View Full Version : work evaluation having to rate co-wokers ?
gorie
10-25-2005, 12:32 PM
every year at work we get this stupid "self evaluation" sheet we have to fill out, "what do you do" , "what do you enjoy about working here" , "what are new skills you've learned" blah blah. and a sheet to rate yourself on stupid things like attendance, efficiency, accuracy, blah blah, same stupid questions every year with the same stupid answers every year.
anyway - so this year we have a sheet added , asking us to rate our co-workers.
it lists everyones name, and there are about 10 different things to rate them on , ona scale of 1 - 10. like how well they do at their job, if they are trustworthy, etc.
i didn't read all of them , i just glanced at it and thought "wtf" as i was leaving for lunch, and now i'm kind of annoyed about the idea of having to rate other people.
is this weird or what ? it's stupid enough having to rate myself every year on this stupid thing.
i definitely don't feel right being asked to rate other people.
is this normal and common for the boss to ask employees to rate the people we work with ? am i weird for being somewhat offended by it and not wanting to do it ?
360 degree reviews are increasingly standard. You should make sure that your comments will be confidential.
DukeSucks
10-25-2005, 12:39 PM
More than likely they are trying to determine who is stealing from them. The other questions are just there to disguise their true intent.
I don't see how they could use other's opinions on you to judge your work.
Pyromaniac
10-25-2005, 12:39 PM
That sounds like something more appropriate for a college class..."rate the other students' projects"...than a job. what sort of place do you work in? /images/graemlins/frown.gif
"rate yourself" can, I guess, be a chance for self-reflection, but I'd be afraid that it simply becomes a tool for authority most often. Something like getting pulled into a police station without being charged and being told, "You know what you did wrong--so just tell us about it"... /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Hamish McBagpipe
10-25-2005, 12:40 PM
Sounds like total unadulterated BS to me. This is the kind of ridiculous crap that keeps me in business. They don't understand that most of us don't like being turned into rats, which is all it this kind of thing does.
It is just another way to pit the lifers against the new guys and the young against the old and the black against the white. Everything they do is to keep you in your place.
In solidarity, Hamish
IndieMatty
10-25-2005, 12:40 PM
[ QUOTE ]
360 degree reviews are increasingly standard. You should make sure that your comments will be confidential.
[/ QUOTE ]
That's what they are called here. This is our first year. I hate them.
gorie
10-25-2005, 12:41 PM
[ QUOTE ]
360 degree reviews are increasingly standard. You should make sure that your comments will be confidential.
[/ QUOTE ]
i don't think i am going to do it, i'll probalby just write "i think everyone here does a good job and i like everyone" or something. i think it's weird.
we work in a small company, stuff gets around way too easily. not to mention the boss is around everyone all day long working with us, and hovering over everyones shoulder as it is. he knows whats going on there and who does what. it just seems kind of a way to cause unnecessary drama to me.
if i want him to know what i think of someone i will tell him.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
360 degree reviews are increasingly standard. You should make sure that your comments will be confidential.
[/ QUOTE ]
i don't think i am going to do it, i'll probalby just write "i think everyone here does a good job and i like everyone" or something. i think it's weird.
we work in a small company, stuff gets around way too easily. not to mention the boss is around everyone all day long working with us, and hovering over everyones shoulder as it is. he knows whats going on there and who does what. it just seems kind of a way to cause unnecessary drama to me.
if i want him to know what i think of someone i will tell him.
[/ QUOTE ]
My first company was 20 people when I started. My second company had 8 people when I started. If the reviews are taken seriously and are confidential, then genuine, honest, reviews should be okay. Remember, if it's a small place, everyone already knows what everyone thinks of each other.
I always kick ass on my self-evals.
...if you grade yourself poorly - they can use it against you when it comes around for raises. You get what you expect... if you're too hard on yourself, then they feel they can give you what you tell them you deserve.
When I read your OP I was thinking, yet again, how weird large corporations can get. The HR folks keep puttin' on the "touchy-feely, we're here for you, you're the reason we're successful, blah blah yada yada yada" crap and then they find another way of being KGB, Gestapo.
Now, your next post says you're not in a large corp. Jeeze, "trickle-down" crap! (yeah, I know turds roll downhill, but I really hate to see this in smaller cos.)
