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JDalla
11-10-2005, 09:30 AM
10/20 3man on pokerstars

Hero is button, villian is LB (unknown) and BB is "passive loose fish"

Hero has 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif6 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

Preflop:
Hero Raises, Villian 3-bets, BB cold calls, Hero calls.

Flop: Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif5 /images/graemlins/club.gif

Villian Bets, BB calls, Hero Calls.

Turn: Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif

Villian Bets, BB folds, Hero raises, Villian calls.

River: 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Villian checks, Hero checks

final pot: 10BB
TStoneMBD
11-10-2005, 10:28 AM
theres no reason to do a free showdown play here because you cant get the opponent to fold a better hand.
11-10-2005, 10:31 AM
The turn raise isn't just a free showdown play, it's to fold out overcards.

I think it was played well.
spydog
11-10-2005, 10:40 AM
If you are raising the turn for value then bet the river. He will call with Ace high.

I would just call the turn/river and bet if he checks to me.
JDalla
11-10-2005, 10:47 AM
hmm... there seems to be some disagreement here.

my reasoning was to have him fold out overcards.
If he 3bets the turn I fold, and if the river is K or A and he donk bets I also fold.

If he has me beat he is probably not going to re raise without trips or a boat, so I get a free shot at my 2 outter.

I don't like betting the river, I think his range of hands (being an unknown) is too dangerous. But I could be wrong here.

In the actual hand he had JJ.
TStoneMBD
11-10-2005, 10:55 AM
overcards need 6.7:1 to draw to their 6 outter. by raising the turn instead of calling you are allowing him to fold overs which are worth 1/7th of the pot in a 7BB pot (dont count your raise because we are comparing it to just calling). therefore, when he folds overs his equity is -1BB. you will extract the 1BB when he bets his overs on the river or checkcalls ace high. unless you really think he is going to give up with overcards on the river you extract the same amount of value, but you dont open yourself up to risk of being 3bet by a weaker hand.

when you are 3bet by a better hand you are folding a 2 outter which costs you pot equity. i do agree that raising the turn is a good play against certain opponents who are predictable and will often give up with overs on this river, but most people are not like that.