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adios
06-19-2003, 02:40 PM
Read an article in the WSJ this week about the growing number of homeless people in Japan. The number of homeless in the USA is estimated to be 600,000. I realize that some are homeless due to their choice and some are homeless due to mental illness. However, I would guess the vast majority of the homeless population could simply use some assistance and would be overjoyed not to be homeless. Could be wrong about that and be convinced otherwise. Do the Democrats and/or the Republicans have any programs to alleviate the wretched condition of homeless in the USA? I would guess not due to the lack of voter turnout among the homeless.

Jimbo
06-19-2003, 02:48 PM
". Do the Democrats and/or the Republicans have any programs to alleviate the wretched condition of homeless in the USA? "

I believe this is one subject on which both Democrats and Republicans agree. They build more bridges.

Ray Zee
06-19-2003, 06:24 PM
Jimbo, you have a sick conservative mind.

Ray Zee
06-19-2003, 06:32 PM
Tom, part of the homeless problem is that what most people see is them panhandling, and it turns them off to helping.
it seems in our society everyone that wants to work should be given a job. if they dont take it, no further assistance should be given and if they starve thats nature at work.
people that cant work or are mentally or physically in capable of working need to be taken care of by the populace.
the hard part is finding out who is capable and who is not.
the dems push for more programs as handouts, and the repub tend to use work type programs.
i remember in the 1960's the transient population in new jersey all moved to california when they put in a program that gave good benefits to anyone in the state. now california is loaded with them. montana and minesota i think made it real tough to get anything after 6 months and many have left for greener pastures. i dont miss them.

andyfox
06-20-2003, 01:54 AM
"a sick conservative mind"

Is there any other kind?

/forums/images/icons/wink.gif

nicky g
06-20-2003, 09:31 AM
My wife works for a homelessness organisation in London. As far as I understand it, the majority of homelessness cases over here result from mental illness and/or people who've left institutional lives (prisoners, ex-servicemen etc). It's telling that there was very low levels street homelessness until Margaret Thatcher introduced the Care in the Community programme, which was on the surface designed to move mentally ill people out of asylums etc and get them looked after in the community, but in practice resulted in thousands of extraordinarily vulnerable people being thrown out of their homes and left to fend for themselves. Of course, inequality levels also shot up under Thatcher, which certainly has a lot to do with the explosion in homelessness that happened during her government.

I understand that there is a much greater problem of homeless families in the US compared to Britain, where street sleepers are largely single males. I don't know what the cause of that is. Clearly it's a complicated problem with a variety of causes and manifestations. As you say, politicians have very little incentive to do much about it, except their intrinsic compassion and goodness... /forums/images/icons/frown.gif .

Boris
06-20-2003, 02:05 PM
yea but now I notice that they putting cement fill in those nice ledges under the bridges. I think that's a real shame. Seriously.

MMMMMM
06-20-2003, 09:30 PM
I really think work farms would be a great idea, if they were set up as follows: around 60 hours/week labor at very low wages, and free (or for a minimal fee) dormitory/barracks-style living with very strict rules and free healthy plain meals. Anyone could go there and work and save money for up to 6 months and could bank most of what they make. No drugs or alcohol or causing real trouble or they get kicked out. If they are drug addicts or severe alcoholics they have to go through detox first. Lights out and no talking at 9:00 P/M., rise at 6:00 A.M. and Sundays off for rest and recreation. No smoking indoors. Good security so it's safe for workers and for those who run it. The work farm or work factory should make at least enough to cover expenses by virtue of cheap labor, and the temporary residents could save perhaps $200-$350/wk. depending on various factors. As long as they stay they could be saving--let's guess here--from $800 to $1400 per month. So after a spell they could have: 1) enough to get a decent apartment, 2) a cushion to sustain them while looking for a job, 3) some money for new clothes, and 4) perhaps enough to buy a cheap old car. Well that's not a heckuva lot, but it's sure a lot better than being homeless and not being able to get any of the above.