/images/graemlins/mad.gif
Bluffoon
10-25-2005, 01:22 PM
The fact that the opinions of some of the lunatics I work with could end up in my personnel records is disturbing.
Shajen
10-25-2005, 01:31 PM
360 degree reviews?
WTF kind of new-aged E-speak BS is this?
Gorie, give them all 5s and yourself all 10s.
Fight the power.
http://rasterweb.net/raster/kids/images/madeline20a.jpg
I hate this kind of management/HR tool. In the past I've refused to participate in these types of things. I don't particularly like rating people or ratting on people. I'd probably approach it the same way that you mentioned Gorie.
(I actually have to review my boss and managers at my current job. They claim it is confidential)
ChipWrecked
10-25-2005, 01:39 PM
[ QUOTE ]
When I read your OP I was thinking, yet again, how weird large corporations can get. The HR folks keep puttin' on the "touchy-feely, we're here for you, you're the reason we're successful, blah blah yada yada yada" crap and then they find another way of being KGB, Gestapo.
Now, your next post says you're not in a large corp. Jeeze, "trickle-down" crap! (yeah, I know turds roll downhill, but I really hate to see this in smaller cos.)
/images/graemlins/mad.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
It's always easy to tell when our execs are back from another seminar by the new buzzword-babble they spout. I think these things are attended by large orgs. and small.
arod15
10-25-2005, 01:40 PM
It happens but not that often in workplace. Its a tough dillema but if its confidential rip those lazy NITS...
Aloysius
10-25-2005, 01:40 PM
[ QUOTE ]
If the reviews are taken seriously and are confidential, then genuine, honest, reviews should be okay. Remember, if it's a small place, everyone already knows what everyone thinks of each other.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think there's an important difference between what co-workers suspect you think about them, and what's on any sort of official record like a 360 review. Especially if the reviews are tied to performance boni etc.
The last time I participated in a 360 review (small PE shop 40 people) I went in with the goal of being honest, candid, and with an eye towards improving the company. I also trusted my manager, who conducted the review (it was an interview-style where he took notes).
However, I did not realize his assistant would be filing / reading all the reviews... needless to say this assistant was friends with one of my colleagues yada yada - and it ended up being incredibly annoying for me for a few months. Nothing I said was malicious - I was trying to be constructive.
Unless you are fairly high-up in the company with a real investment in your future there, looking to improve the company, I would personally recommend being as bland and neutral as possible in your reviews. Little upside with lots of potential downside.
MaxPower
10-25-2005, 01:44 PM
At most companies these reviews are a complete sham. For instance, I set my personal goals at the beginning of the year. When review time comes around I just change my goals to make sure that I accomplished them all. That way I still get my full bonus. Not exactly a very motivating system.
I spend 10 minutes with my manager going over it and then it is filed away never to be looked at again.
The way the whole thing is set up just negates the whole reason for having it. The main reason we have it is so the human resources people can prove that they are doing their job.
Do I sound jaded at all?
[ QUOTE ]
It's always easy to tell when our execs are back from another seminar by the new buzzword-babble they spout. I think these things are attended by large orgs. and small.
[/ QUOTE ]
I can confirm your suspicions about the big ones. I attended a couple. They're frequently put on by outfits that specialize in this crap or by the corp.'s HR types that paid big bucks to learn how to stage them.
They're always held at really neat sites with a lot of side bar entertainment. Everything is first class, i.e., $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
Max, you sound like my younger alter-ego!
/images/graemlins/grin.gif
pokerdirty
10-25-2005, 01:49 PM
this sounds like an opportunity to get the weird/annoying people fired /images/graemlins/grin.gif
Blarg
10-25-2005, 02:07 PM
This sounds like a race to the bottom. Be sure to degrade others before they degrade you, and help the company document reasons for firing the workers someone in management doesn't like, or with higher than average wages. I don't like this a bit. You're being asked to do management's dirty work for them. They already know who they're going to give raises or promotions or bonuses, and are very unlikely to want any of your input on that. However, they can get mileage out of competitive backstabbing and rumor mongering.
DrSavage
10-25-2005, 02:07 PM
I would never ever begin to consider to work in a place that practices this [censored].
