Huge multiway pot. Horrible river. fold?

[ReadyEddie]

Villains are all like VP$ 60+ over around 20 hands, they are fish.


Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (14 SB) 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, CO folds, Button calls, SB folds, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (12 BB) T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, Button calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 caps</font>, MP2 folds, Button calls $3 (All-In), Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: (28.75 BB) Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players, 1 all-in)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls $2.50 (All-In).

Final Pot: 31.37 BB


Comments on all streets would be appreciated as always.

River: fold? bet? check/call and smash your face through the monitor?

[Nick Royale]

Nice hand. Do NOT fold the river.

[Jellyroll]

I think this is about how I'd play it. I'd consider betting the flop, since I had pretty good equity. But your position isn't great if you get raised by MP2, to allow people to call. So, I might have just check/called the flop too.

I like the way you played it though. I don't think the paired Q is too horrible though. I think you're good here more often than not. And you have HUGE pot odds, where I would never fold this, even if I was pretty damn certain I was behind.

I think I'm folding this pre flop, even on the BB or is this too tight? Maybe I fold the flop too.

Betting river is fine I think with 1 player virtually all in and the other playing passively throughout enough to suggest he doesn't have a set.

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I'm folding this pre flop, even on the BB or is this too tight? Maybe I fold the flop too.

[/ QUOTE ]
Folding preflop is leaving money at the table. Folding the flop is deserving losing all your money.

[Yako]

PF, you're getting 11:1 to call, 13:1 if you assume both limpers will call... How much more do you need to call with connectors, be they offsuit or not? IMO here you should be calling with almost anything...

I would call with any suited or connected cards here for sure. I think unsuited unconnected cards are going to be so difficult to play profitably postflop that I don't mind folding them.

I'd fold preflop but I can see its close. I'd be looking to hit two pair or better or a straight draw to continue past the flop, and I don't think that happens often enough, even at 13:1. I'd call any suited connector here though, even 32s.

Folding on the flop would be insane.

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd fold preflop but I can see its close. I'd be looking to hit two pair or better or a straight draw to continue past the flop, and I don't think that happens often enough, even at 13:1.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think it's even close. The odds against flopping a oesd is 9:1 and you'll flop a straight 1.2% of the times. Add the times the flop will look like 99x/97x/77x and I think I fold would be really bad. Besides we have a pretty good relative position and will be able to play a flopped gut-shot fairly easy.¨

I even think you could call with one-gappers like 97o and quite a lot of other garbage hands, but not I'm sure exactly what hands to call here...

[ QUOTE ]
The odds against flopping a oesd is 9:1 and you'll flop a straight 1.2% of the times.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for setting me straight - I didn't realise it was as frequent as that.

[KDawgCometh]

if you are that convinced that they have a set/quads and not two pair or a chop then just check/call the river. There is no way that I can even consider folding this river. I just don't see how with the pot size and the fact that idiotic players will do idiotic things, that folding can enter the mind

[ QUOTE ]
if you are that convinced that they have a set/quads and not two pair or a chop then just check/call the river. There is no way that I can even consider folding this river. I just don't see how with the pot size and the fact that idiotic players will do idiotic things, that folding can enter the mind

[/ QUOTE ]

Calling is always +EV here b/c I would break my computer if I folded a winner in this pot.

[KDawgCometh]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I'm folding this pre flop, even on the BB or is this too tight? Maybe I fold the flop too.


[/ QUOTE ]


nut peddling just isn't any fun, and it misses out on possible +ev situations when you come across them.

I can't fold the flop or PF. Our hand doesn't suck that much to fold PF and the pot is shaping up to be a monster. The same thing can be said for the flop. Just becasue its two cold when it gets back to us, the pot size allows us to call(I'm forgetting what our exact odds are right there, but they are at least 8.5-1) and there is serious implied odds to go along with that flop call. In fact, I'd even entertain making that flop call(if the odds are 8.5-1, I'm writing this after waking up) with a gutshot becasue I'm pretty sure that we will gain enough future bets to make up for what we might lose on a flop peel

We're not closing the action, so I think calling with a gutshot might not be so good.

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
We're not closing the action, so I think calling with a gutshot might not be so good.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think it's good. Especially if it's to the nuts.

Fold PF. Call if it's suited. Nice catch on the turn but you probably lost to MP1's 66 or 77. Put UTG+1 on your fish list. Very passive. MP1 could have something else, but if you really want to try, you could c-r the river to get a little $ from UTG+1. You would get $5.50 in a side pot if he called and lost.

[@bsolute_luck]

dear heavens this is great hand and i can't believe people are suggesting to fold. screw the times you get the straight, let's not forget 2 pair, full houses, and trips. getting 13:1, you're leaving $$ on the table with a fold preflop or on this beautiful rainbow OESD flop.

[tonypaladino]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I'm folding this pre flop, even on the BB or is this too tight? Maybe I fold the flop too.

[/ QUOTE ]

With that many players to the flop, I would call a raise from the BB with almost anything.

Why on earth would you fold an OESD on a rainbow flop?
Why on

[felix83]

[ QUOTE ]
if you are that convinced that they have a set/quads and not two pair or a chop then just check/call the river. There is no way that I can even consider folding this river. I just don't see how with the pot size and the fact that idiotic players will do idiotic things, that folding can enter the mind

[/ QUOTE ]

Am I missing something, or do we not beat a set on the river? I would 3-bet this, it could easily be raised by a Q that hasn't made a boat.

[W. Deranged]

Don't ever fold this river. Please. Ever.

[BigBrother]

[ QUOTE ]
Don't ever fold this river. Please. Ever.

[/ QUOTE ]

[KDawgCometh]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
if you are that convinced that they have a set/quads and not two pair or a chop then just check/call the river. There is no way that I can even consider folding this river. I just don't see how with the pot size and the fact that idiotic players will do idiotic things, that folding can enter the mind

[/ QUOTE ]

Am I missing something, or do we not beat a set on the river? I would 3-bet this, it could easily be raised by a Q that hasn't made a boat.

[/ QUOTE ]


a set has now boated up(or quads if it was top set), there is a difference between a set and trips

[felix83]

Alright, I figured that's what you meant, I just wanted to make sure you weren't using them interchangably as some do. (See: Vince Van Patten)

True, but I'm willing to gamble on enough of the probable calling stations coming along for the ride nonetheless.

Yeah it's probably not bad, and your implied odds are huge, and it's fun to suck out on those type of hands in big pots.

[ReadyEddie]

Ok got it, dont fold.

I cant believe people are suggesting not playing this preflop, or on the flop.

next time i'll just check call.

FWIW:
UTG+1: 86 /images/graemlins/club.gif for 2 pair
MP1: QT for the boat = (

[Solid_p]

Nice hand. You did everything right. With mp1 being short on cash on the river, I bet this. Otherwise check/call the river.

[bakku]

i don't see how it's even possible for you to fold the river after you've bet