the huge black dude that would rape and probably kill me wouldn't being doing the State's work by making prison really suck, he is just a really mean dude.

[MrWookie47]

If you read the book of Job in the Old Testament, you'll find that in that story, Satan really is an agent of God doing His will.

[NorCalJosh]

this seems pretty obvious to me, but maybe someone could point out my error in thinking?

in hell, assuming there is a hell, satan isnt going to be the one punishing you. Satan is in hell to get punished as well. God created hell as punishment for satan and his demons, and mankind just happened to hitch a ride along. so satan wont have any problems with you, other than the fact that you're supposedly gods creation, and he hates everything to do with God, i think that he will be getting punished and tormented right along with you. Hell is god's creation, not satans, therefore, god's punishment, torment, so on and so forth. that make sense?

i guess that raises all kinds of other questions about god's justness and goodness and such. but thats my understanding of it at least.

[TheMainEvent]

[ QUOTE ]
this seems pretty obvious to me, but maybe someone could point out my error in thinking?

in hell, assuming there is a hell, satan isnt going to be the one punishing you. Satan is in hell to get punished as well. God created hell as punishment for satan and his demons, and mankind just happened to hitch a ride along. so satan wont have any problems with you, other than the fact that you're supposedly gods creation, and he hates everything to do with God, i think that he will be getting punished and tormented right along with you. Hell is god's creation, not satans, therefore, god's punishment, torment, so on and so forth. that make sense?

i guess that raises all kinds of other questions about god's justness and goodness and such. but thats my understanding of it at least.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what I was told when I went to a born-again Christian school. God is in control of hell, not Satan. Satan has certain powers, but he is basically in the same situation as people who get sent to hell.

[tonypaladino]

(I'm not religious at all, so I'm just being devil's advicate)

Satan is evil, so why would he punish evil people? Makes sence, but then you could ask, if God is good, why does he punish anyone?

If god is the utimate good, then he should have ultimate forgiveness and there would be no hell. According to most sects of christianity God does have ultimate forgiveness, but only if you ask him for it. But it's not very good to fail to forgive people just because they do not acknowlege your existence, that sounds like the sin of Pride to me, and we all know that God is without sin, so why should he do that?

The answer is Satan punishes bad people because that's the way the system works, and I'm sure nothing of what I just said made sense.

(Also, I agree this belongs in SMP)

[imported_The Vibesman]

In the film "The Prophecy," Lucifer tells a human that Hell isn't burning lakes of fire and all that, but rather it's being removed from God's sight and having his word taken away from you. Living in a place where you were completely cut off from God. So, there's a B-movie perspective for you.

[Easy E]

[ QUOTE ]
it's being removed from God's sight and having his word taken away from you.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Hell on Earth" takes on new meaning...

[Easy E]

[ QUOTE ]
it's being removed from God's sight and having his word taken away from you.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Hell on Earth" takes on new meaning...

[TiK]

[ QUOTE ]
My belief is that if you conduct yourself with the utmost stupidity during your time on this planet; you steal, kill, disobey all of gods commandments, you will be welcomed with open arms in hell...it seems that the devil would befriend you. Maybe you could hang out in hell. Have a beer. Talk with the demons. Do whatever you want. It seems foolish that he would punish you for doing exactly what he does, which is condone evil behavior..

[/ QUOTE ]

That's exactly what they don't want you to know. Hell is exactly like Vegas.

I think in hell all the "good" people that [censored] up once or twice in there life and end up in hell are the ones that are resented, being torn apart and burned over and over again etc... HOWEVER if your a Charles Manson type, you get to be a demon and drink beer with the devil. So clearly the correct play is to start killing and sinning as much as possible until you die. I hope this post has improved some peoples lives, peace.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it's being removed from God's sight and having his word taken away from you.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Hell on Earth" takes on new meaning...

[/ QUOTE ]

awsome

[phixxx]

You'd be suprised how many people are infuriorated by my style of thinking, yet can't possibly disprove it. Religion, IMO, is based on providing false promises which can never be confirmed. Therefore, my theory is as valid as the next persons. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[handsome]

1. wrong forum
2. It sounds like you are really misinformed. The best way to educate yourself on religion is to read. I would recommend "The Case for Christ" by Lee Strobel.

[CollinEstes]

But your theory is only based on your selective interpretation of the Bible therefore isn't an accurate theory. IMO.

[gabbahh]

[ QUOTE ]
However, why would the Devil treat you badly?

