View Full Version : The hand where kyro wears a skirt
Pahty Pokah $55
UTG is a 2p2er. Button was a multi-tabler, but (and I can't put my finger on WHY exactly), I wasn't too impressed with the little I saw. I'm still trying to put him on a range. BB has been hitting hands left and right and talking it up a lot.
Blinds are 100/200. UTG pushes for 1300ish. Button pushes for 2000ish. I have 1600ish and TT in the SB. BB behind me has half the chips in play.
Who calls. Who folds. How close is it. If it's a call, what's the best you'd fold. If it's a fold, what's the worst you'd call?
Hugs and kisses!
EDIT: 4 PEOPLE LEFT
rbear
10-28-2005, 02:18 AM
10 10, I fold....
Don't think it's real great 3 way...
With only my BB in the middle, I call KK and AA... maybe that's weak tight, but I think these are the only hands that really have great 3 way odds /images/graemlins/grin.gif
splashpot
10-28-2005, 02:19 AM
How many are left? Just you 4? Then I fold pretty easily. I'd only call AA/KK if this is bubble.
tom441lbk
10-28-2005, 02:20 AM
[ QUOTE ]
How many are left? Just you 4? Then I fold pretty easily. I'd only call AA/KK if this is bubble.
[/ QUOTE ]
yeah, aa/kk, maybe qq if i was feeling frisky
mlagoo
10-28-2005, 02:21 AM
You don't say how many people are remaining =/
Regardless, pretty sure I fold here. UTGs range isnt all that large, probably 77+, AJ+ or so. Button's range should be even tighter, probably 99+, AQ+ (my range would be even tighter here, but you said you werent impressed... I dunno).
I think TT is good fairly rarely here, and I am in acceptable shape with 8xBB and the button next hand. TT is probably the cutoff though. I think I call with JJ and AK, and I know I call with QQ+.
edit: if this is the bubble, I obviously fold AK and QQ.
Just to add discussion, not because I'm advocating a call, because I'm sure it's really close...
But the 2p2er pushes. He has a very wide range, one that I surely crush.
Then this other yeehaw pushes over the top of him. I am also sure that he crushes UTGs range.
I only don't make money if UTG beats Button and Button beats me. How often does this happen?
jeffraider
10-28-2005, 02:24 AM
Hehe we already talked about what my pushing standards are UTG with 1300 at blinds of 100/200, so I'm folding pretty quickly here knowing UTG is a 2+2er. With the added complication of a call/push behind him I think TT looks no good here and I think I'd need KK/AA to call here, but I might be out to lunch. I think I'd be inclined to muck AK too, honestly. No matter what the result of this hand barring an unlikely split, you're going to be in the money or have 1K more chips than the short stack.
Interesting hand though, I wonder how it would feel like if UTG was a maniac. Probably need QQ+ to call.
mlagoo
10-28-2005, 02:24 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Just to add discussion, not because I'm advocating a call, because I'm sure it's really close...
But the 2p2er pushes. He has a very wide range, one that I surely crush.
Then this other yeehaw pushes over the top of him. I am also sure that he crushes UTGs range.
I only don't make money if UTG beats Button and Button beats me. How often does this happen?
[/ QUOTE ]
I really don't think UTGs range is that wide considering your read on the BB. I know that I'm not in a habit of pushing into a big stack BB that has been involved in a lot of pots from UTG with a mediocre holding.
rbear
10-28-2005, 02:26 AM
uh, you lose money if the button beats you... period, guess i don't really understand what you're sayin... 10 10 3 way, gotta expect at least 2 overcards out of the two of them... maybe 3, maybe overpair... not worth the risk to me! how many left ?!?!?!?!?!
I am apparently way too pushbottyess on the bubble. And I thought I had toned it down considerably /images/graemlins/frown.gif
[ QUOTE ]
uh, you lose money if the button beats you... period, guess i don't really understand what you're sayin... 10 10 3 way, gotta expect at least 2 overcards out of the two of them... maybe 3, maybe overpair... not worth the risk to me! how many left ?!?!?!?!?!
[/ QUOTE ]
Button wins the hand. I have more chips than UTG so I get paid for 3rd place. This is what I mean.
I edited original post. 4 left.
splashpot
10-28-2005, 02:28 AM
[ QUOTE ]
uh, you lose money if the button beats you... period, guess i don't really understand what you're sayin... 10 10 3 way, gotta expect at least 2 overcards out of the two of them... maybe 3, maybe overpair... not worth the risk to me! how many left ?!?!?!?!?!
[/ QUOTE ]
If the button beats Hero and the button beats UTG, UTG comes in 4th, Hero gets 3rd.
77+ and AJ+ for UTG's range? Are you on drugs?
On button here i think 99+ and AQ+ is the perfect calling range.
I fold anything under QQ here and probabally even AK. Blinds are pretty small.
My thoughts:
UTG should be pushing
KJ+, A7+, 55+
Button should be calling:
99+ AJ+
SB calls QQ+ maybe AK
BB calls 1010+ AQ+
jeffraider
10-28-2005, 02:29 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I am apparently way too pushbottyess on the bubble. And I thought I had toned it down considerably /images/graemlins/frown.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Maybe dude UTG's range is probably 99+, AQ+.
jgunnip
10-28-2005, 02:30 AM
I'm folding since I think the times you call and make the money are going to be less than the times you fold and make the money. Obvioulsy, when you win you will have a nice stack, but then on the other hand, when you survive, you'll be getting 3rd a majority of the time.
mlagoo
10-28-2005, 02:30 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I am apparently way too pushbottyess on the bubble. And I thought I had toned it down considerably /images/graemlins/frown.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
well you hadnt specified that this was the bubble =/
Four-handed, his range probably loosens up a bit... but I know when I am pushbotting on the bubble, my decisions are based heavily on who is in the BB at the time, and what I think their calling range would be. If I'm pushing with a marginal holding, it's not going to be into the BB that is mostly likely to call me.
