View Full Version : Collecting on a stake gone bad
What are my options in terms of collecting a debt from someone I staked who is avoiding me?
I have a written contract in which he agrees to pay me back $X and also keep in contact with me. He has broken the contract. I have his name, know what school he attended last year, address as of a couple months ago (which may or may not be current), various screen shots.
Do I get a collections lawyer? Hire an investigator to find where he lives now?
addickt
11-01-2005, 08:05 PM
There is no way it will hold up...
It undoubtedly will violate many Uniform Commercial Code contract law statutes that will nullify it.
Good luck
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:08 PM
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There is no way it will hold up...
It undoubtedly will violate many Uniform Commercial Code contract law statutes that will nullify it.
Good luck
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There are a multitude of reasons why this contract will almost certainly not hold up. Sorry for your loss.
Guess I will either:
1) Have to collect the debt the old fashioned way
2) wait until online poker becomes legal
and let the forums know who this guy is...
?
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:11 PM
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Guess I will either:
1) Have to collect the debt the old fashioned way
2) wait until online poker becomes legal
and let the forums know who this guy is...
?
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I seriously doubt that even if online poker was legal, or if you made up a "contract" for a staking arrangement in Las Vegas for B & M play, that any court would enforce it.
theben
11-01-2005, 08:11 PM
"I have his name, know what school he attended last year, address as of a couple months ago (which may or may not be current), "
i think you know what you must do
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There is no way it will hold up...
It undoubtedly will violate many Uniform Commercial Code contract law statutes that will nullify it.
Good luck
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There are a multitude of reasons why this contract will almost certainly not hold up. Sorry for your loss.
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I wouldn't even be able to take it to small claims court ?doh
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:13 PM
I'm actually confused by what you mean when you say "stake." Usually when someone stakes a player and they lose, they owe nothing, and you're just collecting if they win. Did you just "lend" him the money, and want it paid back?
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"I have his name, know what school he attended last year, address as of a couple months ago (which may or may not be current), "
i think you know what you must do
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hoped it wouldn't have to get to that
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I'm actually confused by what you mean when you say "stake." Usually when someone stakes a player and they lose, they owe nothing, and you're just collecting if they win. Did you just "lend" him the money, and want it paid back?
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It was, in essence, lent- to be paid back with $Y return. All of which was made clear in the contract
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:16 PM
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I'm actually confused by what you mean when you say "stake." Usually when someone stakes a player and they lose, they owe nothing, and you're just collecting if they win. Did you just "lend" him the money, and want it paid back?
[/ QUOTE ]
It was, in essence, lent- to be paid back with $Y return. All of which was made clear in the contract
[/ QUOTE ]
Was the $Y return determined by the stakee's results in gambling, or was it just a static number?
addickt
11-01-2005, 08:18 PM
You are wasting your time.. Take it as lesson learned...
The "old fashioned" way likely wont work either.. You will just wind up with an unenforceable contract and some criminal charges as well..
How much money are you talking?
Also, IM not trying to be a butthole, but why would you stake someone that you barely know? Especially when you werent even aware that the contract was likely never enforceable..
If there was no Exact Amount listed to be repaid, it lasted over 1 year or was over 1,000 it had to be signed.
Also, it couldnt involve any illegal activity, which it likely does.
Sorry for the bad news
XxGodJrxX
11-01-2005, 08:18 PM
I don't see why this can't be enforced in a small claims court. Personally, I would kidnap one of his relatives and send fingers to him in the mail until he pays, but not everybody is into doing things right . /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:24 PM
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I don't see why this can't be enforced in a small claims court. Personally, I would kidnap one of his relatives and send fingers to him in the mail until he pays, but not everybody is into doing things right . /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
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A small claims court operates under the same contract law that regular court does...
Edit: What state are you located in? What state is your stakee located in? Where was this contract signed/executed? Was it signed/executed?
