The hand that put me on tilt.

[GuyOnTilt]

Playing 4/8 B&M at a loose/semi-aggressive table. Calling Station on my right, Rock on my left, Mr. Any Two on his left. I'm 2 off the button.

UTG limps, folds to MP limper, MP2 limps, Calling Station limps. I see 7 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 6 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif and limp as well. Rock limps, Button limps, SB completes, BB knuckles. 8 to the flop for 8 SB's.

Flop comes: 5 /forums/images/icons/spade.gif K /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 8 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif

Checks to CS who bets, I raise, Rock makes it 3, MAT calls the 3 bets cold. EP and MP players fold to CS who calls 2 cold. I cap, all call. Four to the turn for 24 SB's.

Turn comes: 4 /forums/images/icons/club.gif [5 /forums/images/icons/spade.gif K /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 8 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif ]

CS checks, I bet my nuts, Rock raises, MAT 3-bets (!!!). CS plays his role and calls the 3 bets cold, I cap. Rock thinks for a minutes, and mucks his hand. MAT and CS both call. I put the calling station on diamonds and pray they don't come. Any-Two I'm putting on a set and praying the board doesn't pair. Three to the river for 26 BB's.

River comes: 2 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif [4 /forums/images/icons/club.gif 5 /forums/images/icons/spade.gif K /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 8 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif ]

CS checks (???), I check, MAT bets, we both call. The button player shows K /forums/images/icons/spade.gif 8 /forums/images/icons/spade.gif for top two pair! I start getting my hopes up since the CS checked the river...UNTIL he flips over Q /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 5 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif !!! I shake my head as I muck my hand and watch the 29 Big Bet pot get pushed to my right.

The Rock on my left sympathized with me as we talked during the next few hands. He tells me he mucked red aces and read my hand blind. We continue to talk as I'm fuming inside at the CS's stupidity calling 3 cold with a flush draw he wasn't even confident enough to bet when it hit. As a result, in the next 2 hours I proceed to blow a rack and a half of chips seeing turn cards I shouldn't be seeing before I finally get back on track and start playing how I should.

Usually tilt isn't a problem for me at all. I know that EV is on my side and I don't care very much when my opponent rivers their 3-outer to beat me, or I go 2 hours seeing only 3 flops. I don't know if it was the size of the pot that put me on tilt, or the size of the pot that kept his Queen-high flush in the hand on the turn. I couldn't help but wonder if I hadn't capped the flop, if he would have called the 3 cold on the turn. I still don't see it as a mistake, but the thought that it may have cost me the hand frustrates me.

[bernie]

this really wasnt even that bad a beat. id have stayed in with his hand on the flop. youre cap wouldnt have gotten me out. im seeing the river with that hand, unless the board pairs.

you were doomed to lose this hand

you 3 bet the turn, he'd be thinking even more that if he hits his hand it will be good. he'd be putting you on a str8 (correctly) or a set. the CS and rock arent betting draws, so he can discount them as flush draws. the only other one is you.

as i said, the beats get much worse than this.

not that that helps much, but something to think about. imagine about 3-6 of these a session. that's when it REALLY gets fun.

anyways, hang in there

b

[JTG51]

...or the size of the pot that kept his Queen-high flush in the hand on the turn.

It wasn't the size of the pot that kept his Q-high flush draw in on the turn, it was his Q-high flush draw that kept his Q-high flush draw in on the turn.

I couldn't help but wonder if I hadn't capped the flop, if he would have called the 3 cold on the turn.

I think people waste a whole lot of time and energy thinking about how to get flush draws, especially on unpaired boards, to fold. It just ain't gonna happen. When was the last time you folded a Q high flush draw on an unpaired board?

By the way, you might want to rethink your read on the "rock". I wouldn't call someone that 3-bets the flop then when it's capped raises the turn with one pair a rock. He seems a lot less rockish than you originally thought.

[Tyler Durden]

Tilt is something I don't understand--maybe no one does. I'm not saying I never go on tilt--but it is rare. I just take a deep breath, get up from the table for a few minutes, and tell myself that all I can do is play the next hand and every following hand as perfectly as I can possibly play it. It helps, you should try it.

