5/10 6m KQ

[jason_t]

I posted this hand in another thread yesterday in response to a question. Now I'm curious about it.

I don't remember my reads; this hand is from a little over a month ago when I was taking shots at loose/passive 5/10 6m tables.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (6 SB) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, SB calls, BB folds.

Turn: (4 BB) K/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6 BB) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB 3-bets</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 11 BB

[Stefan_K]

yeah this seams good

[GetThere1Time]

I usually just call the river. You say the table is passive. I know you'll get paid by worse hands when you raise sometimes, and you can easily fold to a 3-bet, but he's also the passive guy that's betting that river. Call and pray.

Its a good value bet and a good fold if you have a read. Against a tard, its a bad fold.

[GetThere1Time]

[ QUOTE ]
Its a good value bet and a good fold if you have a read. Against a tard, its a bad fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure it's a good fold once he 3-bets but wouldn't you say a value raise is super thin here. When the weakie bets the 4 straight board I feel like I'm paying off more than anything. I make a crying call with KQ expecting to see Ax, QT, KT sometimes

[zephed]

Jason, what range of hands do you put villain on when he bets the river?

[LockForward]

Why the call on the turn? This is a hard hand to evaluate without a read on the SB. SB calls your preflop raise, calls your bet on an ace high flop, and then bets into you when the K /images/graemlins/heart.gif hits on the turn. What hand had you put the SB on at that point?

[aba20]

He called the turn because he had odds at hitting his 6-10 outer. River is perfect, I don't know of anyone who is threebetting this without a J. What is your line if you are checkraised on the flop, K hits on the turn and you are fired into?

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
Jason, what range of hands do you put villain on when he bets the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ax, Kx, QJ, Tx, 66, busted /images/graemlins/spade.gif draw.

[GetThere1Time]

[ QUOTE ]
River is perfect,

[/ QUOTE ]

You sure about that? It still seems like a call is better here given the action.

4-bet the river and call a 5-bet happily. You have two pair. Don't fold, wow. GJ Hellmuth

[Stefan_K]

[ QUOTE ]
4-bet the river and call a 5-bet happily. You have two pair. Don't fold, wow. GJ Hellmuth

[/ QUOTE ]
a new troll?

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
4-bet the river and call a 5-bet happily. You have two pair. Don't fold, wow. GJ Hellmuth

[/ QUOTE ]

Have you been to White Dog yet?

[Jeff W]

I think combinatorics is the only way to approach this. Remember that there is a non-zero chance that you will be 3-bet by a worse hand.

I call the river.

[Jeff W]

[ QUOTE ]
4-bet the river and call a 5-bet happily. You have two pair. Don't fold, wow. GJ Hellmuth

[/ QUOTE ]

This is funny, if unfair. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[zephed]

I don't think weak aces, kings and tens (all 1 pair hands) are betting the turn AND river very often.

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think weak aces, kings and tens (all 1 pair hands) are betting the turn AND river very often.

[/ QUOTE ]

No but I meant for my range to include all the strong As and Ks and Ts (just as two pairs, pair + gutshot, etc.) as well as the wider range since he was generally loose.

[xGoreDudex]

I think were going to be shown KJ-KT here the majority of the time, I think calling river isn't bad, any reason to ever fold this hand?

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
I think were going to be shown KJ-KT here the majority of the time, I think calling river isn't bad, any reason to ever fold this hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't think I was good 1/11.

[Jeff W]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't think I was good 1/11.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just to nitpick, you only have to be good 1/12.

11/12*-1+1/12*11=0

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I didn't think I was good 1/11.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just to nitpick, you only have to be good 1/12.

11/12*-1+1/12*11=0

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you.

[aba20]

[ QUOTE ]

You sure about that? It still seems like a call is better here given the action.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes. I don't beleive you are ever three bet unless beaten. You could be called by worse hands, and an even better thing that can happen is villan folds a better hand. People usually don't raise these rivers without a J. So often I will value bet two pair and fold to a raise. So the line the jason used would work wonderfully against me.

[GetThere1Time]

[ QUOTE ]
an even better thing that can happen is villan folds a better hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

This isn't happening, never ever... and by never I mean super rarely.

[oreogod]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
an even better thing that can happen is villan folds a better hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

This isn't happening, never ever... and by never I mean super rarely.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually it depends on who u are up against. But since u are rarely upagainst that sort of player...then u are right.

J_t...I like the hand. Sometimes I call the river, here I would go your route. NH.