Also, some people who are homeless are not really mentally ill or completely unwilling to work, but something may have happened in their lives for which they were unprepared and perhaps they didn't deal with it in the best way possible. Maybe they didn't have money set aside for a rainy day and when the rainy day came they were in trouble before too long. Maybe they had too much trouble coping with being laid-off at the same time as their loved one broke up with them. Maybe they just got out of jail with good intentions but they got out broke and homeless. Being homeless is a terrible trap, because who wants to hire a homeless person and they aren't even eligible for food stamps without an address.

Some people who have only been homeless a short while can quickly get confused and start suffering the effects of bad diet/little food, cold, disease, irregular sleep, and despair as well as seemingly insurmountable logistical problems. No current welfare program really addresses this other than shallowly because the homeless shelters are generally overcrowded and do little except to provide a brief respite and some counseling and encouragement. They run on government money and as such are generally underfunded and sometimes unsafe or dirty. On the other hand, well-run work farms would enable anyone who wants to work and live right the chance to do it for a while, and the chance to save some money.

Sometimes somewhat confused or depressed people who aren't severely mentally ill just need stable surroundings and structured living conditions and working for a while to clear their heads. Also it would help build a sense of accomplishment and self-worth.

Whether the work farms would be state-run or private enterprises, or some combination of both, is something I haven't thought much about.

I can almost hear the cries of "exploitation" etc. especially if these people are being charged something for room and board or are being required to work over 40 hours per week. But with proper guidelines all this could be reasonably addressed and safe guidelines instituted, and it would give people who've had the bottom fall out of their lives a chance to start again. Actually, resident workers would be able to save money at a faster clip than many low-paid people in the outside world, since living expenses would be quite minimal in barracks conditions and because they would be working six ten-hour days if physically capable.

Also necessary would be limitations on how often someone could reside within a given time frame. Say a maximum of 6 months out of any consecutive 18-month period.

Wouldn't it be nice to know that if you ever went broke all you would have to do would be to go to the work farm for a few months or so and you'd be right back on your feet. I think there should be at least one in every state. Yeah I know that sounds funny but I really believe it.

Ray Zee
06-20-2003, 10:57 PM
they have that setup now in many states. its called produce farms. problem is the u.s. people wont do the work so we import workers from mexico to do the jobs that the people getting welfare are too good to do. helps keep the price of artichokes down though.

MMMMMM
06-21-2003, 12:08 AM
That isn't exactly what I had in mind. I wouldn't think people working on those farms would be able save that much money (but I might be mistaken). If each worker can save 800-1400 dollars per month after expenses then I don't see why they should need to import workers--there are plenty of broke Americans and that's a lot more money than anyone can save each month flipping burgers or working at Wal-Mart or running a register at the local convenience store or supermarket.

Also, "work factories" might be able to support a higher pay scale than "work farms."

So I'm wondering what those migrant worker farms actually pay. I had the impression that they charged outrageous amounts for room and board so the migrant workers couldn't save very much, but that's just based on one clip from the nightly news years ago.

And why should broke young Americans be unwilling to work 70 hours a week for a while to get out of being broke. I've done it more than once. Sure it kind of sucks but it doesn't last forever.

Cyrus
06-21-2003, 01:50 AM
What goes around, comes around. I remember the Reagan-era t-shirts worn by Wall Streeters and aspiring Wall Streeters proclaiming that Greed Is Good or that Whoever Dies With More Money Wins. A time of triumphalism for American-style capitalism, as practiced by that decade's Michael Milkens and the like. I also remember the Reagan era as a time when the U.S. was violently downsized, gone into heavy debt and gambled with nukes, all to the tune of accountants (who see any kind of nice Assets and think filthy thoughts) and wheeler-dealers (who think nothing of making Flint, Michigan of any city they can get their hands on).

We are at an age, small or big don't know, of American triumphalism again. Sights and thoughts about such irrelevancies as the homeless (non-voting entities, as was remarked very precisely) spoil the victory parade. The new t-shirts may proclaim proudly new slogans, such as the title of my post, but the spirit is pure James Watts all over again.

Someone take those homeless folks out the back, please.

adios
06-21-2003, 07:06 AM
Here's an interesting link to information regarding homelessness. Keep in mind that the info on this site is a few years old.