Hamish McBagpipe
10-25-2005, 02:19 PM
This may be the only answer... stick it right back to them... primer (http://ilwu.nisgroup.com/organize/index.cfm)
Blarg
10-25-2005, 02:42 PM
Peeing in a bottle sounds like the next step.
DrSavage
10-25-2005, 02:47 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Peeing in a bottle sounds like the next step.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure what you mean. Should I be offended?
diebitter
10-25-2005, 02:59 PM
Don't say anything bad, even weak (like 'sometimes a little late') cos there's a good chance those words or similar will be used if that manager doesn't like that person. Or they'll go in some report, and be picked up by a manager in the future whose looking for ammo against that person. Managers can be weasels. I know, I used to be one, and used to have to deal with others. I hate the little squeaking wankers!
DON'T give em any ammo against coworkers whatsoever.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 03:44 PM
I mean this sounds like a bad management practice, with ill intent toward employees, that nobody should have to deal with. It sounds more like an attempt to demean, diminish, and control employees than to actually get something work-related accomplished.
HopeydaFish
10-25-2005, 05:16 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I hate this kind of management/HR tool. In the past I've refused to participate in these types of things. I don't particularly like rating people or ratting on people. I'd probably approach it the same way that you mentioned Gorie.
(I actually have to review my boss and managers at my current job. They claim it is confidential)
[/ QUOTE ]
They don't make us rate our fellow employees here, but once a year we have a 360 review of our managers. The last one was about 6 months ago. My manager did well, he only had a few negative comments but didn't take offence. He found it helpful.
However, there was another manager in the office who was ripped to shreds by her employees. They all hated her and didn't pull any punches in describing what she was doing wrong. Apparently this totally devastated her -- she's been on stress leave ever since.
Boris
10-25-2005, 05:44 PM
Welcome to the real world honey. First of all, your goal here is to move up the corporate ladder so you can make lots more money. Not that you have much chance starting out as a grunt but you might as well try. You want to look better than everyone else so pick out the two most capable co-workers and make some mildly disparaging comments. Don't be too harsh or you will sound like a vindictive bitch. Say good things about everyone else. Pick out the two biggest fvckups in your office. Give these two really awesome reviews. This way you come off as genuine and you will be using management to weed out your stiffest competition.
[ QUOTE ]
Unless you are fairly high-up in the company with a real investment in your future there, looking to improve the company, I would personally recommend being as bland and neutral as possible in your reviews. Little upside with lots of potential downside.
[/ QUOTE ]
I never understood this attitude at a job you consider a career. Why not try to make things better if you're going to spend 40+ hours a week there?
Also, in all likelihood your bosses want to know if you are unhappy or if there are specific things that you would like them to do differently. I know I want to know. It's hard to replace people.
[ QUOTE ]
This sounds like a race to the bottom. Be sure to degrade others before they degrade you, and help the company document reasons for firing the workers someone in management doesn't like, or with higher than average wages. I don't like this a bit. You're being asked to do management's dirty work for them. They already know who they're going to give raises or promotions or bonuses, and are very unlikely to want any of your input on that. However, they can get mileage out of competitive backstabbing and rumor mongering.
[/ QUOTE ]
My experience is totally different. In fact, I think it's much more likely to have competitive backstabbing when people are not accountable for their assessments.
RunDownHouse
10-25-2005, 06:00 PM
[ QUOTE ]
This way you come off as genuine and you will be using management to weed out your stiffest competition.
[/ QUOTE ]
Unless management has half a brain, in which case they'll read Gorie's glowing reviews of the office idiots and think she's one of them.
These things aren't a big deal. Just be as forgettable as you can when reviewing your coworkers.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 06:06 PM
Competitive backstabbing is the norm in nearly every work environment in which it is even conceivably profitable to a single person there. All it takes is one to start the chain, or the fear that one might start it up, to call forth preemptive strikes among the rest like falling dominos.
Divide and conquer. Management loves it, and it often gets dumped worshipfully at their door with little to no effort on their part. The race to the bottom is the norm.
If people are accountable for their assessments to their peers, there may be a greater chance of something positive coming out of what is basically an invitation to backstab and try to make yourself shine in comparison to others, combined with a high-stakes popularity contest.