If you go on tilt you're just cheating yourself.

[Louie Landale]

You are actually in the Matrix. The opponents who play so strangly and still win are put there by the Agents DELIBERATELY to find out who are the true "live" professionals and who are the pretenders. This is how it works:

The bone-heads make a strange play that would put a normal person on tilt; major tilt. Then they watch to see who DOES go on tilt. These players they target for all sorts of subtel negativities, but the big one is to insure that they never actually win enough to be called a "professional", they may win enough to pay for gas, steak, and a Mother's day present, but not enough to live on.

The agents figure that those who do NOT go on tilt must be other programs and they let them alone, and these programs can and do go on to "professional" status.

So when you see this sort of play just figure its a deliberate attempt to put you on tilt and stiffle your ambitions, and its your job to resist.

[1] I mean, if you know they are TRYING to put you on tilt, wouldn't that make it easier to resist?

[2] Take any solice from the fact that a "lesser" player WOULD go on tilt, but not you?

[3] This situation has the biggest single impact on your EV. Treat it that way.

- Louie

[AceHigh]

When somebody makes a flush draw on the river, when he flopped that draw, it's not a bad beat, it's just poker.

" I know that EV is on my side and I don't care very much when my opponent rivers their 3-outer to beat me"

EV wasn't on your side. On the flop, he had 7 outs and you only had 6. (He thinks he has 9). Plus the 2 5's might be good for him, so he thinks he has 11 outs. You are giving EV to him. Even if you make your hand, he still has redraws to beat you, as you found out.

[FishyWhale]

[hutz]

It looks like most of the focus has been on your “tiltosity” and not on the play of the hand. I'll give that a shot.

Pre-analysis disclaimer: I have never played in California and understand that the game is certainly different there, so please read my reply accordingly.

Pre-flop: Your limp is reasonable if you do not expect a raise after you.

Flop: You flopped a monster draw. If you think someone after you will raise, wouldn't you want to go for a call-reraise (especially if the raise comes near the button)? Raising after one bet could kill your action and the pot isn't big enough to merit shutting others out. Your hand has a lot of outs, but you are still drawing.

Turn: Fire away!

River: Ouch.

You were not necessarily "destined to lose" this hand, but you were even or behind pre-flop with the eventual winner (even though the Qd5d hand shouldn’t have been played in that position, if at all) and behind (but with draws) on the flop. This isn’t a bad beat, it's just a tough break and will happen a lot more than you would like in the future.

By the way, based on this post and one you posted a few weeks ago, I think you need to re-examine your definition of a "rock." Here is mine:

rock – n. 1. a poker player who will only play aggressively (bet into an aggressive player or raise on any street) with the nuts or pretty darn close; frequently, but not always, takes the form of an embittered old man who is trying to squeeze every possible blind and small bet out of his pension check. 2. a hard, inanimate object found in nature that was sometimes kept as a pet during the 1970s. ex. The rock in seat seven brought his pet rock with him to the poker table for good luck.

I hope this helps. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

[CrackerZack]

The thing I don't understand, other than why this tilted you as it isn't even a bad beat, is why would you raise the bettor to your immediate right on the flop? Did you think your 7-high was good and wanted to exclude everyone else? This will almost always fold out a "rock" and it doesn't I don't want to be in your position, MAT will call, but probably everyone else will fold leaving you in a 3-way pot with 7-high and much less people to pay you off if you hit your draw. You got lucky that there were big hands behind you and you were able to make a big pot, but raising the flop in the situation in a normal game will just cut down the money you make when you hit.

[Barry]

Great post Louie.

If losing this hand gets you angry, OK fine. Get up, go for a walk. Do not start playing bad hands

When you get back, hope that the guy playing Q5 /forums/images/icons/diamond.gif is still at the table. He'll give it back to you with interest.

[MaxPower]

To paraphrase one the guys from my Monday night game, you couldn't have gotten this Calling Station out of the pot if you strapped a rocket to his ass.

[dirty_dan]

What kind of rocket?

[Homer]

a pocket rocket