The Big Game at Bellagio [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

Photoc

10-18-2005, 08:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I am going to Vegas pretty soon and was wondering when the "big boys" play a $2,000-$4,000 limit game. Not that I would sit at that table or anything, I just think it would be fun to watch.

[/ QUOTE ]

You wont be able to watch. Unless you're playing in it, you're not getting anywhere near it.

sternroolz

10-18-2005, 08:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]

You wont be able to watch. Unless you're playing in it, you're not getting anywhere near it.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can see the players in the fish tank, thats about it. I think if you stood there and stared, everyone might think there is something wrong with you.

10-18-2005, 09:53 PM

I was there in June playing, and as another just pointed out - you cannot get close. There was a guy watching and within a minute, a security guard/usher came and told him he cannot stand there. Ivey was in and out, w/ an amazing stack of chips.

10-19-2005, 11:41 AM

If they want it to be private I wonder why they are in a glass-enclosed room. When I saw it last time I was there it reminded me of just what you called it -- a fish tank. Why not give them a more private area?

CrazyEyez

10-19-2005, 11:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
If they want it to be private I wonder why they are in a glass-enclosed room. When I saw it last time I was there it reminded me of just what you called it -- a fish tank. Why not give them a more private area?

[/ QUOTE ]
People will come play at the Bellagio just for the chance to say they saw so-and-so playing in the big game. It's marketing.

TheMetetron

10-19-2005, 11:46 AM

If you consider Farha a semi-big guy, he's playing the 100/200 No Limit quite a bit there (and it's usually on the ground floor by the cage). Usually sits with upwards of $40-50k. Not quitte as impressive as $4,000/$8,000 limit, but not something to scoff at.

Slim Pickens

10-19-2005, 12:30 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You wont be able to watch. Unless you're playing in it, you're not getting anywhere near it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I heard a rumor that something in the Gaming Regs prevented casinos from having truely private gaming rooms, and security in the high rollers areas was there to make you feel unwelcome as a gawker, but can't technically force you to leave. Is there any truth to this? I didn't find anything conclusive in the regs.

FrankStallone

10-19-2005, 12:34 PM

they make it hard for you to stay.

Rasputin

10-19-2005, 12:36 PM

You gotta wonder why these guys don't strike up a deal with the house.

Put the game in a visible area with some bleachers around, charge admission, and split it betwixt the house and the players.

10-19-2005, 12:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You gotta wonder why these guys don't strike up a deal with the house.

Put the game in a visible area with some bleachers around, charge admission, and split it betwixt the house and the players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because these guys are playing 4000/8000. The money they'd make from selling tickets isn't enough to draw their interest.

StevieG

10-19-2005, 12:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]

I heard a rumor that something in the Gaming Regs prevented casinos from having truely private gaming rooms, and security in the high rollers areas was there to make you feel unwelcome as a gawker, but can't technically force you to leave. Is there any truth to this? I didn't find anything conclusive in the regs.

[/ QUOTE ]

This was true in Nevada up until 2001. Until then, all wagering had to be open to the public to ensure that games were honest and taxes paid.

But casinos started lobbying to put in private rooms to cater to high-rollers. The law was changed, players in private rooms must have at least $500k in cash or on credit, minimum bets $500.

MGM got the first private room approved in 2002.

StevieG

10-19-2005, 01:05 PM

That being said, otherwise Slim Pickens is correct. Any other wagering area is open to the public. They can dissuade you from gawking with the bouncers and polite questions ("perhaps you would be interested in playing at a different table?").

I do not know for sure, but I strongly believe that a private room requires some combination of extra license fees and higher state take. Probably not worth it to do this for one high limit game that doesn't take that big a house drop anyway. Plus, the best part of this game for the casino is its allure, which would vanish if the game were invisible.

Action Scott

10-19-2005, 01:12 PM

I'm going to vegas for the first time this weekend, I wouldn't mind strolling past the 'big game' just to take a peek, Is it actually ok then, to stop by the glass and check it out for a second or two, so long as I'm not standing there for an hour?

StevieG

10-19-2005, 01:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You gotta wonder why these guys don't strike up a deal with the house.

Put the game in a visible area with some bleachers around, charge admission, and split it betwixt the house and the players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because these guys are playing 4000/8000. The money they'd make from selling tickets isn't enough to draw their interest.

[/ QUOTE ]

More importantly, until recently they could not even if they wanted to. In Nevada it was illegal to charge admission to a gaming area.