Homelessness: The Causes and Facts (http://www.cohhio.org/resources/factsheets/Chicagofactsheet.html)

Homelessness: The Causes and Facts

Introduction
At a time when the economy is booming, unemployment is low; and the Dow Jones has set new records, the National Coalition for the Homeless estimates that as many as 3 million people are homeless in the U.S. during the course of a year.


The primary causes of homelessness are the lack of affordable housing, the lack of living wage jobs or sufficient income, and the lack of adequate health and supportive services. Local and national efforts to address homelessness often focus on emergency services, temporary shelter, food, clothing, and emergency healthcare rather than on the root causes.


While advocates are busy fighting for new affordable housing and creating new job opportunities, homelessness is outpacing them. While shelter beds are vitally important and life saving, but they are not a permanent solution. Until the root causes of homelessness are addressed and permanent solutions adequately funded, the problem will continue to worsen.


Who Are the Homeless?
• 22 percent of homeless people are veterans. There are more homeless veterans today than U.S. soldiers who died in Vietnam.1
• The average age of a homeless person in the United States is 9 years old.2
• In the US, 29 percent of homeless families that have ever received TANF reported having their benefits cut or reduced in the last 6 months.3
• 16 percent of homeless people spent time in foster care, group homes, shelters, or welfare hotels before they were 18.4
• As many as 25-40 percent of homeless people work full- or part-time, but cannot afford to pay rent.5


National Homeless Demographics
45 percent - single men
38 percent - families with children
14 percent - single women
3 percent - unaccompanied

49 percent - African American
32 percent - White
12 percent - Latino
4 percent - Native American
3 percent - Asian


CAUSE: Lack of Affordable Housing
• The affordable housing shortage, once concentrated in the cities, has spread to the suburbs. The number of suburban households with critical housing needs jumped by 146,000 from 1991 to 1995 - a nine percent increase.6
• Nationally, 10.5 million renters compete for 6.1 million low-income units. This gap leaves 4.4 million people unable to find an affordable place to live.7
• More than 1 million families nationwide are on waiting lists for assistance from the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD).8
• Nationally, requests for housing assistance have increased by 74 percent in the last year. Only 27 percent of eligible low-income households currently receive housing assistance.9
• In 1998, 44 percent of families nationwide lived doubled or tripled up with family or friends prior to entering homeless shelters.10


CAUSE: Lack of Living Wage Jobs
• Between 1982 and 1990, temporary employment grew by 300 percent.11 In 1997, almost 30 percent of all U.S. workers were employed in part-time or temporary positions, even though many of these workers actively sought full-time work.12
• A person must work full time and earn at least $8.29/hour to reach the federal poverty level for a family of four ($16,588). According to the most recent Census Bureau report, 2.3 million people worked full-time in 1997 yet were below the poverty line.13
• A full-time worker at the minimum wage of $5.15/hr. earns an annual income of $10,300 before taxes. Minimum-wage jobs generally provide no benefits such as health insurance or daycare, nor do they provide opportunity for advancement. The real value of the minimum wage in 1997 was 18.1 percent less than in 1979.14
• Between 1980 and 1998, the average pay of working people increased just 68 percent, while CEO compensation grew by 1,596 percent. The average CEO of a major corporation made $10.6 million in 1998, 419 times more than an average blue-collar worker.15
• A 1998 welfare grant for a family of three was $377. The buying power of a 1998 welfare grant was less than 44 percent of a grant in 1973.16


CAUSE: Lack of Health and Supportive Services
• Approximately 38 percent of homeless people suffer from a substance abuse problem.17
• In 1996, Congress eliminated SSI and SSDI benefits for people diagnosed with an addiction.
• There are currently no federal programs that target funds for substance abuse programs for homeless people.18
• The mortality rate for a homeless person is 3-4 times higher than that of the general public.19
• A national study indicated that 13 percent of homeless individuals became homeless due to health problems.20
• Homeless individuals are 10-15 times more likely to suffer from gangrene, gout and ulcerations resulting in amputation; 2-3 times more likely to suffer from gastro-intestinal disorders; and 2-4 times more prone to hypertension.21
• 20-25 percent of homeless people suffer from serious mental illness.22
• Many mentally ill people are inappropriately discharged from hospitals to the streets. Nevertheless, only 5-7 percent of homeless people with mental illness need to be institutionalized. As many as 95 percent could live in community settings if appropriate supportive services and housing were available.23
• Eight percent of homeless people suffer from AIDS or are HIV-positive.24


