AK, top pair, example of bad fold

I played this hand well preflop, not so well on the flop and like a total wuss on the turn. It cost me the pot. This is a perfect example of what Ed Miller was talking about in why we aren't crushing the micro-limit games, we fold too much.

FullTiltPoker Game #282877230: Table Camino Eldorado - $2/$4 - Limit Hold'em - 10:33:44 ET - 2005/11/08
Seat 1: Hubster ($398.50)
Seat 2: DirteAA ($101)
Seat 3: gambletank ($100)
Seat 4: LizetteS ($78)
Seat 5: Lindin ($59)
Seat 6: jbert11111 ($64.50)
Seat 7: JLM323 ($78)
Seat 8: LetsPlayCards07 ($55.50)
Seat 9: SteelDog ($26), is sitting out
DirteAA posts the small blind of $1
gambletank posts the big blind of $2
The button is in seat #1
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DirteAA [Ah Ks]
LizetteS folds
Lindin folds
SteelDog has returned
jbert11111 raises to $4
JLM323 folds
LetsPlayCards07 folds
Hubster calls $4
DirteAA raises to $6
gambletank raises to $8
jbert11111 calls $4
Hubster calls $4
DirteAA calls $2
*** FLOP *** [9s 6c Kh]
DirteAA bets $2
gambletank raises to $4
jbert11111 calls $4
Hubster calls $4
DirteAA calls $2
*** TURN *** [9s 6c Kh] [2c]
DirteAA checks
gambletank bets $4
jbert11111 raises to $8
Hubster folds
DirteAA folds
gambletank calls $4
*** RIVER *** [9s 6c Kh 2c] [9d]
gambletank checks
jbert11111 bets $4
gambletank calls $4
*** SHOW DOWN ***
jbert11111 shows [Ac 7c] (a pair of Nines)
gambletank shows [Qc Kc] (two pair, Kings and Nines)
gambletank wins the pot ($69) with two pair, Kings and Nines

Use one of the converters, nobody likes reading through the raw text of the hand history. http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter/

[bozlax]

This post is a wreck. Either use a converter or manually type the hand out. Don't include opponents' screen names. Don't include the results. Include any reads you might have. Include the pot size and number of players at the beginning of every street. Stop the HH where you have a question.

As to the play of the hand, without reads I at the very least call down. I'm much more likely to either 3-bet the flop, or call the flop planning to c/r a safe turn card. Folding this turn sucks.

Well, first off, let's just treat the new guy like an idiot, thank you. I tried using the bisonbison converter and it wouldn't accept Full Tilt's hand history format. I had never heard of "converters" before coming to this forum. I just wanted to show an example of a hand played wrong...I thought I made that clear.

I have been reading posts on this forum for a few weeks now and have decided that the players here are much better than the current forum I am on. I am trying to become a better poker player and figured I could learn the "posting etiquette" as I go...didn't know I'd get my head ripped off for not meeting the "standards."

I will try another converter, but, I don't know the first thing about them, so it may still come back weird. Thanks for the help.

You learned pretty much all you need to know about posting hands in this post. It may seem "negative" but the same guys will be helping you with your hand play in future posts when the hand histories are in a better format.

[car ramrod]

3bet the flop, play it from there.

Ok, I will try this again. I didn't have a read on any player at the table, it was only my second hand. I hope I don't butcher this, never done it before, I am typing it out by hand.

FullTiltPoker $2/$4 - Limit Hold'em 9-handed

Preflop: Hero has A /images/graemlins/heart.gif K /images/graemlins/spade.gif in sb. UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, <font color="red">UTG+2 raises</font> , 2 folds, Button calls, <font color="red">Hero 3-bets</font> , <font color="red">bb caps</font> , UTG+2 calls, Button calls.

Flop: (16 SB) 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 6 /images/graemlins/club.gif K /images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
<font color="red">Hero bets</font> , <font color="red">bb raises </font> , UTG+2 calls, button calls, Hero calls (Should I have 3-bet?).

Turn: (12BB) 2 /images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(4 players) </font>
Hero checks, <font color="red">bb bets </font> , <font color="red">UTG+2 raises </font> , button folds, Hero folds.

I should not have folded, I realize that now. The bb showed K /images/graemlins/club.gifQ /images/graemlins/club.gif and UTG+2 showed A /images/graemlins/club.gif7 /images/graemlins/club.gif, I posted this hand for that reason, I folded a strong hand in a big pot. Does anyone think that I should have folded here?

[SlantNGo]

I would bet the turn. A flop 3-bet accomplishes nothing since the others hanging around have called 2 cold already. Make them call 2 cold again. We still have a very good chance of having the best hand here.