[/ QUOTE ]
He had a bad childhood.
When he was just a little boy, his father(God) used to beat him up. His brothers (Ezekiel, Gabriel and the other tugs) raped him several times before the age of 11. When he became 11 they set him on fire, hence his nickname Lucy. Then he flew away and created his own twisted version of Heaven, which we now refer to as Hell.

[ QUOTE ]

If the devil was to inflict harm on you for doing exactly what he preaches is right, wouldn't that make him a hypocrite?

[/ QUOTE ]
Both the Devil and God are hypocrites yes.

[Dominic]

this is like asking who would win in a fight between Batman and Wonder Woman.

[diebitter]

Batman

[phixxx]

[ QUOTE ]
1. wrong forum
2. It sounds like you are really misinformed. The best way to educate yourself on religion is to read. I would recommend "The Case for Christ" by Lee Strobel.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd be the first one to agree that I'm misinformed. Which is why I specifically stated that I have absolutely no idea how religion is run. This theory is based purely on my religious ignorances, which is why you should regard it with a grain of salt /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I don't really feel like reading anything religiously based, so I'll just assume that it's a good book and leave it at that.

[FishNChips]

[ QUOTE ]
If you read the book of Job in the Old Testament, you'll find that in that story, Satan really is an agent of God doing His will.

[/ QUOTE ]

not correct

[captZEEbo1]

[ QUOTE ]
They tell me how if you're good, you go to heaven. If you're bad you go to hell; these are givens.....
if you obey all of gods commandments you go to heaven.

[/ QUOTE ]I don't know if this is too off-topic but this stuff isn't true at all, at least according to my denomination or whatever (and anyone else I've ever talked to about it). Obeying God's commandments isn't really correllated to going to heaven or hell (since nobody is perfect). It's more like believing Jesus died for your sins and accept him as your Savior.

here's a random link (http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/heaven.shtml) that explains it a little further if you're at all interested.

edit: rethinking it, "if you obey all of god's commandments you go to heaven" is kinda true; but misleading, since it's impossible (we're human).

[phixxx]

[ QUOTE ]
But your theory is only based on your selective interpretation of the Bible therefore isn't an accurate theory. IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

True.

Tony, what you say makes perfect sense. Good thinking. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ QUOTE ]
I'm almost certain that this post will get moved, but for the most part I post here and in the limit forums so I'll put it here. If it needs to be moved, tell me and I'll move it.

So, I'm having a discussion with an avid group of religious girls, and they begin to tell me the conducts and doctrines of their faiths. They tell me how if you're good, you go to heaven. If you're bad you go to hell; these are givens. There's also a set of laws you live by, which if broken, earn you a trip straight to hell. Now, here is where my theory comes in.

Using the traditional sense of thinking, if you're bad you go to hell, if you obey all of gods commandments you go to heaven. Obviously in hell, you are ripped apart every day by demons and your soul is eaten over and over again. However, why would the Devil treat you badly? In his eyes, you've done exactly what you were supposed to, no?

My belief is that if you conduct yourself with the utmost stupidity during your time on this planet; you steal, kill, disobey all of gods commandments, you will be welcomed with open arms in hell. Is this not logically true? If hell is the opposite of heaven, it seems that the devil would befriend you. Maybe you could hang out in hell. Have a beer. Talk with the demons. Do whatever you want. It seems foolish that he would punish you for doing exactly what he does, which is condone evil behavior. If the devil was to inflict harm on you for doing exactly what he preaches is right, wouldn't that make him a hypocrite?

Or maybe this is my ignorance of religion talking. If I'm speaking on behalf of my own misconceptions, please correct me. If not, feel free to discuss. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

It depends whether you think hell is actually a place of torture. I hold the view that it'd be more a place where there was an absence of God. All the imagery used in the Bible would be to get across the point of how horrible a place like this would be. You wouldn't actually be getting ass raped by big black 12 inchers all day, but that's how living in the absence of God would feel like.

If this was the case it wouldn't be a place where the devil 'ruled', but he would be there too, because God obviously wouldn't want him around. The reason he encourages deceit etc. is to try and get people sent to this place and separated from God.

This is how I interpret it all anyways.

Edit: interpretate? WTF I CAAN'T SPEEL /images/graemlins/confused.gif

You're not christian. GGGGEEEEETTTT THE FFUUCKK OOOOUUUUTTT. This whole thread is TTTTAAAIINNTTEEEDDD. In Jesus's name I command you to leave. I am a WARRIOR of GOD.

If you believe in Jesus you can post in this thread.