Impact of Homelessness on Children
Families with children are the fastest-growing segment of the homeless population. Homelessness has a particularly devastating impact on children. One problem that often arises is a disruption in schooling as homeless children are forced to change schools repeatedly and miss many days in the school year.
• It takes an average of 4-6 months for a child to recover academically from a change in schools.25
• 66 percent of students who missed 20 or more school days during first, second or third grade will drop out of school.26
• 50 percent of all children in shelters show signs of anxiety and depression.27
• Children in shelters show as high as 70 percent rate of delay in immunizations, compared to 22 percent among low-income children who are housed.28


Shelter Types
Overnight Shelters: Located in churches or other larger buildings, these shelters are open only at night. Most overnight shelters simply serve the immediate needs of homeless people by providing a warm place to sleep and some food to eat.
Warming Centers: Similar to overnight shelters, but they are open only between October and April.
Transitional Shelters: These shelters are often geared toward a specific population, such as battered women. They attempt to break the cycle of homelessness by providing a structured, homelike environment and helping people transition to more permanent housing. The standard length of stay is 120 days.
Second-Stage Housing: These programs provide alternative, low-income housing in individual apartments, usually for up to two years. Social services and case management are provided to help people make a transition to more stable permanent housing. Housing fees are often charged, usually at about one-third of the person's income.


Targeting Treatment for Homeless People
Most drug and alcohol addicts never become homeless, but people who are poor and addicted are more susceptible to homelessness. Many homeless people develop an addiction after becoming homeless. The challenge of controlling addiction, regardless of when it arises, coupled with a lack of proper treatment programs, makes moving beyond homelessness extremely difficult.

Of the 38 percent of homeless people who suffer from an alcohol or drug addiction, less than half receive proper treatment.29 The National Association of State Alcohol and Drug Abuse Directors has identified homeless people as a group with specific needs they are unable to meet, but little is done to improve access to treatment for homeless people.30


Several studies have shown that treatment is a more cost-effective and helpful way to address substance abuse that the usual alternative of incarceration. A national study found that, following treatment, clients who reported being homeless dropped by 43 percent while the employment rate increased by 19 percent.31 In California, a 1991 study showed that for every dollar spent on treatment $7 were saved by the taxpayers.32


Recently, the increasing number of people incarcerated for drug-related crimes has prompted several states, including New York and Arizona, to cease mandatory prison sentences in favor or treatment programs. In addition, more than two-thirds of U.S. prison wardens favor the increased use of correctional treatment options, such as residential drug treatment programs and halfway houses.33


Domestic Violence and Homelessness
Domestic violence is a leading cause of homelessness among women and children. Half of all homeless women cite domestic violence as their primary cause for becoming homeless. Many women who leave their abusers have no other option but the streets. Leaving an abusive relationship often means leaving property and family income behind.

Of women who become homeless due to abuse, 40 percent are not able to find room in a domestic violence shelter. There are nearly three times as many animal shelters in the U.S. as shelters for battered women.34


The lack of decent affordable housing and childcare compounds their already desperate situation. In some cases, the painful experience of being homeless causes women to return to their abusers. For others, relentless batterers-those who show up at a woman's new job and harass her-make regaining stability and independence a difficult task.


Welfare Reform and Family Homelessness
Welfare Reform has added to the problem of family homelessness. Welfare recipients need to move from welfare to work within five years or they will lose their benefits. Many families are already becoming homeless when they are sanctioned due to stricter work requirements.