I don't think these things will necessarily be evaluated fairly for the most part, or that is necessarily their intended purpose or main benefit to management.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 06:08 PM
I agree. This is a sniveling weasel contest in large part, and to think management isn't looking for that and recognizing it when they see it is very naive. Even the biggest arseholes aren't necessarily stupid.
diebitter
10-25-2005, 06:21 PM
Also, another trick is they get you to say what you think needs improving about yourself, and then use this to justify not giving you a raise.
Bugger the wankers, I say!
gorie
10-25-2005, 06:23 PM
here it is...
http://www.kingofthebop.com/EVAL3.jpg
lame.
what's even more retarded is out of that list the one i work most with, is my boss. i'd give everyone 10's but him, just to bug him - except for that i know he'd have a meeting with me demanding the "pacifics" as to why i scored him the way i did.
also, there is really no "moving up" in this company. it's a stinkin' photo lab.
who am i to rate someone on most of these things ? i don't pay attention to when people get to work, or how fast they do their work, quality, etc. he's the one who knows these things. i don't get it.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 06:35 PM
That's the worst. When there's really nowhere to go and nothing to be done, but the management just wants to sweat the workers and make them fearful for their jobs. Good way to keep anyone from asking for a raise or speaking up when the boss jerks them around.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 06:35 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Also, another trick is they get you to say what you think needs improving about yourself, and then use this to justify not giving you a raise.
Bugger the wankers, I say!
[/ QUOTE ]
Diebitter knows the game.
ddubois
10-25-2005, 06:37 PM
That is ridiculous. Not even a comments box would could in theory be useful, but just sticking a bunch of numbers in? I would literally wipe my ass with that form.
gorie
10-25-2005, 06:39 PM
i'm not worried about not getting a raise. no one is getting a raise.
i just got a raise a couple weeks ago because i asked for one. then he gave someone else a raise as a result.
that's probably all the raises that will be given out for awhile, he already whines about payroll being too high.
gorie
10-25-2005, 06:49 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Unless you are fairly high-up in the company with a real investment in your future there, looking to improve the company, I would personally recommend being as bland and neutral as possible in your reviews. Little upside with lots of potential downside.
[/ QUOTE ]
I never understood this attitude at a job you consider a career. Why not try to make things better if you're going to spend 40+ hours a week there?
Also, in all likelihood your bosses want to know if you are unhappy or if there are specific things that you would like them to do differently. I know I want to know. It's hard to replace people.
[/ QUOTE ]
if my boss were normal i might agree with the way you see things (except i still think evaluating co-workers is terrible).
but he's psycho, and trust me no matter what anyone says that they'd like to see changed or improved, it doesn't matter.
i think it is better to be bland and give generic answers. nothing good comes out of these things, at least not where i work. he has fired people for being honest in their reviews before, if he doesn't like what you say then you're not worth it.
when he interviews people to hire, he always says "the only right way to do things around here is my way" - that is there first impression. he makes it very clear, and it's true.
he also thinks everyone is disposable. if someone isn't happy, he would rather them leave. people leave this place all the time. looking at the staff photos, most people cycle out within 3 years because they can't stand him.
it's just a weird place. and this new evaluation sheet only makes it weirder. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Boris
10-25-2005, 07:06 PM
get real man. if management is so smart why are they asking for peer reviews in the first place? think about it.
Aloysius
10-25-2005, 07:19 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Unless you are fairly high-up in the company with a real investment in your future there, looking to improve the company, I would personally recommend being as bland and neutral as possible in your reviews. Little upside with lots of potential downside.
[/ QUOTE ]
I never understood this attitude at a job you consider a career. Why not try to make things better if you're going to spend 40+ hours a week there?
Also, in all likelihood your bosses want to know if you are unhappy or if there are specific things that you would like them to do differently. I know I want to know. It's hard to replace people.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well - first, you have to consider your company a palce you'd like to be for many years. I don't think is the case with most people.
I think that if you're committed to working at your firm, and rising the ranks, you have to do it in the best way that fits the firm's culture.
If, it's an open, trusting culture where you know senior management well, and truly believe they have your best interests at heart, I say, spout away! I would.
That's a pretty rare situation though. For the most part, office culture is about back-stabbing, blaming the other person, and not being accountable. In this world - playing it safe is smarter (again, my caveat - unless you are senior management and very invested in the firm's success, say what you want, otherwise... very little upside).