XxGodJrxX
11-01-2005, 08:29 PM
I am certainly not a lawyer (yet at least), but the OP wrote that he lent somebody money that was to be paid back plus winnings. If the guy signed this, I don't see why the OP wouldn't be able to at least get his money back. Can somebody explain to me why this contract wouldn't hold up?
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:35 PM
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I am certainly not a lawyer (yet at least), but the OP wrote that he lent somebody money that was to be paid back plus winnings. If the guy signed this, I don't see why the OP wouldn't be able to at least get his money back. Can somebody explain to me why this contract wouldn't hold up?
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Eh, we need more information before anyone can give an informed, educated answer (the questions that I have posted thus far). However, it is unlikely that this is enforceable for any number of reasons, including but not limited to those reasons that addickt has already mentioned. But we really need to know the terms of the contract, what the damn thing actually says, whether/where it was actually signed and executed, whether there was consideration, what jurisidction this took place in, etc. etc. etc.
Rasputin
11-01-2005, 08:35 PM
Why do people keep saying online poker is illegal? Was there some legislation I haven't heard of?
Adam22
11-01-2005, 08:41 PM
it's time to get physical, i will gladly accept the contract.
jman220
11-01-2005, 08:44 PM
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Why do people keep saying online poker is illegal? Was there some legislation I haven't heard of?
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Its not so much a question of legality as the fact that it is a contract based on gambling and historically, the courts of this country have been loathe to enforce those.
GrannyMae
11-01-2005, 09:27 PM
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Why do people keep saying online poker is illegal? Was there some legislation I haven't heard of?
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Its not so much a question of legality as the fact that it is a contract based on gambling and historically, the courts of this country have been loathe to enforce those.
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overseas gaming at that. therefore, no jurisdiction.
if the signed contract reads as a loan only, small claims would work, but may not be worth it.
if the contract mentions poker, fuggedabout it. your cash is gone.
Cry Me A River
11-01-2005, 11:10 PM
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It was, in essence, lent- to be paid back with $Y return.
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What interest were you charging him?
Before ya go getting the courts on his ass, you might want to look up the term "usury" and make sure YOU'RE not the one with potential legal consequences...
SeanSkill
11-02-2005, 12:12 AM
Your current contract may not be legal, however should you succesfuly sue in small claims court you would have a collectable debt. This debt can be collected legally and will last for 10 year's. It is a long process but if it is unlikely that the debtor will show up for court you will win by default. Ten years is what it is in Minnesota anyway and it costs $55.00 which is not that much to convert the debt to a legal one if your succesful.
FWIW
27offsuit
11-02-2005, 12:24 AM
"Set it....and forget it."
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I'm actually confused by what you mean when you say "stake." Usually when someone stakes a player and they lose, they owe nothing, and you're just collecting if they win. Did you just "lend" him the money, and want it paid back?
[/ QUOTE ]
It was, in essence, lent- to be paid back with $Y return. All of which was made clear in the contract
[/ QUOTE ]
Was the $Y return determined by the stakee's results in gambling, or was it just a static number?
[/ QUOTE ]
static
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You are wasting your time.. Take it as lesson learned...
The "old fashioned" way likely wont work either.. You will just wind up with an unenforceable contract and some criminal charges as well..
How much money are you talking?
Also, IM not trying to be a butthole, but why would you stake someone that you barely know? Especially when you werent even aware that the contract was likely never enforceable..
If there was no Exact Amount listed to be repaid, it lasted over 1 year or was over 1,000 it had to be signed.
Also, it couldnt involve any illegal activity, which it likely does.
Sorry for the bad news
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under 1.5k. Which was a LOT back then. Now it's still a decent amount, but not mind blowing.
I was a n00b looking for the fast track. I would also get lessons out of the deal, plus a set return of like 25%.
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I don't see why this can't be enforced in a small claims court. Personally, I would kidnap one of his relatives and send fingers to him in the mail until he pays, but not everybody is into doing things right . /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
A small claims court operates under the same contract law that regular court does...
Edit: What state are you located in? What state is your stakee located in? Where was this contract signed/executed? Was it signed/executed?