This is why there were no slots on the observation level of the Stratosphere tower.

This has also recently changed. This summer Nevada took up the issue and will allow for admission charges under certain circumstances - namely, there must be something else special about the area, and that the licensee also provide at least an equal number of games and tables in a public area as in the restricted area.

The Stratosphere will almost certainly take advantage of this.

Likewise, the Palms will likely try to do the same for the new Playboy Club atop the new tower addition to the hotel.

TheCroShow

10-19-2005, 01:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm going to vegas for the first time this weekend, I wouldn't mind strolling past the 'big game' just to take a peek, Is it actually ok then, to stop by the glass and check it out for a second or two, so long as I'm not standing there for an hour?

[/ QUOTE ]

yah man, don't hesitate. i was strolling through the room and saw jennifer harman playing. stopped, had a look and could not tell what they were playing. had a look for a minute or two and went about my business.

Rasputin

10-19-2005, 02:27 PM

jaydub

10-19-2005, 02:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]

...

security in the high rollers areas was there to make you feel unwelcome as a gawker, but can't technically force you to leave. Is there any truth to this? I didn't find anything conclusive in the regs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't push this, doing so may cause you to get trespassed.

michiganlaw

10-19-2005, 02:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is it actually ok then, to stop by the glass and check it out for a second or two, so long as I'm not standing there for an hour?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's ok, only if they let you. Someone mentioned that security could not technically get you to move....bullsh*t!! Casinos have virtually unbridled authority to dictate who can watch what games...after all, they can kick you out of their casino all together for good cause, bad cause, or NO CAUSE AT ALL!!!!

J.A.Sucker

10-19-2005, 02:41 PM

Watching any big game is usually a strict no-no. There are lots of reasons for this, but the most imporant one is to prevent people from "taking off" the hole cards of the parties in the game. Plus, the losers want to be left alone, not gawked at by some non-player. There are other reasons, too, but I'm not gonna talk about those.

Bulbarainey

10-19-2005, 02:41 PM

what is the drop on the big game?

10-19-2005, 02:56 PM

[quoteIt's essentially free money. Who turns down free money?

[/ QUOTE ]

In a 4000/8000 game it's normal for these guys to have swings of half a million dollars in a given night. Any money they would make from tickets after splitting it with the house and then splitting it up among all of the players would be such an incredibly miniscule and insignificant sum that it wouldn't be worth putting forth two minutes worth of effort to get it going.

No offense, but it's a ridiculous idea.

If you figured you could make an extra 10 cents a night selling tickets to watch your 4/8 game, would you even bother?

(I hope you don't say yes)

highlife

10-19-2005, 04:23 PM

i think its $10 per half.

10-19-2005, 04:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You wont be able to watch. Unless you're playing in it, you're not getting anywhere near it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I heard a rumor that something in the Gaming Regs prevented casinos from having truely private gaming rooms, and security in the high rollers areas was there to make you feel unwelcome as a gawker, but can't technically force you to leave. Is there any truth to this? I didn't find anything conclusive in the regs.

[/ QUOTE ]

Its private property. They can have you escorted off the premesis if they want. Ive had it happen before (nasty incident with blackjack and alleged card counting... /images/graemlins/wink.gif)

accountant71

10-19-2005, 04:40 PM

I was in Bellagio Saturday night around 10pm and the big game was going. Chip Reese, Minh Ly, Phil Ivey, Barry Greenstein, Gus Hanson and Doyle Brunson were all playing.

arod15

10-19-2005, 04:41 PM

All day all night. At least it appeared that way during the WSOP....

10-19-2005, 05:12 PM

I was there 2 nights last week: saw doyle, phil ivy, jen harman and some oriental dude... Chao Yang? I'm sure I butchered his name to hell. In the high limit area I saw Sklansky, Johnny Chan and I'm pretty sure Fischman. It was some dude with his glasses, facial hair and goofy brown trucker hat. I got some looks from the staff hanging around the cash-out desk, but only hung around 2-3 minutes while stretching my legs.

goofball

10-19-2005, 05:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
i think its $10 per half.

[/ QUOTE ]

It is.

ezratei

10-19-2005, 05:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think its $10 per half.

[/ QUOTE ]

It is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is it posible to beat a game with such a high drop?

CrazyEyez

10-19-2005, 05:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think its $10 per half.

[/ QUOTE ]

It is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is it posible to beat a game with such a high drop?