OTOH, if its 4-handed, we can probably reasonably both ranges are a bit wider. Probably something like 44+, A9+ for UTG, and 88+, AJ+ for Button. I still think it's a fold. And I still call with QQ+ only on the bubble.
mlagoo
10-28-2005, 02:31 AM
[ QUOTE ]
77+ and AJ+ for UTG's range? Are you on drugs?
[/ QUOTE ]
I didn't know we were on the bubble when I made my post =(
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I am apparently way too pushbottyess on the bubble. And I thought I had toned it down considerably /images/graemlins/frown.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Maybe dude UTG's range is probably 99+, AQ+.
[/ QUOTE ]
This has GOT to be wrong. I may be a bit too maniacal when getting shortstacked, but you are basically resigning yourself to being blinded out if you are only playing this range UTG>
rbear
10-28-2005, 02:33 AM
Thanks for clarifying that... and now it seems like a 1st or third situation, which would make it read dependant to me... Good thought provoking post!
johnnybeef
10-28-2005, 02:33 AM
Ill bet you $200 that your boys don't win the Big 10
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for clarifying that... and now it seems like a 1st or third situation, which would make it read dependant to me... Good thought provoking post!
[/ QUOTE ]
Thought-provoking posts SUCK. It means I actually had to do an ounce of thinking which is the last thing I want to do when playing SNGs.
jeffraider
10-28-2005, 02:34 AM
Nah son because I get those blinds back by being properly maniacal in late positions. I may push as weak as 77 here or AJ but that's the absolute line. 1300 chips is not desperate here at all.
[ QUOTE ]
Ill bet you $200 that your boys don't win the Big 10
[/ QUOTE ]
Outright or BCS bid? If it's outright, I won't take it because too many things need to happen. If it's just the BCS bid, I'll put some money, but not $200. I shouldn't even be playing the $55s with my meager BR as it is /images/graemlins/blush.gif
rbear
10-28-2005, 02:35 AM
lol... still finding my way to the robotic multi table mode, for now, it helps people like me.. thanks
It's not desperate by any means, but your original range was <10% of starting hands. In his position, I gotta think I'm pushing A7+/KJ+/66+.
But I am rusty and haven't played for a while. I just think that if you're getting top hands, you need to go with them.
I have to hit the hay so if I don't answer any direct questions in this thread, sorry!
To spice this up a little(or maybe not)
UTG's range is
44+
A5s+
KJs+
QJs+
Reasons: Have only played 2 hands in the whole tournament so far. #1. AJ push gets called by A6. #2. AQ push gets called by A7.
UTG is an idiot and will limp/call anything so you NEED to open steal as much as possible because stealing when in the Small blind will never be an option.
SB knows who you are and knows when to call and when not to.
Button is pretty tight and will only call with top hands.
johnnybeef
10-28-2005, 02:43 AM
eh, you may get a bcs bid, but it wont be automatic....i think msu at home may be too tough a game for your boys.
bennies
10-28-2005, 12:08 PM
TT is as good as AQs, it's a top 4% hand. Hero is not short stacked and surely TT is well ahead of Utg's range. I'd call. Out of 6 possible scenarios only one really sucks, that is when UTG beats Button beats Hero.
TT-AQ is probably the cutoff for me though.
mlagoo
10-28-2005, 01:25 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Out of 6 possible scenarios only one really sucks, that is when UTG beats Button beats Hero.
[/ QUOTE ]
for some reason i wasn't understanding this last night, this makes absolute sense. i guess it was just too late.
im still not positive about TT. I know I'm calling AK and JJ+, and I know I'm folding AQ- and 99-. TT is freakin iffy. I think I fold it /images/graemlins/blush.gif.
UTG had 88.
Button had AKs
I would have nearly tripled up /images/graemlins/frown.gif
I think TT is really on the fence though...in hindsight, I call JJ-AA and AK.
But that did make me mad.
pooh74
10-28-2005, 03:01 PM
[ QUOTE ]
UTG had 88.
Button had AKs
in hindsight, I call JJ-AA and AK.
[/ QUOTE ]
my range here too
The Yugoslavian
10-28-2005, 03:19 PM
I think it's a somewhat easy call.
If UTG had 301 more chips then it's a very easy fold.
Yugoslav
I assume baseless hand ranges.
Looks like TT is a fold:
equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 29.2245 % 28.44% 00.79% { TT }
Hand 2: 29.4032 % 28.05% 01.35% { 77+, ATs+, ATo+ }
Hand 3: 41.3723 % 39.82% 01.56% { 99+, AQs+, AKo }
JJ's +cEV but probably not +EV:
equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 35.2039 % 34.29% 00.91% { JJ }
Hand 2: 27.1247 % 25.79% 01.34% { 77+, ATs+, ATo+ }
Hand 3: 37.6714 % 36.08% 01.59% { 99+, AQs+, AKo }
My p-stove's doing these slowly, so I'm gonna leave out QQ and just assume it's a call.
AKs's a fold:
equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 32.2464 % 26.38% 05.87% { AKs }
Hand 2: 27.6454 % 25.38% 02.26% { 77+, ATs+, ATo+ }
Hand 3: 40.1082 % 35.45% 04.66% { 99+, AQs+, AKo }
MegaBet
10-28-2005, 04:09 PM
easy fold
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