Weak-Tight?

[Warder]

I don't really know what to think about this hand. This is my first orbit at the table. I initially thought I was beat by a set. I was playing 4 tables so I really couldn't think about the hand as long as I wanted. But now that I look at it. I don't think a set of 2s would raise on such a dry flop. He possibly limped a higher pair being that it was folded around to him, but I doubt that also. And I don't see 22 bettin so strong on the turn after filling up. After this hand I didn't see him show down or bet big in any pots that weren't winners.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ Hero (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx (http://www.zerodivide.cx/converter)

MP ($10.77)
CO ($102.75)
Button ($56.93)
SB ($137.70)
Hero ($49.50)
UTG ($17)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. SB posts a blind of $0.25.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB (poster) completes, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $1.75</font>, CO calls $1.75, SB folds.

Flop: ($5) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $4</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises to $10</font>, Hero calls $6.

Turn: ($25) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets $20</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $45

Those are tough spots to be in. People will play Top pair that way too, especially heads up.

You can fold it without losing too much sleep, but you shouldn't without a good feel for what the opponent is doing.

[FreakDaddy]

I agree with your thought process, and there's good possibility you're ahead. It's not a big rasie on the flop though, so a set isn't out of the question, but since villian has position, I think a call with a set it more optimal. Without a read though I don't think I commit all my chips with a pair of tens here. Check/folding is fine.

[Warder]

I just dont' see how I could have been beat now.... if he knows I have a big pair and reraises me then it's gonna slow me down.
And with flopped set on a perfect board I cant' see any other line but calling the flop and then calling or raising the turn.
If he did have a set he played it about as badly as he could have. And from other action I saw later on he's def not limping a big pair.

[BobboFitos]

[ QUOTE ]
Flop: ($5) 9, 4, 2 (3 players)
Hero bets $4, CO raises to $10, Hero calls $6.

Turn: ($25) 4 (3 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $20, Hero folds.


[/ QUOTE ]

Put him on 45 eh?

Id consider betting less on the flop -

And not folding the turn, I'd probably check/push.

[Warder]

I'm really thinking he has a hand like KJd here....

I think you played it fine. You raised preflop and by calling his flop raise, you're announcing a big hand. I play a set like this (actually harder) everytime against someone whom I think has an overpair. After all, he barely did more than a miniraise on the flop, and then bet 4/5 the pot on the turn. That's not that fast especially against someone who probably has an overpair. He would have to be a maniac to be playing just top pair this way. Without a read that says he's a maniac, I fold.

By the way, he cold colded your preflop raise, so it seems entirely possible to me that he might even have JJ or QQ here. Maybe he thought you had AK and wanted to see the flop before putting too much into the pot. And even if he has Kd Jd, he's still got a ton of outs and position on you.

Either way, I don't see too much that you're beating here except for a donk hand being overplayed by a donk. With no reads, Fold.

Edit: Just realized Hero raised from the BB and that Villain limped in CO. So JJ and QQ would seem less likely. I still think you're beat and should fold though.

[PinkSteel]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm really thinking he has a hand like KJd here....

[/ QUOTE ]

You were the preflop raiser and led a dry flop. Wouldn't raising your flop bet with KJs be complete suicide? At the very least he may be dominated. I don't play 6-max but that would seem like spewing.

[BobboFitos]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm really thinking he has a hand like KJd here....

[/ QUOTE ]

i dont think he has that, but if you think that, why'd you fold?

[Warder]

I don't understand why you would play 22 this fast on a 249 board when you're pretty sure the opponent has an overpair. What does that accomplish besides slowing the opponent down. Like I said I'm about 100% sure he doesn't have a bigger pair.
I think he raised the flop to test me (wasn't a very large raise) and then improved on the turn and now that I've showed weakness by calling his raise and checking the turn he's going to commit his stack. But then again maybe I've giving $50 NL players a little too much credit to make smart decisions

[Big_Jim]

[ QUOTE ]
You were the preflop raiser and led a dry flop. Wouldn't raising your flop bet with KJs be complete suicide?

[/ QUOTE ]

Nah. PFR folds LOTS of hands to that raise.

[colehard]

Why wouldn't it be better to lead the turn and fold to a raise? By checking the turn it looks like we have a missed AK and they are value betting their T9.

If we are folding the turn after showing weakness and checking then why not fold the flop reraise?

After the flop reraise, are we expecting them to check the turn down?

I would expect to see a 9 alot more of the time than a set.

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand why you would play 22 this fast on a 249 board when you're pretty sure the opponent has an overpair. What does that accomplish besides slowing the opponent down. Like I said I'm about 100% sure he doesn't have a bigger pair.
I think he raised the flop to test me (wasn't a very large raise) and then improved on the turn and now that I've showed weakness by calling his raise and checking the turn he's going to commit his stack. But then again maybe I've giving $50 NL players a little too much credit to make smart decisions

[/ QUOTE ]


Well, I'd raise because 90% of SSNL players aren't folding an overpair under any circomstances but certainly not on this "dry board." I raise because waiting till the turn to raise is a donk move that gives away your hand almost entirely to any one with a brain. I raise because it looks like top pair to your average SSNL and they will often reraise me. (Hell, look at how uncertain you are now. You WANTED to call that with your overpair. You almost did, because your average SSNL player HATES folding an overpair, especially after being the preflop raiser.)

But mainly, I raise because I like money, and I want to get more of it. I raise to build this pot and play for a big pot. In conclusion, I raise to get more money into the pot. But maybe I'm a simpleton.


Edit: I said I would play it FASTER. I raise that flop to $12 and bet 3/4 the pot on the turn.

[Warder]

bump