Despite widespread publicity about reduced welfare rolls, only 27 percent of welfare cases in 1998 were closed due to increased income, while 50 percent were closed due to failure to keep an appointment or provide paperwork.35 Without any support many families that are sanctioned, even when the sanction is caused by a state error, end up in a shelter.


Even families that do find work and move off welfare have difficulty maintaining housing. Nationally, families leaving welfare make an average of just $5,000 in the first year and $9,000 after five years.36 These incomes put families under 30 percent of national median income and at high risk of homelessness. Families that leave welfare for very low-paying jobs may end up in worse financial situations and at a higher risk of homelessness than when they were on welfare-especially with the loss of medical assistance and increased costs associated with working such as childcare and transportation.


Homelessness and Mental Illness
Nationwide, 20-25 percent of homeless people suffer from some form of serious mental illness.37 Solutions for this population are not "one size fits all." Only 5-7 percent of homeless persons with mental illness need to be institutionalized, while most others could live in community settings with appropriate supportive services and housing.38 Despite this fact, many homeless people that are mentally ill are not able to obtain the supportive services, such as case management, treatment, and supportive housing, that they need to find and maintain housing.


In the meantime, homeless people with severe mental illness tend to suffer more: they remain homeless for longer periods of time, have less contact with family and friends, encounter more barriers to employment, tend to be in poorer physical health, and have more contact with the legal system than other homeless people.39 Without more treatment and rehabilitation services, many mentally ill homeless people will remain on the streets and not regain their independence and find stable housing.


Information taken from: The Facts Behind the Faces - A Fact Sheet From the Chicago Coalition for the Homeless.



1 US Conference of Mayor's Report on Hunger and Homelessness, 1998.
2 Homes for the Homeless, New York.
3 See note 1.
4 Ten Cities: A Snapshot of Family Homelessness Across America, Homes for the Homeless and the Institute for Children and Poverty, 1997-1998.
5 National Law Center on Homelessness and Poverty, 1999.
6 HUD press release, April 28, 1998.
7 Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, In Search of Shelter: The Growing Shortage of Affordable Rental Housing, June 1998.
8 See note 6.
9 See note 1.
10 See note 4.
11 Jobs That Pay, The Work Poor Project, Northern Illinois University, 1995.
12 Jobs Picture: Unemployment Steady, but Growth Slows, Economic Policy Institute, 1998.
13 US Bureau of the Census, Current Population Reports. Poverty in the United States: 1997 U.S. Government Printing Office, Washington, D.C., 1998.
14 National Coalition for the Homeless, February 1999.
15 AFL-CIO Executive Pay Watch, 1999.
16 www.jsc.nasa.gov/bu2/inflateCPI.html (http://www.jsc.nasa.gov/bu2/inflateCPI.html)
17 See note 1.
18 National Coalition for the Homeless, Homelessness and Chemical Dependency: Needs, Services, Funding.
19 Barrow S., D. Herman, P. Cordova, E. Strueing Mortality among Homeless Shelter Residents in New York City, April 1999.
20 Life and Death on the Streets, National Coalition for the Homeless, 1993.
21 Ibid.
22 National Coalition for the Homeless, Fact Sheet #5, 1997.
23 Ibid.
24 See note 1.
25 Dr. Joy Rogers of the Loyola University Department of Education, Education Report of Rule 706 Expert Panel, presented in B.H. v. Johnson, 1991.
26 Against the Odds: Early Identification of High School Drop Outs, Chicago Panel on School Policy Study, 1989.
27 Bassuk, El, and L. Rosenberg, Psychological Characteristics of Homeless Children and Children with Homes, Pediatrics 1990.
28 Fierman AH, Dreyer BP, Acker PJ, Legano L. Status of Immunization and Iron Nutrition in New York City Homeless Children. Clinical Pediatrics, 1993 (March).
29 National Law Center on Homelessness and Pverty, http://www.tomco.net/_nlchp/health.htm. See note 13.
30 See note 13.
31 Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMHSA), National Treatment Improvement Study (NTIES), http://www.health.org/nties97/employ.htm.
32 National Association of State Alcohol and Drug Abuse Directors (NASADAD), http://www.nasadad.org/treatment1.htm.
33 U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee, 19974, from http://www.jointogether.org/sa/
34 Senate Judiciary Committee, 1990.
35 IDHS Caseload Activity Reports.
36 Daniel R. Meyer and Maria Cancia. Life After Welfare: The Economic Well-Being of Women and Children Following Exit from AFDC, Institute for Research and Poverty, University of Wisconsin, 1996.
37 Koegel, Paul, et al. The Causes of Homelessness, 1996.
38 Federal Task Force on Homelessness and Severe Mental Illness, 1992.
39 Kleppner, Paul and Theodore Nikolas. Working After Welfare: Is Illinois' Booming Economy Creating Enough Jobs, Midwestern Job Gap Project, Chicago, 1997