DukeSucks
10-25-2005, 07:51 PM
[ QUOTE ]
That is ridiculous. Not even a comments box would could in theory be useful, but just sticking a bunch of numbers in? I would literally wipe my ass with that form.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, there needs to be a comments section where you can explain your choices. Does this get turned in with the rest of your self-evaluation, or is it anonymous?
gorie
10-25-2005, 07:53 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That is ridiculous. Not even a comments box would could in theory be useful, but just sticking a bunch of numbers in? I would literally wipe my ass with that form.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, there needs to be a comments section where you can explain your choices. Does this get turned in with the rest of your self-evaluation, or is it anonymous?
[/ QUOTE ]
it's stapled to the 2 sheet self evaluation , with our name written on it.
I understand what you're saying and the logic behind it, but my experience has been very different.
[ QUOTE ]
Well - first, you have to consider your company a palce you'd like to be for many years. I don't think is the case with most people.
[/ QUOTE ]
Why? Two years at 40 hours a week comes out to nearly 4000 hours of your life. That's a meaningful amount of time worth salvaging and I think most people plan on working at their current employer at least two years.
[ QUOTE ]
That's a pretty rare situation though. For the most part, office culture is about back-stabbing, blaming the other person, and not being accountable. In this world - playing it safe is smarter (again, my caveat - unless you are senior management and very invested in the firm's success, say what you want, otherwise... very little upside).
[/ QUOTE ]
I just don't get this. It's entirely possible that I have been exceedingly lucky in working at abnormally nurturing environments but I don't buy it. One thing I was taught very early on is to carefully manage your boss, i.e. make sure you both have the same understanding for what you are doing and what you want to do and all of that. I think what I'm reading here is that most people aren't even trying to do that.
HopeydaFish
10-25-2005, 08:07 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That is ridiculous. Not even a comments box would could in theory be useful, but just sticking a bunch of numbers in? I would literally wipe my ass with that form.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, there needs to be a comments section where you can explain your choices. Does this get turned in with the rest of your self-evaluation, or is it anonymous?
[/ QUOTE ]
it's stapled to the 2 sheet self evaluation , with our name written on it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Seriously, find another job. This is retarded.
Okay. That thing is an insult.
BadBoyBenny
10-25-2005, 08:21 PM
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I understand what you're saying and the logic behind it, but my experience has been very different.
[/ QUOTE ]
Me too. From the sounds of things, we must be the only ones. I suggest we keep both our jobs and our positive attitudes.
I have three words for something like this:
Random number generator.
Get everyone to do it too.
Imagine him trying to analyze the results.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 08:42 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I understand what you're saying and the logic behind it, but my experience has been very different.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure it has been. Not all work places are alike. As I recall, you have a very good job somewhere, right? And are a little closer to "above the line" than "below the line" when it comes to workers, that is, more likely to be viewed as an asset that strictly as a cost. It doesn't sound like Gorie's job is like that, or like her management thinks like that.
Blarg
10-25-2005, 08:44 PM
I think what you're reading is that the vast majority of work environments are not like your own.
Aloysius
10-25-2005, 09:25 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I just don't get this. It's entirely possible that I have been exceedingly lucky in working at abnormally nurturing environments but I don't buy it. One thing I was taught very early on is to carefully manage your boss, i.e. make sure you both have the same understanding for what you are doing and what you want to do and all of that. I think what I'm reading here is that most people aren't even trying to do that.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm curious Sf'er what industry do you work in?
I've worked in i'banking, venture, now entertainment (all fairly cutthroat industries), so my personal suspicions of how "nurturing" a work environment are colored by this.
However - I have friends in a wide variety of industries - and from academia, to technology, to consulting... never, ever heard that the default work state is "nurturing".
Most people (co-workers whatever) are pretty self-interested. Succeeding in corporate america = someone else not succeeding. It's competition. How is it possible to have such a wholesome, nurturing environment at a work place? I find it difficult to imagine this truly existing.
Oh - and yeah - managing upwards is a really good thing to try and do. But I've found that it's much less about creating an understanding with your boss (for the greater good of the company) but much more about self-preservation and other selfish motives.
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