Comments on all streets appreciated

[Baloosh]

Table was typical loose/passive Party micro table.

Did I mess any street up horribly? Raise the flop? How about the turn?

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed) internettexasholdem.com (http://www.internettexasholdem.com)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (14 SB) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Button folds, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises</font>, BB folds, UTG folds, Hero calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (11 BB) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls.

River: (14 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP3 folds, SB calls.

Final Pot: 18 BB

Raise the flop.
Raise the turn.

You're only getting play from flushes,7's and maybe bigger PP (unlikely due to preflop) . Both are coming no matter how much money goes in.

If the T was the T/images/graemlins/club.gif, I'd like the flop call.

[MadMat]

1st time grunching!

Don't see much worng with the way you played it, you managed to build a nice pot with your flopped boat.

I think I might have been tempted to slow play and check the flop with the flush draw on the board, in the hope that someone hits a flush and really pays me off, which SB appears to have done here!

Mat

[McGahee]

Pretty easy flop 3-bet because nobody's folding for any amount of SB's on this board.
I don't have a problem w/ the turn call - it's doubtful anybody's calling 2 BB's cold without the flush. Plus, a low flush will raise behind us allowing us to 3-bet, where as they might just coldcall if we raise.

[Baloosh]

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If the T was the T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, I'd like the flop call.

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Why would that change the flop play to a call?

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If the T was the T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, I'd like the flop call.

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Why would that change the flop play to a call?

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I edited the post.
Non suited board is what I meant.

[Baloosh]

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I edited the post.
Non suited board is what I meant.

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Oh ok. Makes sense now.

[LoaferGee12]

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Raise the flop.
Raise the turn.

You're only getting play from flushes,7's and maybe bigger PP (unlikely due to preflop) . Both are coming no matter how much money goes in.

If the T was the T/images/graemlins/club.gif, I'd like the flop call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Eh, you really should 3-bet this flop no matter what the suit here.

[RustyCJ]

*grunch*

any 7 and flush draws are coming regardless, as was said, raising on the flop again will probably disguise your hand a bit more and make it look like you have AA-QQ and either you aren't fearing a 7 or are too reckless to consider that it is out there.

No one is going to suspect you have TT here and fold and as Miller says in SSHE, playing monster hands well isn't that hard. Finding every last bet with a hand like this is less important than finding and fixing other leaks, just something to consider.

I also agree, if the flop was 3 suited I'd probably just call the flop raise, but with potential flush draws out, they aren't folding and they'll pay through the nose to see the river.

[sean c]

Hi Baloosh you really need to get in more bets on the flop and turn i wouldn't worry to much about overcalls. Just bet and raise your hand is pretty well concealed and a seven or flush draw is gonna pay you off nicely.

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Raise the flop.
Raise the turn.

You're only getting play from flushes,7's and maybe bigger PP (unlikely due to preflop) . Both are coming no matter how much money goes in.

If the T was the T/images/graemlins/club.gif, I'd like the flop call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Eh, you really should 3-bet this flop no matter what the suit here.

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I disagree.

/images/graemlins/confused.gif

3bet flop

raise turn

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[ QUOTE ]
Raise the flop.
Raise the turn.

You're only getting play from flushes,7's and maybe bigger PP (unlikely due to preflop) . Both are coming no matter how much money goes in.

If the T was the T/images/graemlins/club.gif, I'd like the flop call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Eh, you really should 3-bet this flop no matter what the suit here.

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I disagree.

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I also disagree.... with your disagreement. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Redd]

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Raise the flop.
Raise the turn.

You're only getting play from flushes,7's and maybe bigger PP (unlikely due to preflop) . Both are coming no matter how much money goes in.

If the T was the T/images/graemlins/club.gif, I'd like the flop call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Eh, you really should 3-bet this flop no matter what the suit here.

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I disagree.

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I also disagree.... with your disagreement. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

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I agree with Esikmo's disagreement. Nobody's folding a pot this huge on the flop. We get the most value on the flop and we boat the pot for increasing later profitability by getting in as many bets as possible.

[lautzutao]

I think next time you need to flop quads.

(I pre-emptively agree with anyone that agrees that disagreeing or agreeing with Redd would be taking it too far)

[Redd]

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(I pre-emptively agree with anyone that agrees that disagreeing or agreeing with Redd would be taking it too far)

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I'll agree to that too.

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Nobody's folding a pot this huge on the flop.

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I disagree.

[Redd]

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Nobody's folding a pot this huge on the flop.

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I disagree.

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I guess saying 'nobody' is a logical fallacy, but I think people will continue to peel very often. What hands do you expect them to peel getting ~16:1 on the first bet but fold for ~11:1 on the raise?

Consider the risk vs. the reward: if the 2 guys behind us won't call 2 cold on the flop, then they definitely won't on the turn. So we lose their two flop 2SBs. Best case scenario, we get 5 more SBs on the flop alone if the other guy caps his 7, and the bloated pot has the potential to make us several more BBs as well on the turn/river.

[milesdyson]

i would just call if the flop were T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif and i held T/images/graemlins/diamond.gifT/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, because i would not want to fold anyone out with my royal full house. other than flopping a royal full house and being so egotistical that i would give up value on it just to show this amazing hand, i would 3-bet the flop.

[KaiShin]

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i would just call if the flop were T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif and i held T/images/graemlins/diamond.gifT/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, because i would not want to fold anyone out with my royal full house. other than flopping a royal full house and being so egotistical that i would give up value on it just to show this amazing hand, i would 3-bet the flop.

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Sweet.

[Redd]

You know, I saw a guy slowplay a royal full house for all three postflop streets once.

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Nobody's folding a pot this huge on the flop.

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I disagree.

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I guess saying 'nobody' is a logical fallacy, but I think people will continue to peel very often. What hands do you expect them to peel getting ~16:1 on the first bet but fold for ~11:1 on the raise?

Consider the risk vs. the reward: if the 2 guys behind us won't call 2 cold on the flop, then they definitely won't on the turn. So we lose their two flop 2SBs. Best case scenario, we get 5 more SBs on the flop alone if the other guy caps his 7, and the bloated pot has the potential to make us several more BBs as well on the turn/river.

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J9, J8, 86, AQ, QJ, KQ, any two suited broadways.

This is just a SHORT list of all the hands that peel getting 16:1 but fold getting 10.5:1 in the face of a 3bet flop on a paired rainbow board.

All of these hands have a chance of picking up draws or making hands on the turn that they would deem playable in the face of action on the turn.

Your calculations also didn't take into account the amount of times you slow down 7x, where x isn't T or A.

What it comes down to is the amount of times you think the two behind you on the flop are coming anyway. Considering between you and SB you've pretty much crippled the deck, I'm happy to get my 2 extra SB and hope they make a hand\draw on the turn.


On a two flush board, I'm happy to go crazy. On a rainbow, with crappy relative position, we'll have to agree to disagree. Enough said.