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View Full Version : ten ten hand.

lighterjobs
10-19-2005, 05:22 PM
did not raising the flop cause me to lose this hand?

Ultimate Bet 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed)converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB caps</font>, Hero calls, Button calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls, Button calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero folds, Button calls.

River: (9.75 BB) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Button calls.

Final Pot: 11.75 BB
stillbr
10-19-2005, 05:25 PM
Depends on the aggressiveness of your opponents. If they were non maniacs looks good.
lighterjobs
10-20-2005, 12:24 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Depends on the aggressiveness of your opponents. If they were non maniacs looks good.

[/ QUOTE ]

they weren't maniacs. i was playing at this table for half an hour and this was the first pot capped preflop.
10-20-2005, 12:37 AM
You played it fine. Classic case of waiting for a good turn card to raise. You got a crappy turn card, you folded, well done.
TheHammer24
10-20-2005, 12:39 AM
[ QUOTE ]
You played it fine. Classic case of waiting for a good turn card to raise. You got a crappy turn card, you folded, well done.

[/ QUOTE ]
newhizzle
10-20-2005, 12:40 AM
dude youve changed colors like 3 times in the past 10 minutes
TheHammer24
10-20-2005, 12:41 AM
[ QUOTE ]
dude youve changed colors like 3 times in the past 10 minutes

[/ QUOTE ]

Somebody please explain the colors to me!!
cokehead
10-20-2005, 12:43 AM
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=3722095&amp;page=0&amp;view=colla psed&amp;sb=5&amp;o=14&amp;fpart=1
lighterjobs
10-20-2005, 12:45 AM
[ QUOTE ]
dude youve changed colors like 3 times in the past 10 minutes

[/ QUOTE ]

sample size is too small.
10-20-2005, 12:48 AM
You should have raised the flop! Shorthanded you don't need to wait for the turn before raising.
lighterjobs
10-20-2005, 12:51 AM
[ QUOTE ]
You should have raised the flop! Shorthanded you don't need to wait for the turn before raising.

[/ QUOTE ]

see: preflop.
Felipe
10-20-2005, 01:11 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You should have raised the flop! Shorthanded you don't need to wait for the turn before raising.

[/ QUOTE ]

see: preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think waiting to raise isn't a good play. It is reasonable to assume we have the best hand! 4-bets doesn't always mean a hand that beats us.

If you raise the flop, you cut the odds of the button. As it stands he has odds to chase aces, kings, queens, jacks, all cards that threaten our situation. If we raise - he won't have the odds to chase overs. Secondly, we can raise for value. We have a stong overpair and a run-run flush (although weak, still valuable) And a BDstr8 that could come in occasionally. You don't have to win the majority of the time, but I think you can win more than your share. (you also have two outs to a set, but it's a little devalued by the flush/str8 draws on board)

Any thoughts on my thoughts?
SackUp
10-20-2005, 02:15 AM
I'm either popping the flop or folding. 3 way in a capped flop where the other two are the 3better and capper in the first capped pot does not sound fun to me. You don't really have odds to draw to your 2 outer on the flop and there is a high chance that the button will raise after you call thus costing you more bets to see the turn.

Depending on the button's 3-bet range you could definitely drive him off overcards if you face him with two cold on the flop. Also you have to hope that the bb is either on AK or a maniac if you are going to have a fighting chance.

So a raise has the potential of knocking out the button and then getting the bb to fold the turn UI (obviously this turn card sucks, but you still have control of hte hand and can easily fold to a donk bet).

I really don't think folding is a horrible option if both players are reasonable. You are likely behind and drawing slim and more importantly you are stuck in between two players who have already shown aggression and it would suck to be in a war with this hand.

So I think it is close b/w a raise and a fold.
SackUp
10-20-2005, 02:17 AM
[ QUOTE ]
You played it fine. Classic case of waiting for a good turn card to raise. You got a crappy turn card, you folded, well done.

[/ QUOTE ]

what turn card do you like to see here other than a 10? I'm not confident my hand it good with any other card falling on this turn especially when in between two players who have shown such postflop aggression. Raising on the turn seems like it would be spewing most of the time.
Nick C
10-20-2005, 02:44 AM
Raise the flop if you want, but you're probably behind, just like you were probably behind preflop.

If you're ahead, then BB and Button are probably sharing outs, and you're not going to get them both to fold.

I think that about the best you can hope for in terms of improving your chances of winning, most of the time, is that BB has AK and you get Button to dump AQ and three outs that could've gone on to beat you.

It's an uncomfortable position on the flop, and I'm not really sure what's best. But I think you played it all right.