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View Full Version : leading into the raiser...


10-25-2005, 05:32 PM
It's a raised pot and you call from either big blind or middle position or wherever.

Ex 1: say your middle position w/ KQ and someone raises from late.

flop comes Kxx and you bet into raiser then he raises. Does that really help you out information wise? It seems like he either has AK AA or hell he could have QQ or JJ where you fold the best hand and waste a bet doing it. People seem to respect check raises more, or maybe they don't but i think they do. Wouldn't this give you more information? Which brings me to my next question. What hands should you bet into the raiser? It seems like if you only bet your monster hands (top two, sets, big draws etc...) your giving away too much information or is that bad thinking?? Whenever I do this it seems like the opp. never folds and always puts me to a decision. Thanks for your help

10-25-2005, 06:19 PM
I lead into the raiser sometimes (sometimes with air if I think the flop missed him, or he had a low to mid pp that didn't set) but usually only if I think that will cause him to fold (after all, I did the betting, he would assume I figured he would bet if checked to him, so why did he do that? then it would get him thinking maybe he wants me to raise him and if he don't have much of a hand, he won't feel as confident anymore).

During the 2+2 tourney, there was a hand I had where I had KQ, and was in the blind facing a late position raiser heads up. Flop came AK5 (or something of the like) and I bet into the raiser with my MPTK, he thought about it, then said right before folding (got my kicker beat?) and folded, and I showed him my hand.

I'd say it depends mostly on the player though on what the best line is. Good reads help out here, and sometimes aggressiveness wins pots, which is why having position is very important.

schwza
10-25-2005, 06:23 PM
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It seems like if you only bet your monster hands (top two, sets, big draws etc...) your giving away too much information or is that bad thinking?? Whenever I do this it seems like the opp. never folds and always puts me to a decision.

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that's good thinking in theory, but i've been ignoring it more and more lately. you're not going to play anyone enough times for them to get a beat on when you do and don't lead into the raiser, and most people aren't paying that much attention anyway.

i'd say to try to look at your own image. if you look like you splash around and bluff a lot, then villain probably won't fold to your bet, especially if it's a rag board where he at least has overs. if your image is more tight/normal, it might be better to c/r to at least get one bet. but i wouldn't put too much concern into varying your bet for such a specific situation. (but always c/r'ing good hands and betting bad ones in any situation is too readable).

illegit
10-25-2005, 06:40 PM
[ QUOTE ]
It's a raised pot and you call from either big blind or middle position or wherever.

Ex 1: say your middle position w/ KQ and someone raises from late.

flop comes Kxx and you bet into raiser then he raises. Does that really help you out information wise? It seems like he either has AK AA or hell he could have QQ or JJ where you fold the best hand and waste a bet doing it. People seem to respect check raises more, or maybe they don't but i think they do. Wouldn't this give you more information?

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Probably, but at higher cost. Check-raises are expensive when they fail. You don't get the information you want until you've already invested what is probably A LOT of chips.

10-26-2005, 12:49 AM
what information is there by leading into the raiser?? Do I put him on TPTK (online poker so no physical tells) everytime? Cuz it seems by when you say its cheaper that I should fold to a raise. And if i get called do i just give up? Or do i fire another bet because checking the turn is just giving the pot away it seems like.