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both in Washington. Written contract was made over 2+2 via PM
TheHammer24
11-02-2005, 02:22 AM
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I don't see why this can't be enforced in a small claims court. Personally, I would kidnap one of his relatives and send fingers to him in the mail until he pays, but not everybody is into doing things right . /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
A small claims court operates under the same contract law that regular court does...
Edit: What state are you located in? What state is your stakee located in? Where was this contract signed/executed? Was it signed/executed?
[/ QUOTE ]
both in Washington. Written contract was made over 2+2 via PM
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Doh! What were you thinking?
I'm still not convinced u have no chance in small claims court. If X agrees to pay Y N dolllars, and in was contractual, it should hold up. The fact that its PM is pretty weak, but I would try to get your money...
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I am certainly not a lawyer (yet at least), but the OP wrote that he lent somebody money that was to be paid back plus winnings. If the guy signed this, I don't see why the OP wouldn't be able to at least get his money back. Can somebody explain to me why this contract wouldn't hold up?
[/ QUOTE ]
Eh, we need more information before anyone can give an informed, educated answer (the questions that I have posted thus far). However, it is unlikely that this is enforceable for any number of reasons, including but not limited to those reasons that addickt has already mentioned. But we really need to know the terms of the contract, what the damn thing actually says, whether/where it was actually signed and executed, whether there was consideration, what jurisidction this took place in, etc. etc. etc.
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parts of the contract: "The terms of our agreement were as follows: $1300 + AIM "lesson/discussion".... if so and you agree to the terms of the agreements plus another $300, for a total of $1600- respond and let me know."
he replies "hey reef, ...your terms sound fine with me."
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These are just small bits of the whole thing, but it's all in my PM box. There is also a read receipt and his school email address. I also had access to his poker account for the couple of months he kept in touch. I took screenshots and that is how I have his address.
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Even though I did not set a specific date for payment, he broke the contract by not paying back in the increments included. Also, by not talking over aim
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Why do people keep saying online poker is illegal? Was there some legislation I haven't heard of?
[/ QUOTE ]
Its not so much a question of legality as the fact that it is a contract based on gambling and historically, the courts of this country have been loathe to enforce those.
[/ QUOTE ]
overseas gaming at that. therefore, no jurisdiction.
if the signed contract reads as a loan only, small claims would work, but may not be worth it.
if the contract mentions poker, fuggedabout it. your cash is gone.
[/ QUOTE ]
it mentions that HE is a poker player. There is no mention of me getting any % of his profit. Just flat amount (with a few other conditions)
phish
11-02-2005, 02:41 AM
Do you realize how much money has been lost by people making loans or staking other players at a casino? Take you 1300 loss as a not-too-expensive lesson and NEVER lend or stake again. If these guys were really that good, they wouldn't need your money. And if they suck, then they would never be able to pay you back anyway.
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Take you 1300 loss as a not-too-expensive lesson and NEVER lend or stake again.
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This is either a fluke guess or you know something I don't
Vavavoom
11-02-2005, 04:54 AM
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Take you 1300 loss as a not-too-expensive lesson and NEVER lend or stake again.
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This is either a fluke guess or you know something I don't
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I would say its not a guess as U have it on a PM from earlier in the thread.....
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Take you 1300 loss as a not-too-expensive lesson and NEVER lend or stake again.
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This is either a fluke guess or you know something I don't
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I would say its not a guess as U have it on a PM from earlier in the thread.....
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lololol. ok, I seriously need to get some sleep
jman220
11-02-2005, 03:16 PM
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bump
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Lol, what was the point of bumping this? 33 replies not enough?
UATrewqaz
11-02-2005, 04:31 PM
The threat of legal action is usually as good as the legal action itself.
If a lawyer sent him a notice of an intent to sue or osmething should he not pay up that might spur a payment.
Make him sleep wit da fishes.
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bump
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Lol, what was the point of bumping this? 33 replies not enough?
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I answered people's questions. I'm not sure that they saw it since I replied at 2 am.
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