$55... Bleh...

[bigt439]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

SB (t855)
Hero (t885)
UTG (t2080)
UTG+1 (t1080)
MP1 (t895)
MP2 (t1235)
MP3 (t930)
CO (t1255)
Button (t785)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls t30, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t90) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets t30</font>, Hero calls t30, UTG+1 calls t30.

Turn: (t180) 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets t150</font>, Hero?

This hand bothers me, mainly because I don't think it should.

[tigerite]

Folds. I might have raised the flop, but here I just let it go.

[bigt439]

[ QUOTE ]
Folds. I might have raised the flop, but here I just let it go.

[/ QUOTE ]

3 nut outs, 9 outs to a huge hand, 5 outs that are likely good, and position? I'm not saying you're wrong, I actually think fold might be the best play, I'm just trying to convince myself compeltely one way or the other.

[RobGW]

Bleh is right. You have just enough outs to call this based on pot odds alone. Include implied odds and you can call if you want. I dont really see UTG+1 getting frisky. I really dont see SB folding to a raise either. You could call the 150 and see what happens. Folding is also a good option. I think it depends on how you feel about gambling for the big stack and dealing with the loss of 150 chips when you miss vs just folding and finding another spot. I'd call here but its marginal. I personally like having the big stack and will gamble to get it. If I miss I wont give up and still feel I can get back into it.

[inyaface]

I typed out an answer and then realised I really don't know how to play this. I think fold call and push are all decent lines. I need to think about this more because I'm actually kind of confused... /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[ChrisV]

I'd call. Push is OK too, but it's a bit of a nuclear option with only one card to come. If SB has a hand that won't call the push, you may well get an opportunity to take the pot off him on the river.

Fold is crazy. Give SB something like QT and you're looking at 17 outs, plus the chance you already have the best hand. I think UTG+1 called speculatively and I don't think he's calling here.

[durron597]

Do you have any evidence that he might fold a weak ten? If yes then I would push, if no then I would call.

[bigt439]

[ QUOTE ]
Do you have any evidence that he might fold a weak ten? If yes then I would push, if no then I would call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Remember there's a guy behind me who cold called the flop after limping in, so he has a kind of weird range. If this guy isn't behind me I'm pretty sure I either have to call or push (in that scenario I would prefer calling). Folding hu with that many outs and the position to extract (i.e. good implied odds) is kind of wack I think, but this guy behind changed the situation significantly enough to potentially alter my play.

Seems like everyone's a little stumped. We'll send her through the front page one more time.

[Rduke55]

As weak as this sounds I call this because of the guy behind me. If you hit one of your big cards you probably have a hand that would do well against 2 opponents. The guy behind you may not come along anyways.

[downtown]

I would call here. I wouldn't count the guy calling behind you on the flop to a t30 bet any different than checking behind. If he pushes or something you can safely fold, unless he is make-a-play-tastic. Otherwise you're going to get to act in position on the river, there are about a million scare cards for the initial bettor if he has a T, and did I mention you get to act in position on the river? I like a call.

[pineapple888]

Either villain could have anything here.

But you have to think you're behind at the moment.

Lots of outs. But many/most of your outs could be bad.

There is simply not enough information to decide here.

I guess I fold against two villains. The pot's getting too big, so there's too much chance that I hit and go broke (reverse implied odds), and I have little invested in the pot at the moment.

I can't really argue with a call or a raise. I don't want to play hands unless I feel like I have an edge, but that's just me.

[kyro]

Call? You really don't seem to have much FE but you've got plenty of outs here. UTG+1 behind you causes a problem or two, but I really don't see how that should affect your decision all that much. Anyways, I think it's a pretty standard call.

[psyduck]

Yeah it's a standard call here, you have plenty of outs and implied ooods.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]

I can't really argue with a call or a raise. I don't want to play hands unless I feel like I have an edge, but that's just me.

[/ QUOTE ]

There is a huge difference between difficult spots with difficult decisions and spots that are -EV.

[pineapple888]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I can't really argue with a call or a raise. I don't want to play hands unless I feel like I have an edge, but that's just me.

[/ QUOTE ]

There is a huge difference between difficult spots with difficult decisions and spots that are -EV.

[/ QUOTE ]

So what's your point? I'm not worried about difficult decisions. I don't think I'm +EV here, for the reasons I stated, so I don't play.

[pineapple888]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah it's a standard call here, you have plenty of outs and implied ooods.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why does everyone think you have such great implied odds? A nine or a spade is pretty obvious, and you might still be behind. An 8 leaves you very far from the nuts. Maybe an 8 against an overpair specifically, kind of unlikely.

I can't see anything but reverse implied odds here.

[pineapple888]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yeah it's a standard call here, you have plenty of outs and implied ooods.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why does everyone think you have such great implied odds? A nine or a spade is pretty obvious, and you might still be behind. An 8 leaves you very far from the nuts. Maybe an 8 against an overpair specifically, kind of unlikely.

I can't see anything but reverse implied odds here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oops, forgot about the inside straight. Maybe you get paid off there.

Tough question IMO, good one to post.

An argument can be made for just about any play here but I think I like calling best, folding a close second best and raising least. I suspect SB has a real hand that he won't let go and you can't be sure to lose the other guy. Having said that the other guy will usually fold and then you do have position in addition to your outs and pot odds.

Part of the case for folding on the other hand is that you're left with so few chips here after calling the 150 which sucks plus you could hit an "out" and lose your stack as a result which folding avoids and there's certainly comething to be said for that.

Imagine, having to "play poker" in a 55 sng.

In situations like this where it's tough to find an absolute correct play you just have to trust your instincts and make the play that seems best at the time. If your a good player then your poker instincts are also good and you will will do just fine. That's what playing poker is all about.

[bigt439]

I think I've concluded that it doesn't matter a whole lot what I do. Folding, calling, and pushing (my least favorite without a read) all seem reasonable.

I called, UTG+1 pushed and we both folded (I think he's pretty huge there, not that it really matters). I just felt dumb calling off a relatively big bet and not being able to even see the river, but I don't think UTG+1 pushes over that much, just unlucky.