adios
06-21-2003, 07:19 AM
I'm fairly certain that the number of homeless increased a disproportionate amount during the Reagan administration. With that said I don't think you can lay the blame entirely on the Republicans and in fact I think the Democrats should share an equal amount of the blame at least. First of all the Democrats pre-Reagan created a welfare system that was very corrupt and wasteful IMO. Second of all Clinton was no friend to the homeless IMO but I could be convinced otherwise about that. Third the current DNC seems to have written the homeless off as well although I could be convinced otherwise.

adios
06-21-2003, 07:21 AM
A compassionate plan. In my follow up post take note of the fact that 25% to 40% of the homeless actually work. I haven't corroborated this statement though from another source but the site does seem credible to me.

adios
06-21-2003, 07:28 AM
My understanding is that many homeless in the USA are mentally ill as well. Many lay the blame on the repeal of laws that would institionalize mentally ill against their will. In the my post entitiled follow up I quote the demographics of homeless in the USA. Cudos to your wife and yourself for your compassion. We don't agree on politics but I readily concede that you make valid points often.

adios
06-21-2003, 07:31 AM
One thing I think we'd agree on is that if the incentives are too great many people will opt for a free ride. However, I know that you'd agree and Jimbo would as well that homeless children are not responsible for their plight.

adios
06-21-2003, 07:32 AM
Hopefully the Democrats and the Republicans will at least demonstrate some compassion and help alleviate the plight of homeless children.

Cyrus
06-21-2003, 08:10 AM
disagree with.

Except perhaps with the part "Clinton was no friend to the homeless IMO but I could be convinced otherwise about that." Don't even bother.

Jimbo
06-21-2003, 10:34 AM
Cyrus wrote "I remember the Reagan-era...."

I remember it as well Cyrus, do not fear, it will be back again soon. We are in good hands with Bush, unlike Regan he is not restricted by a lopsided Democratic controlled Congress.

Jimbo; Longing for the good ole Reagan days again!

John Cole
06-21-2003, 11:14 AM
Tom,

According to the most conservative mouthpieces, there are no homeless in America. The liberals have simply invented them. Didn't you know that?

John

Jimbo
06-21-2003, 11:35 AM
"The liberals have simply invented them. Didn't you know that?"

John I think we conservatives believe that the liberals have "created" them, not invented them.

ACPlayer
06-21-2003, 01:27 PM
... I would put the work farms in a middle eastern desert. It would be cheaper and we can keep them there forever at a very low cost. If the numbers become too big, then we can simply force the people living in that part of the world out of their homes into neighbouring countries.

Cyrus
06-21-2003, 01:28 PM
"I think we conservatives believe that the liberals have "created" them, not invented them."

Alright the game's up, time to come clean, yes, yes, YES, it's true. The liberals seeing that they will be soon out of voters created their own by shoving out of their work and their homes thousands upon thousands of white, middle class, white- and blue-collar workers. A whole underclass created just to re-elect Ted Kennedy!

And it all happened during the heyday of liberal supremacy, the 1980s. Look it up. Aye, those were the days.

scalf
06-21-2003, 04:09 PM
/forums/images/icons/mad.gif tom...

do the honeless vote?

do homeless attend 2,000/plate bush presidency fund raisers?

the price to sleep uner a bridge is the same for a millionaire and a pauper....that's justice in amerika....gl /forums/images/icons/crazy.gif