Posting the results is another gaffe (more serious than the other gaffes actually). It influences people's thinking enough that oldtimers on this site may not post any advice now that you've done this. It's not intended to be flogging a newbie, it's just that all analysis is suspect if the analyst already knew the outcome.

Hope this helps.
Jeff

[crazygoose]

first of all not three betting the flop makes you look way weaker than you are. You have to three bet and can maybe try finding a fold if the flop gets capped. Even then i am calling down if the board stays safe. I guess folding here isnt terrible against typical micro players but you are forced to make a mistake because you played the hand incorrectly on the earlier streets.

[ QUOTE ]
I would bet the turn. A flop 3-bet accomplishes nothing since the others hanging around have called 2 cold already. Make them call 2 cold again. We still have a very good chance of having the best hand here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think we are ahead here more often than not and want to build the pot. I think we've got to 3 bet the flop, unless you think calling and leading the turn gets more into the pot.

[numeri]

[ QUOTE ]
I should not have folded, I realize that now. The bb showed K /images/graemlins/club.gifQ /images/graemlins/club.gif and UTG+2 showed A /images/graemlins/club.gif7 /images/graemlins/club.gif, I posted this hand for that reason, I folded a strong hand in a big pot. Does anyone think that I should have folded here?

[/ QUOTE ]
Of course not - you had the best hand! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif (Just pointing out that posting results usually gives you tainted responses.)

If I were to look at this objectively, it sure looks like we're drawing. What the hell is UTG+2 getting so excited about on that turn? It looks like a slow-played set to me, but the villains are unknown. I'd have a hard time calling this as well.

[Poker Junkie]

I would have raised the flop and possibly c/r the turn. I think you have to call this down but can't say that I wouldn't have been worried about AA or KK (but I'm guilty of being weak tight sometimes as well).

Walt

To the original poster: be sure you read this 2+2 thread if you haven't already:

http://tinyurl.com/8hl2p

In that thread, I said fold to a raise and reraise on the river in a huge pot (again, I'm a beginner, and LOTS of people disagree with me there).

The reason I said "fold" in that other thread is that the poster had unconcealed trips (KT with two K's on the board).

It's hard for me to believe that BOTH of the raisers there were oblivious to the possibility of somebody holding a single king.

In this case, I would have found it much easier to believe that neither of the raisers could beat your hand. So yes, although it's not easy to grit your teeth and usually lose, I think this was a bad fold.

Just curious but what did you think either villian had? You can just about rule out KK since you have a K and one is on the board. I think capping preflop with 66 might be a little on the loose/crazy side? 99 maybe but still a bit of overbetting. But I don't play at this high of limits, so not sure how it plays there. But I just can't put either of them on trips here and if I did I still have 2 outs, and currently have 15:1 odds to call this bet, but since I don't put the villians on trips I think at best one MIGHT have 2 pair, I have 5 outs, 3 Aces and the 2 kings, which I think gives the odds to call this bet. Could be a leak in my game that is still developing but I can't see folding this. It might be from reading Ed Miller's post on why people are not crushing the low limit games though.

[BluEsiNsOuL]

It does extract at least 1 more bet from them. I will only consider fold if the flop is capped and I get raised again when I lead the turn.

[ QUOTE ]
Just curious but what did you think either villian had? You can just about rule out KK since you have a K and one is on the board. I think capping preflop with 66 might be a little on the loose/crazy side? 99 maybe but still a bit of overbetting. But I don't play at this high of limits, so not sure how it plays there. But I just can't put either of them on trips here and if I did I still have 2 outs, and currently have 15:1 odds to call this bet, but since I don't put the villians on trips I think at best one MIGHT have 2 pair, I have 5 outs, 3 Aces and the 2 kings, which I think gives the odds to call this bet. Could be a leak in my game that is still developing but I can't see folding this. It might be from reading Ed Miller's post on why people are not crushing the low limit games though.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is why I posted this, because I read Ed Miller's post right after this hand happened. I was trying to show a really good example of what he was saying. I never should have folded.

I also played the hand wrong, I should have 3-bet the flop, and happily called a cap, and I should have led out on the turn. I don't see how I could have gotten away from this hand w/ the pot size.

To answer your question. I thought that the bb may have had AA, possbily KK (but not probable). When the other two ppl in the hand cold called 2 bets on the flop I honestly believed that one of them had 99, giving them a set of 9s. From my experience playing Limit Hold 'em online, this is pretty standard play when there is a lot of action on the flop. Because I believed someone had a set I played my hand weakly and more or less got myself shut out of the pot on the turn. I should have been more agressive on the flop and on the turn, so I could at least get to a showdown.

Yeah, I have to agree with you, you fubared that hand.