oly71
10-27-2005, 06:38 PM
I was just playing on a fairly typical afternoon Party table (30% VP$IP avg, 5% PFR avg) with the following hand. The first raiser is sLP pre-flop and fairly passive post flop, the BB is tight/typical pre-flop, aggr post flop (not that that really mattered based on my draw, I think). The real questions are were the calls mathmatically correct?
Pre-flop, I believe I have to play and reraise, the cap is somewhat disconcerting but not too bad. On the flop, the action gets to me with the pot laying me ~10:1. I have a gutshot draw to the nuts a backdoor nut flush draw and two overcards (~8.5 outs if you think the overcards are good, ~5.5 outs if you don't count the overcards). Good enough to call. Whoops, another raise and a reraise and it's back to me with the pot laying 14:1 (15:1 if the other two call the cap). Better odds than before but now it's getting ugly. The turn card gives me 7 full outs for the nut flush (T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif and 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif could make someone 4 of a kind) plus 3 outs for the nut straight (J/images/graemlins/heart.gif makes a heart flush). I'm fully committed at this point. It's 17:1 to call the first turn bet to me (gotta do it), ~11:1 for the 2nd turn bet and 27:1 the last time around. Alas, none of the draws hit and I fold the river because I'm surely beat by one of the two players that's willing to bet/checkraise/cap every street.
So, was this a correctly played hand that missed its draw, or should I have been including potential (likely?) raises behind me when considering my calls?
Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)
Preflop: Hero is CO with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
[color=#666666]1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, [color=#666666]1 fold</font>, [color=#CC3333]MP1 raises</font>, [color=#666666]2 folds</font>, [color=#CC3333]Hero 3-bets</font>, [color=#666666]2 folds</font>, [color=#CC3333]BB caps</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero calls.
Flop: (16.50 SB) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif [color=#0000FF](4 players)</font>
[color=#CC3333]BB bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, [color=#CC3333]MP1 raises</font>, Hero calls, [color=#CC3333]BB 3-bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, [color=#CC3333]MP1 caps</font>, Hero calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.
Turn: (16.25 BB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif [color=#0000FF](4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, [color=#CC3333]MP1 bets</font>, Hero calls, [color=#CC3333]BB raises</font>, UTG+1 folds, [color=#CC3333]MP1 3-bets</font>, Hero calls, [color=#CC3333]BB caps</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls.
River: (28.25 BB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif [color=#0000FF](3 players)</font>
[color=#CC3333]BB bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero folds.
Final Pot: 30.25 BB
Pre-flop, I believe I have to play and reraise, the cap is somewhat disconcerting but not too bad. On the flop, the action gets to me with the pot laying me ~10:1. I have a gutshot draw to the nuts a backdoor nut flush draw and two overcards (~8.5 outs if you think the overcards are good, ~5.5 outs if you don't count the overcards). Good enough to call. Whoops, another raise and a reraise and it's back to me with the pot laying 14:1 (15:1 if the other two call the cap). Better odds than before but now it's getting ugly. The turn card gives me 7 full outs for the nut flush (T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif and 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif could make someone 4 of a kind) plus 3 outs for the nut straight (J/images/graemlins/heart.gif makes a heart flush). I'm fully committed at this point. It's 17:1 to call the first turn bet to me (gotta do it), ~11:1 for the 2nd turn bet and 27:1 the last time around. Alas, none of the draws hit and I fold the river because I'm surely beat by one of the two players that's willing to bet/checkraise/cap every street.
So, was this a correctly played hand that missed its draw, or should I have been including potential (likely?) raises behind me when considering my calls?
Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)
Preflop: Hero is CO with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
[color=#666666]1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, [color=#666666]1 fold</font>, [color=#CC3333]MP1 raises</font>, [color=#666666]2 folds</font>, [color=#CC3333]Hero 3-bets</font>, [color=#666666]2 folds</font>, [color=#CC3333]BB caps</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero calls.
Flop: (16.50 SB) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif [color=#0000FF](4 players)</font>
[color=#CC3333]BB bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, [color=#CC3333]MP1 raises</font>, Hero calls, [color=#CC3333]BB 3-bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, [color=#CC3333]MP1 caps</font>, Hero calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.
Turn: (16.25 BB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif [color=#0000FF](4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, [color=#CC3333]MP1 bets</font>, Hero calls, [color=#CC3333]BB raises</font>, UTG+1 folds, [color=#CC3333]MP1 3-bets</font>, Hero calls, [color=#CC3333]BB caps</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls.
River: (28.25 BB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif [color=#0000FF](3 players)</font>
[color=#CC3333]BB bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero folds.
Final Pot: 30.25 BB