($16) Stumped on the river, ITM

[IdiotVig]

Villain has been pretty laggy all along, and is probably not the type to check a moderately strong hand (say, top pair) on the flop. What do you do on the river?

Coincidentally, how big would you have raised on the turn, if at all?



PokerStars Game #2957969609: Tournament #14597800, Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2005/11/02 - 21:08:53 (ET)
Table '14597800 1' Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: FLUSHMENOT (7700 in chips)
Seat 5: evil2525 (1475 in chips)
Seat 9: IdiotVig (4325 in chips)
FLUSHMENOT: posts the ante 25
evil2525: posts the ante 25
IdiotVig: posts the ante 25
FLUSHMENOT: posts small blind 200
evil2525: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to IdiotVig [Qc Jh]
IdiotVig: calls 400
FLUSHMENOT: calls 200
evil2525: checks
*** FLOP *** [Ad 6d 8c]
FLUSHMENOT: checks
evil2525: checks
IdiotVig: checks
*** TURN *** [Ad 6d 8c] [Jc]
FLUSHMENOT: bets 400
evil2525: folds
IdiotVig: raises 800 to 1200
FLUSHMENOT: calls 800
*** RIVER *** [Ad 6d 8c Jc] [5h]
FLUSHMENOT: bets 1200
IdiotVig: ?

[tigerite]

What are you doing preflop? Limping 1/10th your stack with QJo? 3-handed? On the button? Ugh..

He didn't check the turn, anyway. I'd check/fold or check/call the river. No point in doing anything else, but sorry your line here is really quite bad.

[pooh74]

I wouldnt have played it at all like this so its hard to say anything about the river.

PF, I like raising enough to PO the BB, but not so much to PO yourself if SB gets frisky (1000 to go).

But, ok, fine, family pot...there we are.

Flop: I think its safe to say no one has an ace and you would be the only one represetning one here, so betting might be fine...although I certainly think checking behind is fine too given the enormous volitilty of these two stacks in the pot (always be wary when you have a very big stack OR a very short stack are in the pot with you...here you have both)

Turn: This is terrible. If you are going to raise here, I think it has to be for more or you should just call. BB is out of the hand...why do you want to put yourself in this position when BB has 1000 left. If you want to put biggie to the test, then push.

river: calling leaves you 1500? meh...I'd fold...but I would never put myself there. This is why I hate the turn...because it really opens the door for this guy to take it away from me.

[IdiotVig]

[ QUOTE ]
What are you doing preflop? Limping 1/10th your stack with QJo? 3-handed? On the button? Ugh..

He didn't check the turn, anyway. I'd check/fold or check/call the river. No point in doing anything else, but sorry your line here is really quite bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

Between yours and pooh's response, I guess I clearly don't understand what to do PF. Raise enough to put BB all-in? Fold? Standard raise?

[tigerite]

I'd raise to 1000. Planning, naturally, to call a push from the BB.

[Iamafish]

Id push preflop.

[pooh74]

[ QUOTE ]
Id push preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Pushing isnt wrong here. I think raising to 1000 or so is simply "better". But to each his/her own.