Stars $25+2, lay down QQ pre-flop? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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11-09-2005, 04:05 AM

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (8 handed) converter (http://www.pushfold.com/converter/hhconverter.cgi)

SB (t1505)
BB (t1870)
UTG (t810)
UTG+1 (t2190)
MP1 (t2070)
MP2 (t1120)
Hero (t2495)
Button (t1440)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to t200, MP1 raises to t500

I have some reason to think UTG+1 is an idiot, but it's not conclusive yet. OTOH, MP1 appears solid, and got the chips he has from one hand by either aggressively playing a solid hand or stealing the pot on the river (he didn't have to showdown).

11-09-2005, 04:12 AM

Bah, push.

One hand does not a solid player make.

HesseJam

11-09-2005, 04:14 AM

Tough spot here. All-in might be too risky at that stage. If you call you might be up against idiot's reraise. Flop might be difficult to play if you have overcards or if you are faced with a substantial raise without overcards. I'd let it go.

bawcerelli

11-09-2005, 04:41 AM

i'm probably pushing.

bennies

11-09-2005, 04:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Tough spot here. All-in might be too risky at that stage. If you call you might be up against idiot's reraise. Flop might be difficult to play if you have overcards or if you are faced with a substantial raise without overcards. I'd let it go.

[/ QUOTE ]

dam you're playing scared today! Push dem ladies.

11-09-2005, 05:04 AM

Hmmm I don't know, MP1's raise indicates he has a strong hand he wants to play heads up with UTG, but it just depends HOW strong. If he's as solid as you consider him to be, he will also picked up on the fact UTG is an idiot and that will make his re-raising standards slightly smaller. I think I push here, and hope for the best. Although I can't criticise folding as the tournament is still so early. But sod it my chips go in here.

11-09-2005, 05:33 AM

I'll raise to 1500, pot commiting myself and going all in on any flop

11-09-2005, 06:24 AM

I hate that line. The only hands that we're worried about are AA and KK, and they're not going anywhere.

11-09-2005, 07:05 AM

Push it hard. Probably fold Jacks.

HesseJam

11-09-2005, 07:09 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Tough spot here. All-in might be too risky at that stage. If you call you might be up against idiot's reraise. Flop might be difficult to play if you have overcards or if you are faced with a substantial raise without overcards. I'd let it go.

[/ QUOTE ]

dam you're playing scared today! Push dem ladies.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, probably. Might be because I played like crap yesterday.

11-09-2005, 07:55 AM

No one else's experience is that that specific "call me" re-raise is almost always AA/KK? Maybe I was being too weak-tight. Comments on how the rest of the hand went down?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (8 handed) converter (http://www.pushfold.com/converter/hhconverter.cgi)

SB (t1505)
BB (t1870)
UTG (t810)
UTG+1 (t2190)
MP1 (t2070)
MP2 (t1120)
Hero (t2495)
Button (t1440)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to t200, MP1 raises to t500, 5 folds, UTG+1 calls t300.

Flop: (t1150) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks.

Turn: (t1150) A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks.

River: (t1150) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
UTG+1 bets t500, MP1 raises to t1200, UTG+1 raises to t1690, MP1 calls t370 (All-In).

Final Pot: t4410

Results below:
UTG+1 has 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif A/images/graemlins/heart.gif (full house, threes full of aces).
MP1 has A/images/graemlins/club.gif A/images/graemlins/spade.gif (full house, aces full of threes).
Outcome: MP1 wins t4290. UTG+1 wins t120.

patrick dicaprio

11-09-2005, 08:06 AM

i had almost this exact situation the other day. a relatively loose opponent goes all in short stacked, and a relatively tight solid knowledgable player with a large stack CALLS. i hadnt looked at my cards yet (live game) and said to a friend to my right I hope i dont have QQ or JJ. i look at my cards and have JJ, grit my teeth and call. solid player has AA.

this situation is a bit different. with your opponent raising it is more likely he has something like AK or maybe AQ or a smaller pair. calling does you some good here because if you commit your self now you cant get away from the board if an A or K flops, if you are so inclined. i think you have to call here at least, folding is close to out of the question given that the first player will likely call and you have less reason to put the solid player on KK or AA as he rerarised, although those hands arent out of the question of course. even if you said that he will only have AK, AA or KK here, which i believe is unlikely but lets say it, you are 16-12 to be ahead of him with a chance to get 2-1 on your call. and if he can have JJ or worse or AQ you do even better so how can you fold??

Pat

Pat

11-09-2005, 08:15 AM

[ QUOTE ]
even if you said that he will only have AK, AA or KK here, which i believe is unlikely but lets say it, you are 16-12 to be ahead of him with a chance to get 2-1 on your call. and if he can have JJ or worse or AQ you do even better so how can you fold??

[/ QUOTE ]

If villains range is JJ+, AQ+ (and I don't think it's that wide, at least from a good player), and you assume he'll call a push, a push is -.1% $EV (not accounting for UTG+1's bet or the possibility he'll call and add dead money to the pot).

I consider calling here and dumping to an A/K on the flop, but that really seems worse than just folding.

11-09-2005, 08:19 AM

To change things up a little, if MP1 pushes and then shows his AKs, what should hero do?