[/ QUOTE ]
haha

idrinkcoors

10-19-2005, 05:58 PM

I wonder what those guys toke the dealers when pulling in a pot. Obviously they are not tossing a 1k chip to them. Do they bring $20 chips for tips, $10?

Patrick del Poker Grande

10-19-2005, 06:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I wonder what those guys toke the dealers when pulling in a pot. Obviously they are not tossing a 1k chip to them. Do they bring $20 chips for tips, $10?

[/ QUOTE ]
Autographs and the opportunity to be in their presence.

SirFelixCat

10-19-2005, 06:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I wonder what those guys toke the dealers when pulling in a pot. Obviously they are not tossing a 1k chip to them. Do they bring $20 chips for tips, $10?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you want an inside look into this game, go read Linda's "Table Tango" blog. She's one of the best dealer's at the Bellagio and also got mentioned second in the acknowledgements part of, "The Prof, Banker, and Suicide King" book.

Very interesting read. Been reading it for the last couple of years.

DesertCat

10-19-2005, 07:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I was in Bellagio Saturday night around 10pm and the big game was going. Chip Reese, Minh Ly, Phil Ivey, Barry Greenstein, Gus Hanson and Doyle Brunson were all playing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Same on Sunday afternoon early evening, plus Jen Harmon, David Gray and a WPT final tablist from NY (can't remember his name).

My table (2-5NL) was right in front of the fish tank. This one noob at our table was so bad that everyone at the table was offering advice or begging him to quit before he lost his $200. Once he busted he got up and walked straight into the fish tank. They escorted him out very quickly, but no arms or legs were broken.

I also saw David Sklansky, but couldn't think of anything to say that wouldn't make me sound like a psychopathic stalker.

Slim Pickens

10-19-2005, 07:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You wont be able to watch. Unless you're playing in it, you're not getting anywhere near it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I heard a rumor that something in the Gaming Regs prevented casinos from having truely private gaming rooms, and security in the high rollers areas was there to make you feel unwelcome as a gawker, but can't technically force you to leave. Is there any truth to this? I didn't find anything conclusive in the regs.

[/ QUOTE ]

Its private property. They can have you escorted off the premesis if they want. Ive had it happen before (nasty incident with blackjack and alleged card counting... /images/graemlins/wink.gif)

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure the former rule about wagering only in public had everything to do with making sure the state got it's fair take and nothing at at all to do with public freedom. Imagine how much a casino could make off a big-money blackjack game conducted in a "private room." Six whales walk in. The next day, the casino reports, um, uh, $200 gross... yeah... $200. The state probably changed the regulations when they decided they could ensure the casinos reported the house take correctly without direct plainclothed human supervision.

There's a huge difference between allowing no member of the public in an area and only not allowing you, as the nice folks at Disney's California Adventure explained to me on my entirely-voluntary way out.

Photoc

10-19-2005, 08:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I wonder what those guys toke the dealers when pulling in a pot. Obviously they are not tossing a 1k chip to them. Do they bring $20 chips for tips, $10?

[/ QUOTE ]

Generally nothing unless it's part of the agreement with the house that is included in the time charge.

How do I know? 1st hand experience, I've dealt this game.

HopeydaFish

10-19-2005, 08:52 PM

Randy_Refeld

10-19-2005, 08:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I wonder what those guys toke the dealers when pulling in a pot. Obviously they are not tossing a 1k chip to them. Do they bring $20 chips for tips, $10?

[/ QUOTE ]

Generally nothing unless it's part of the agreement with the house that is included in the time charge.

How do I know? 1st hand experience, I've dealt this game.

[/ QUOTE ]

For a while they were paying $25 a down (built into the collection). While I was in Vegas (the big game was different back then, but still most of the same players). Someone from the Review Journal wrote about someoen winning a big pot and giving the dealer nothing. This did not make these guys popular in Vegas.

sternroolz

10-19-2005, 10:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Just don't make a blowfish on the glass. They hate that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please don't bring ideas like this to my attention. I drink a LOT when at Bellagio. I tend to remember these sort of ideas when I drink.

Action Scott

10-20-2005, 09:27 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm going to vegas for the first time this weekend, I wouldn't mind strolling past the 'big game' just to take a peek, Is it actually ok then, to stop by the glass and check it out for a second or two, so long as I'm not standing there for an hour?

[/ QUOTE ]

Just don't make a blowfish on the glass. They hate that.

[/ QUOTE ]
Are Pickle Races (ala Billy Madison) allowed /images/graemlins/smile.gif